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Ten Bills play for futures as season hits home stretch


Simpson, others playing for 2009 jobs? (buffalobills.com)

One may read the headline of this piece and think "Oh boy, Galliford's the latest to give up on the Buffalo Bills this season".  Though I might argue that - along with everyone else that's hopped off the bandwagon - we have good reason to doubt it, rest assured that's not the case.  So when (if?) you read this piece, read it with the knowledge that I am not denying that the Bills still have a shot at the playoffs.

Instead, I'll speak briefly about how I'm a guy that's constantly looking forward - just as many of you are.  I love watching football, but I also love the idea of building a roster; finding those ever-elusive pieces of a contending puzzle and fitting them together.  Whether the Bills make the playoffs this year or not, the 2008 season can now officially be considered in the home stretch with just six weeks to go.  Even if the Bills end their post-season drought, there are guys on this roster who should recognize the fact that they're playing for their jobs beyond this season.  Lighting a fire under these players could, in fact, give the team a spark heading into these ultra-important six games.

Those ten players, in no specific order...

QB Trent Edwards.  To answer your question, yes, I do hate putting Trent on this list.  In reality, I don't believe that Edwards is on the proverbial "hot seat" in any sense of the term when it comes to his status with this coaching staff.  But it's not hard to imagine a scenario where if Buffalo's quarterback continues to struggle as the season closes out, Bills fans will be calling for the team to begin a new quarterback search.  A nice, strong, confidence-boosting finish by Edwards would erase a lot of that potential.

WR Steve Johnson.  Stevie isn't going anywhere; it should be noted, then, that Johnson makes this list because he's playing for a much bigger role in 2009.  Johnson has seen his role increase of late, and while he hasn't been perfect, he's shown a pretty good rapport with Edwards.  He knows how to find a hole in a zone, and he's looked pretty good both as a run blocker and after the catch.  This kid has a future.  He and Josh Reed could wreak a lot of havoc underneath in 2009.

TE Robert Royal.  There are games where Royal looks like a highly competent tight end; those games, however, are few and far between.  Clearly, the Bills need an upgrade at tight end.  Royal is entering the final year of his deal next season.  He's one of a few Bills veterans that fall under the category of "most likely to get cut"; he is, quite literally, playing for a job in 2009.

OT Jason Peters.  I'm not one of the bandwagon fans who like to boo Peters every time he makes one little mistake.  Peters may not be as dominant as he was in 2007, when he was voted to his first Pro Bowl, but he's playing at a very high level.  He'll need to return to dominant form as the season closes if he expects to receive that fat contract extension he so desperately desires.

C Duke Preston.  Melvin Fowler, benched since early in the season, is a goner, as he's an unrestricted free agent after the season.  Problem is, so is Preston.  The Bills are expected to upgrade the center position from outside the organization, but Preston has a legitimate chance to be re-signed as the new guy's understudy.  He'll have to play better than he has in recent weeks, however.

DE Chris Kelsay.  Kelsay's contract runs out in 2010.  He hasn't been productive from an on-field standpoint.  There will come a time when Dick Jauron has to upgrade players he likes with players he likes and can win with.  Kelsay's contract, as most of you know, is gigantic (for a player his caliber).  I still have my doubts that Kelsay is a goner after the season, but his time as this team's starting left end is likely growing short.

DE Ryan Denney.  If Kelsay's not a goner, Denney is.  He's 31 years old and is scheduled to earn $2.4 million in base salaries alone next season - the final year of his deal.  That's too much money for a guy who, if the Bills upgrade the position, would be fourth or fifth in the rotation.

DT John McCargo.  He's been a healthy scratch, he's been traded, and he's been a healthy scratch again.  Motivation is McCargo's problem, and although he's under contract through the close of the 2010 season, it's hard to imagine a scenario in which McCargo returns to the Bills in 2009 after what he's gone through the past 8 months.  If McCargo sees the field again this season, he'll be playing for his next job in another NFL city.

CB Terrence McGee.  Hear me out on this one.  McGee is under contract through the end of next season.  He'll be 29 if he hits unrestricted free agency as scheduled.  Rookie corner Leodis McKelvin has come on strong, and it's hard to imagine a scenario where the Bills let Jabari Greer walk, as he's been the team's best defensive back this season (Greer is a UFA after this season).  Don't forget about Ashton Youboty and Reggie Corner, either.  Buffalo's cornerback spot is still crowded despite the injuries, and McGee is the toughest guy to figure into the team's future plans.  He'll need to perform to keep his status as this team's top cover man (and, for the record, he was excellent against Cleveland).

FS Ko Simpson.  Simpson has been juggled around a lot.  He missed the entire 2007 season with an ankle injury.  He's been semi-benched this season in order to move Donte Whitner to his free safety spot, sliding Bryan Scott into the starting lineup at strong safety (though he still plays more at free than any other safety on the team).  The Bills are deep at this position, but they lack playmakers.  If the Bills feel the need to add a play-making safety in the off-season to team with Whitner, it's clearly Simpson who'll be riding the pine or looking for employment elsewhere.

***

Feel free to add names to the list.  And on a side note, let's keep coaches out of this.  We've heard enough about everyone's opinions on Dick Jauron, and there are a million FanPosts in which you can vent about Buffalo's head coach if you feel inclined to do so.  This is about the roster.  Have at it, folks.

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I think:

1) steve johnson is going to eventually take over Josh Reed’s duties. Heck, next season it may be Evans, Reed, Johnson, with Hardy & Parrish as 4th/5th WR’s. We really need a threat to line up opposite Evans and I highly doubt Hardy is that guy.

2) Royal….has to be gone. I’ve been clamoring for a TE dating back to last off-season. It HAS to happen this off-season. Fine/Schouman are not what we need. They maybe valuable special teams players, but they are not the Pass-Catching TE we need

3) The defensive backfield is so intriguing. This makes sense that we have hit on a lot of these players being Jauron a former Pro-Bowl DB himself. I love Bryan Scott, and would to see him return. With Greer, McGee, Youboty, McKelvin, Corner, we are set for next year. Ko Simpson has got to go. He is slow as molasses and a terrible tackler.

4) The Kelsay/Denney combo has had a ridiculously long run, but it is time to cut the cord. I can’t stand another season of seeing are invisible DE’s.

5) I’ll love to see Fowler gone!

Let’s just do something stupid though first and go win 3 straight games, get to 8-5, and have @ NYJ, @ Den, and vs NE to close the season and see what our young team can do. They desperately need to play some meaningful games down the stretch here and MOST IMPORTANTLY…GET BETTER! For the love of God beat KC!

MARVelous

by MARVelous on Nov 21, 2008 8:59 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

WRs

Don’t see that Reed or Johnson will ever be able to be a #2 WR. Both are super in the slot (Johnson increasing towards Reed’s level). I think Hardy will get there, though it will take time.

by thefourwinds on Nov 21, 2008 9:07 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Mostly Agree...

My only exception is Hardy; It’s too early to give up on him. Clearly he and Trent have no rapport…which should get better in 2009.

Wholeheartedly agree that Kelsay/Denney have been around way too long. Ideally both will gone, but I’d take one in 2009 for the rotation. We need an inpact DE now…so I’d seriously look at FA. Ditto with center. Replace Fowler and Preston with a FA Center and a solid mid round prospect. I don’t even want to mention the TE position…it hurts too much to bring it up.

"They're Killin' Me Whitey. They're Killin' Me" -- Lou Saban

by NJBill on Nov 21, 2008 9:12 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Wow, the Bills are on ESPN's radar....

Must still be trying to milk their Monday Night Football broadcast. Unless the Bills win a few games, prepare for obscurity…again.

After reading Stewart’s comments, I like Cowher even more. Actually, I don’t see Jauron pulling Edwards this season, unless he becomes a danger to himself or others.

"They're Killin' Me Whitey. They're Killin' Me" -- Lou Saban

by NJBill on Nov 21, 2008 9:24 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

i don't

either seeing them #2, which is why the team will “hope” Hardy develops into that bc he is “their guy.” We obviously have to give him 3 years, but if we don’t have weapons for Trent soon, this offense is never going to get over the hump. We desperately need a playmaking WR and TE

MARVelous

by MARVelous on Nov 21, 2008 9:09 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I wonder if...

Kaisertown still wants to take me up on the bet that Johnson would overtake Hardy?

by krytime on Nov 21, 2008 9:14 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If I was a gambler...

Then this year…maybe. Next year, not a very safe bet. You need to check the statute of limitations on your wager.

"They're Killin' Me Whitey. They're Killin' Me" -- Lou Saban

by NJBill on Nov 21, 2008 9:27 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I wouldn’t take it again, but I already did. So I will stick to my guns and say that Johnson doesn’t make up the 3 or 4 catches that he still behind Hardy. My thought process when taking that bet was that when Reed returns to the lineup, than Johnson goes back to being largely irrelevant and I still think that is very possible.

by kaisertown on Nov 21, 2008 12:35 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It depends on when Reed comes back and in some one else goes down with injury. Right now if Reed comes back neither is getting too many chances.

The time has come for someone to put his foot down. And that foot is me.

by sireric on Nov 22, 2008 9:18 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

How about Dockery?

Gone after this season – Royal, Fowler, Denny, McCargo, Simpson.

Maybe gone after this season – If Preston is willing to sign for the league minimum, he might be worth keeping due to his versatility at sucking at multiple line positions, plus the fact he has those naked pics of Jauron and Levy. Kelsay is overpaid, but with the injury to Schobel and Ellis not making much noise, he could squeak out another year.

If Greer keeps playing like he has been and Leo finishes strong, I can see the Bills letting McGee go. After all, they have a history of not paying big $ to CBs.

by Joe P. on Nov 21, 2008 9:28 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Dockery’s not going anywhere. He’s in the second year of a seven-year deal.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 9:38 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not Guaranteed

Players are cut or deals are voided after a couple years due to salary cap or cost cutting measures all the time. TKO was let go for this reason (Also, past his prime). After Nate Clemens signed his ridiculous deal with SF, the talk was he would never play out the entire contract. The 49ers will eventually cut him or restructure his deal. So, how can you say Dockery and his large deal are not going anywhere? After Kelsay, Schobel, and Dock received huge deals, and have done little to be close to worth it, no one is safe.

by JTM1023 on Nov 21, 2008 11:24 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I didn’t guarantee it. But it’s been a long time since the Bills have cut a high-priced veteran. Dockery’s not past his prime, either. With the size of their contracts and how recently they were signed, the chances that Schobel and Dockery are released are practically nil.

Kelsay’s contract isn’t quite as extravagant, however, so while I don’t think the chances are great that he’s released, he’s got an infinitely better shot of it than the other two guys.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 11:27 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

See, I think it’s that very reason that the Bills don’t resign Greer. I would love for the Bills to resign Greer, but given the ridiculous nature of contracts for UFA CB’s, I’m pretty doubtful it will happen, even though he is without a doubt their best corner. McGee needs to play up on WR. He can’t change directions quickly enough, nor does he have the ball instincts to be able to play 7 yards off the ball. I think Greer is more physical, and more versatile so he can play both press coverage and off the receiver.

Johnson is coming along nicely. He certainly doesn’t deserve all the praise he’s getting over at BBMB, but as usual, that place is a haven for overreaction. I think next season you’ll see him spell Reed at times in the slot, but also get a shot at pushing Hardy as the #2 opposite Evans. Parrish, of course, will be a situational guy, regardless of how much he clamors for the ball more. Hey Roscoe, first, get open. Then, complain about not getting the ball.

I’d love to see Kelsay AND Denney gone, but given our lack of other options, that seems pretty unlikely. Denney might get cut, but given our love for unathletic, white defensive ends, he’ll prolly stick around another year.

McCargo is most likely gone after this season. Not sure how much longer they want that awkward situation brewing in the locker room.

I’m pretty disappointed with Ko. I really liked him coming out of college, and he showed flashes as a rookie. Not sure he’s the same after his ankle injury last year. He just doesn’t seem to have the same speed. And his tackling is horrendous, but so is everyone else’s on the team. He’ll prolly be back, given his experience, but I expect to see more Scott – Whitner next year.

I think they bring Preston back. He’ll be cheap (see: no one else would want him), he can play more than one position, and he’s a serviceable backup. The Bills need to address C pretty highly in the draft, and the Bills obviously know that.

Royal needs to go. It’s either me or him, Buffalo, take your pick. I’m not kidding. I can take wide right, I can take four super bowl losses, I can take 8 years without sniffing at the playoffs, I can take the home run throwforward, and the past two Monday Night games…but I CANNOT…repeat…CANNOT take one more season with Robert Royal. So there it is. Pick a side Buffalo, because I’ve drawn a line in the sand.

by thatguy34 on Nov 21, 2008 9:59 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Interesting point on Greer,

but Greer is not nearly as well known as McGee, plus McGee has a rep for being a great return man. Don’t you think Greer would be much cheaper to resign than McGee?

by Joe P. on Nov 21, 2008 10:15 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If they were both up for new contracts today, then yes. McGee is more well known, has more experience, and is an excellent returner. Asomugha will either sign a long term contract with Oakland or get franchised again, and that could make Greer one of the top CB’s on the market. Drayton Florence got a 6 year, 36 million dollar contract last year. Greer should expect to get at least that, possibly a touch more. I just don’t see the Bills paying that kind of money with McKelvin and McGee already making decent money at the CB position.

by thatguy34 on Nov 21, 2008 10:29 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Hard to argue with your logic

I really hate the idea of letting, arguably, our best CB walk out the door. It is not like we have a lot of good depth behind them.

by Joe P. on Nov 21, 2008 10:44 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I totally agree about Greer. I think your average Bills fan will be shocked at how much money Greer gets in FA this spring. If Randall Gay and Jacques Reeves can make over 4 mil a year despite being backups, then imagine what Greer can make on the open market.

by kaisertown on Nov 21, 2008 12:29 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If Preston is willing to sign for the league minimum, he might be worth keeping due to his versatility at sucking at multiple line positions

Good one!

by thefourwinds on Nov 21, 2008 3:41 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Right on the money with the gone selections.

Royal, Fowler, Denny, McCargo and Simpson. Although, Simpson might get another year depending on FA and the draft. Most disappointing to me is McCargo. Yes he is undersized but I did expect more. He is just too small to play DT. We can remember him as coming from a time when we drafted smurfs. Still say that at the right weight, he just might make a decent DE. The self motivation is his achilles heel.

Hardy will develop much faster IF they use him right. Simpson is slow and cannot tackle. Speaking of cannot tackle, if DJ is such a great teacher, why can’t we tackle in the secondary? Whitner is at the top of the list in needing to learn how. Some do well, but too many do not.

Kelsay survives due to depth concerns. Same with Preston. I would be happy with a draft that went DE, C, TE, DE, LB. A good pass rush will take this D to top tier status. Yes we neeed depth at LB, but we are close on D. I predict we look for a LB or two in FA.

It will be interesting to watch how OBD handles Peters. He has not played as dominating as last year, but he is, long term, our man. Will OBD give him a fat contract offseason? I doubt it until he shows up for all the offseason and preseason activities.

I sure hope we resign Greer, but who knows in this whacky FA market. Talent is a premium and Greer will be coveted. McGee, especially after watching him play up close man coverage against Cleveland, would shine in a man to man secondary. He’s a much better player when not playing zone. If our plan is to drop zone coverage in the secondary, then by all means lock up McGee. If we expect to make playoff runs in future years, continuity in the secondary is important.

Steve Johnson should be seen as the heir apparent to Josh Reed. He looks comfortable in the slot and at finding holes in coverage. Good write Brian.

everything goes better with bacon

by keuka121 on Nov 21, 2008 10:30 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I liked your views on this all together, especially on Stevie Johnson who I was promoting to Bills fans big time since day one as a huge steal for us because I viewed hin as the best big game clutch WR in college football last year, and he was ours to steal in the draft.

With Trent I feel that if there is’nt remarkable improvement with this team down the stretch and especially with Trent, that this coaching staff will be gone after the season(Hopefully not Bobby April)and Trent would then be not only on the hot seat competing for his job, but likely his ship will have sailed as the Bills starting QB.

by Fam_1st on Nov 21, 2008 10:45 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Fam, rest assured the coaching staff – at least, the vast majority of it – isn’t going anywhere.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 10:54 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Chris Ellis

Perhaps amazing to say, but I think Ellis might be cut. With all the opportunities that have been there for him (with Schobel out, a limited number of DEs in the roster, poor performances by Kelsey and Denny, being a high draft pick, playing a relatively easier position for a rookie to contribute (3rd down rusher), etc.), the organization seems to have no confidence in him at all (and he has shown nothing). He reminds me of that other DE we drafted in the 3rd round (the DE/LB from V Tech). — I think we released him after the 1st year.

by labill on Nov 21, 2008 10:47 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You reference Corey Moore.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 10:53 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I thought back then that Corey Moore was an enigma, with unbelievable pass rushing talent the way he played at VT and we would have a good shot at converting him to a rush linebacker similar to Derrick Thomas(that was the dream). But I remember he went home to Brownsville Tennessee and got in an altercation where I think he was shot in the leg, and that was it for him I think!

If there is a coaching change at the top, I would really hope that Bobby April is not over looked as a candidate for the job.

by Fam_1st on Nov 21, 2008 10:58 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Again… not going to be a coaching change.

Don’t recall that story about Corey Moore, either.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 11:01 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No, true story. Got shot in the leg in the off season. He ended up rehabbing and making it to training camp that year, but eventually got cut.

by thatguy34 on Nov 21, 2008 11:06 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Ha, wow, didn’t remember that at all.

For the record, I believed Fam_1st – just couldn’t recall that story for the life of me. :)

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 11:11 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yep I remember it when it was on ESPN the moning he was shot in the leg, I t just said he was in his hometown of Brownsville Tennessee and shot in the leg and that honestly was all I heard about it. I think Corey Moore had like 22 sacks in a single season in college at somewhere around 218 lbs.

by Fam_1st on Nov 21, 2008 11:07 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

With the possibility of an ownership change taking place sometime in the near future as the main reason why I would’nt think there would be a coaching change untill after the change is final, I think if not for that looming in the near future, if we did’nt at least better our record from last season, that it’s time that change is made.

by Fam_1st on Nov 21, 2008 11:12 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Corey Mace. All 6-0, 215 lbs of him. His biggest claim to fame was going to the same school as Bruce Smith.

by thatguy34 on Nov 21, 2008 10:57 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Damn it!

I knew I was going to do that. I kept saying Corey Moore, Corey Moore, Corey Moore, and then I typed Mace. Son of a…

by thatguy34 on Nov 21, 2008 10:58 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not Quite

Moore was a stud in college. Two time Big East defensive player of the year, he won the Lombadi award and the Bronco Nagerski award, he had 31 sacks combined in his final 2 years at Virginia Tech.

He was drafted in John Butler’s final year. after that year Butler was fired and Tom Donahoe was hired, and he and Gregg Williams changed the defense from a 3-4 to a 4-3, which didn’t fit Moore’s strengths. If the Bills had stuck with the 3-4, Moore would have been an OLB in the Cornelius Bennett mould.

The time has come for someone to put his foot down. And that foot is me.

by sireric on Nov 22, 2008 9:47 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It’s way to early to be talking about Chris Ellis being cut. He is under contract so he will definitely be back in camp next year and giving his decent draft status and cheap contract, he will be given every opportunity to make the team next year. This is a conversation to save until the preseason games start up in mid August of 09.

by kaisertown on Nov 21, 2008 12:40 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Exactly

Ellis is cheap. Why cut him except for the roster spot?

by MattRichWarren on Nov 21, 2008 3:07 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What is it about bust DEs from VaTech?

Does OBD think VaTech is magically going to have a reincarnation of Bruce Smith?

by thefourwinds on Nov 21, 2008 3:44 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

We would I hope at the very least if Ellis really showed that lil promise to the coaching staff, try and trade Ellis for a late draft pick as im sure there will be some brash coach out there who believes he’s the one who can light a fire in Ellis. I really have no idea with Ellis other than he must be similar to McCargo in that he’s loaded with potential, but is to lazy to harness it.

On our Corner situation, I really hope that we can keep all 5 of our corners together for a while, I think that there is a possibility of us having a new coaching staff in here, and that could mean us playing more man coverage which I think would much better lend to the strengths of our secondary as a whole!

by Fam_1st on Nov 21, 2008 10:53 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Hire a real general manager

How long should it take to build a defensive line? How long should it take to build a good group of linebackers? How long should it take to build a good group of wide recievers? How long should it take to find a tight end? I think it can be done within 15 years if we hire a real general manager.

by gjv on Nov 21, 2008 10:57 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Butler was a fairly good GM in some ways, but since him there has’nt been anyone other than Marv who I think the fans could believe in. It goes back to Bill Polian and the differences he and Ralph had and that hurt this franchise in a lot of ways. I’ve always remained a Bills fan and could never ever change that no matter what, Bill Polian is my uncle, or will be after im married to his neice and the fact that some people in my soon to be in-laws family are actually bitter still. Im going to the Chiefs game on sunday and my girlfriend Chrissy is going with me and she said when I asked her to go with me that it’s kinda hard for her to root on the Bills(she’s a colts fan). There’s no converting me-Switching was never option for me.

by Fam_1st on Nov 21, 2008 11:20 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What about Schobel?

I know he has a bad foot injury this season, but what has he really contributed since his latest contract upgrade? If you want to get rid of Kelsay and Denney, Schobel should be listed as well for kind of the same reasons. At least we get an interception or 2 from Kelsay.

by JTM1023 on Nov 21, 2008 11:17 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Schobel is held in pretty high regard by the coaching staff. If we had a guy who could help Schobel out from the other side, he’d still be pretty good, because teams wouldn’t be able to double team him anymore. Aaron’s not going anywhere.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 11:18 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Plus

his run stats have been great recently. He never missed games until this year so it’s an enigma perhaps. They will keep Schobel.

by MattRichWarren on Nov 21, 2008 3:08 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

My 2 cents worth...

No way that Trent Edwards should be on this list, even with the intro you gave! The play-calling has been horrendously bad and the main reason for the 4 game slide.

Royal=Out, we need to draft a good pass-catching TE (there are no great TE that will be UFA)
Fowler/Preston=out, Matt Birk is a UFA in the off season and I hope the Bills go after him hard. Otherwise we draft one I guess but I’d much prefer getting a veteran with experience. Look at the impact that Kevin Mawae is having for the titans
Kelsay=out, not sure about Denney. He is extremely stout against the run.
McGee, I see your point Brian. I think is McKelvin finishes the season strong then McGee is probably on the outside looking in.
McCargo=out

by keysh67 on Nov 21, 2008 11:40 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I never said McGee would be on the outside looking in. McKelvin’s going to be here a while, though, and McGee/Greer/Youboty all have contracts up in the next year or two. They’ve got some decisions to make between those three vets, and McGee’s status is loftiest of the three, but he’s also been the most inconsistent. Going to be interesting regarding him, but as I said, he played very well Monday night.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 11:44 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

take it easy buddy!

I said that I saw your point. The rest was me.
Take it easy man, you seem on edge today!

by keysh67 on Nov 21, 2008 11:49 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I unintentionally came across that way. Trust me, I’m as mellow as ever. My response wasn’t accusatory, it was explanatory. :)

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 12:31 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Matt Birk is available??

IF they can get Matt Birk, that would certainly be an upgrade. Sign Birk and draft his replacement to develop. You develop great lines, not sign them in free agency. Birk is the bridge.

by MattRichWarren on Nov 21, 2008 3:09 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I agree

Drafting a young stud and having him learn behind a vet like Birk would be excellent.

Birk will be an Unrestricted Free Agent in 2009, I seriously doubt that the Vikes wouldn’t lock him up but you never know… If the Bills want him enough they could probably get him.

by keysh67 on Nov 21, 2008 8:02 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He’ll need to perform to keep his status as this team’s top cover man (and, for the record, he was excellent against Cleveland).

Really? He was on Edwards the whole game allowing the 8 catches and 100+ yards. Sure, when he manned him up, he was very good. When he backed off, it was pitch and catch for the Browns. If you are saying that McGee played well here, then you absolutely have to blame Fewell for the results.

~K

by Kurupt on Nov 21, 2008 12:18 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

CHRIS KELSAY MUST GO! What a useless player that does nothing in the run game and even less trying to rush the passer. I would still love to here an explanation for why he was not only resigned, but resigned to such a ridiculous contract. Was there even one Bills fan happy with that??

Ko Simpson probably needs to go to, or at least be in a backup role only. He just isn’t very good and hasn’t really shown anything in his time in Buffalo. Just a mediocre player, who is a terrible tackler.

~K

by Kurupt on Nov 21, 2008 12:20 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Amazing

That Keith Ellison’s name is not coming out anymore (he would have been in the top three on Brian’s list a few weeks ago). There seems to have been a revision to his reputation. I disagree — he should be gone.

by labill on Nov 21, 2008 12:33 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I disagree with being gone. Out of the starting lineup? Absolutely. But Keith can back up at any LB position, and he’s great on special teams. Good teams have those types of players, and Ellison is pretty selfless. I think he’s very much a valuable part of this team’s future plans.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 12:45 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Plus, he’s got that sweet lookin face mask.

And by sweet, I mean ridiculous.

by thatguy34 on Nov 21, 2008 1:04 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

LOL. Jason Peters’ is worse.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 1:16 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

McKelvin is already showing flashes of how good he is going to be, I think Greer will re-sign in Buffalo for 4-5 mil a year, which is worth it, if we finish the season strong. Strong playoff contenders have three talented, starter material corners and we should too. There is nothing wrong with locking up Greer and going into 2009 with McGee Greer and McKelvin as our 3 CBs. Once McGee starts to age, McKelvin will be ready to be our number 1 guy. As someone mentioned, continuity in the secondary is going to be important to our playoff runs.

Kelsay and Schobel aren’t going anywhere, Denney is gone. We draft a DE in the first round and have him rotate with Kelsay. We can’t just dump our DEs because we have no depth whatsoever.

Goodbye Ko, I thought you were going to be good, I thought the future was Simpson -Whitner I was wrong. But you know what, I don’t think we have to worry about safety as a priority in the off-season. I think Scott-Whitner could be one of our strengths.

I agree with labill, Ellison should be gone. Everyone is talking about how impressive hes been and I counldn’t agree less. The run by Harrison (or whatever the Browns spell back is) if I remember correctly it was Ellison who couldn’t make the initial tackle that led to the break out. I just plain don’;t think Ellison is good. I know everyone says linebackers are easy to draft but forget that. I think we should draft a DE, maybe George Selvie if we can trade up, but that OLB is what we should go after in free agency. With names like Eric Barton (who could tell us all about the Jets), Karlos Dansby, and Terrell Suggs going to be on the open market we can make a major upgrade here.

Finally, we have center of course. The problem here is that there don’t appear to be many centers going to be hitting the free agent market. Matt Birk has potential because the Vikings recently drafted a center and may want to put him in the lineup. If Birk is available snatch him up and draft a center in the 2nd. If he’s not then we have to keep Preston and draft and hope for the best

Goodbye Robert Royal and good riddance. Draft a rookie in the 2nd or 3rd and throw him in. Thats that.

Kawika Mitchell is a leader. He will help this young team develop.

by poz on Nov 21, 2008 1:18 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Judging by the post I threw up one minute later than yours, I agree with a lot of that. Here is what I don’t agree with:

4 mil for Greer is way too optimistic. Gay and Reeves got 4 mil by being solid nickel corners on good teams. Greer will get around 30 mil in FA and at least 5 a year.

I’m with Brian, Ellison is a solid backup and special teamer who, as a restricted free agent, will come at a very reasonable price next year. There is a difference between guys who shouldn’t start and guys who shouldn’t be on the roster.

Terrell Suggs isn’t a linebacker. He weighs 260 pounds and will be signed as a 3-4 rush linebacker or DE in a 4-3.

I think Robert Royal comes back next year and you can read my post below to see why it is that I think that.

by kaisertown on Nov 21, 2008 1:31 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

While 4 mil for Greer may be optimistic you dont think there is a chance if we finish strong and offer him 5 mil a year that Greer doesn’t want to stay in Buffalo for less money to be a part of this rising squad? With Asomugha, Dunta Robinson and Chris Gamble all set to hit the market he may not find as good a deal as many think.

You are right, I correct myself on Ellison, there is definitely a difference between a guy who shouldnt start and a guy who shouldnt be on the roster. I relinquish that point. And good point on Suggs

I read your points about Royal but lets go a bit deeper to whether he stays on as a starter. If we dont draft a TE in the first three rounds I will vomit. Do you think hes starting next year?

We agree on a lot but I am really really really hoping for a change at TE.

Kawika Mitchell is a leader. He will help this young team develop.

by poz on Nov 21, 2008 1:43 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I really, really hope Royal isn’t anything more than a backup who sees a little game action here and there. Whether or not Royal will still be starting week one of next year is anyone’s guess.

I do think 5 mil is realistic for Greer. Something along the lines of a 5 or 6 year deal worth 25-30 mil with 6-8 as a signing bonus and a salary of a little over 3 mil would be my guess.

by kaisertown on Nov 21, 2008 3:34 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

and...

in your estimation is he worth the money? I think he is, in many ways, more valuable over the next three years than McGee. As for right now, I love Greer but I still don’t buy that hes our best corner. McGee has been hobbled much of the year, fact is, he’s a gamer and has been one of the most reliable pieces of our defense over the seasons.

Kawika Mitchell is a leader. He will help this young team develop.

by poz on Nov 21, 2008 3:47 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I’m not sure whether or not he is worth the money. I think I would give him 5, but I don’t know if I could go to 6. I’ll be happy if the team resigns him, but won’t be that dissapointed if he hits the market and cashes in bigtime somewhere else. It’s definitely a topic we will all be talking about from January through March.

by kaisertown on Nov 21, 2008 9:05 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Poz is that a typo? If Birk is available, you want to get him AND draft a center in the 2nd round? Seems like it would be unnecessary to draft a C that high if we grab Birk (which, is highly unlikely).

by thatguy34 on Nov 21, 2008 1:39 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I was thinking

to draft his replacement. Guy is getting old, cant be too ready to groom a replacement, but yes, 2nd may be too soon.

Kawika Mitchell is a leader. He will help this young team develop.

by poz on Nov 21, 2008 1:44 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

2nd is too soon...

Saturday was an Undrafted free agent and some of the best OL are late rounders who were developed. Pick a guy in the 5th and develop him behind Birk to take over.

by MattRichWarren on Nov 21, 2008 3:12 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

oh man

you are an evil person you know that! What an awful thought!!!!!

Kawika Mitchell is a leader. He will help this young team develop.

by poz on Nov 21, 2008 3:39 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He’s probably not a top 10 pick at this point anyhow. He’s been injured and not as good as last year. Probably somewhere in the teens at this point….perfect for us

~K

by Kurupt on Nov 22, 2008 12:39 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Contracts and Guys who might and won't get cut

I’ll start with the won’ts:

Aaron Schobel – he is only scheduled to make 3.5 mil next year so he is almost something of a bargain. There is a zero percent chance of Schobel not being on this team in 09. He is going to make over 6 mil in 2010-2012 and over 8 mil in 2013 and certainly won’t play out his entire contract.

Chris Kelsay – His 4 year 23 million contract extension is huge in hindsight (and at the time), but the Bills have already paid 16 mil of it. Kelsay will make about 3 mil next year and and a little under 4 in 2010. I highly doubt he doesn’t make the team next year.

Robert Royal – Sorry guys, but I think he is better than Derek Schouman and I get the feeling that OBD agrees with me. He is only making about 1.5 mil in salary each of the next two years and I think he makes the team (hopefully as a veteran backup) next season.

Derrick Dockery – I know he is overpaid, but he is too solid for the Bills to cut. It’s that simple.

Here are the mights:

Ryan Denney – He is entering the last year of his contract and is scheduled to make 2.4 mil next year. The price tag isn’t too high, but it is substantial enough that if he becomes part of a numbers crunch (highly likely) then he better have a great training camp and preseason.

Ko SImpson – Hear me out on this one. He is a bargain at about 500K next year and makes for a very solid backup. But if the Bills draft a safety in the early rounds to pair with Whitner and keep Bryan Scott around then that will lead to quite the roster crunch. If April gets his way and the team keeps Wilson and Wendling around next year, there just might not be any room on the roster for Simpson next season. It’s unlikely and there are a lot of IFs involved, but it is definitely possible.

The too soon to tells:

John McCargo – Still has two years left on his very reasonable rookie contract. He will make a little over 800K next year and under 700K in 2010. He will certainly be on the roster come training camp time (barring a trade) so everything will depend on whether or McCargo can show up motivated and in shape. His attitude and performance in practice and the preseason will be the only determining factor on whether or not he makes the team next year.

by kaisertown on Nov 21, 2008 1:19 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

you really think they keep McCargo

after trading him during the season and making him inactive for all these games? I just don’t see it. If they were going to keep him, he would have played against Jamal Lewis and the Browns

by MattRichWarren on Nov 21, 2008 3:13 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He is under contract so they won’t just cut him during the offseason. If they can get a draft pick for him they might try and move him on draft day, but why would you just cut a guy during the offseason when you can keep 80 guys until mid-August? I think the Bills will give McCargo an offseason to get himself in shape and see if he can show up for OTAs ready to make a difference. He is definitely a candidate to get cut next fall, but what do the Bills gain by doing it before then?

by kaisertown on Nov 21, 2008 3:28 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I'm going to go out on a limb and say...

I doubt Robert Royal is a goner. Why? The staff apparently loves him, and you’d think they’d have done away with him before this season. It baffles the mind.

I continue to think the Bills tend to ignore the players that the majority of pundits/other NFL execs covet. Not sure why, but it appears to be a trend. Look at Dan Connor in last year’s draft as an example. He was a steal and I think they drafted Fine instead of him.

The team absolutely needs to find a good FB. Owen Schmitt, what could have been.

DE needs to be a priority. The other 3 starting QBs in the division (Brady being the obvious problem) are too experienced and talented for this current crop of farm boys. Without that talent, they will continue to fall to Brady, Favre, and Pennington, with their quick release and uncanny ability to make the best things happen.

by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 21, 2008 1:31 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Dan Connor went 58 picks before Fine did. He has been active for three games this year for Carolina and has 4 tackles. He fell in the draft for a reason and let’s be happy the Bills didn’t try and find a steal with him.

by kaisertown on Nov 21, 2008 1:35 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I didn’t recall when he was drafted. In his defense, making an impact on the Panthers D is harder to do than it would be for a number of other teams.

All players are a reach in the draft. There’s no guarantee on anyone. I was basing it off of the Bills proclivity to do the opposite of what most other teams would do.

Would Hardy make a better TE, if he put on some lbs?

by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 21, 2008 1:42 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Well Hardy would have to put on 35-40 pounds (at the very least) and who knows what kind of player he would be if he added all that weight.

by kaisertown on Nov 21, 2008 3:35 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Well Connor’s injured for the year so we can’t say he only has 4 tackles on his own accord! It’s a physical sport and with saying that it’s like saying Brady’s no good because he has’nt done anything this season.

by Fam_1st on Nov 21, 2008 2:08 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I didn’t realize he got hurt. He was still third on the depth chart when he went down and only had a handful of special teams tackles in the few games he did play. He won’t end up being considered some late round steal after dropping into the third round.

by kaisertown on Nov 21, 2008 3:30 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

WR Steve Johnson
He knows how to find a hole in a zone, and he’s looked pretty good both as a run blocker and after the catch. This kid has a future. He and Josh Reed could wreak a lot of havoc underneath in 2009.

I don’t see them doing it together. It’s one or the other, possible replacement type of deal.

TE Robert Royal
he is, quite literally, playing for a job in 2009.

As a backup on what team?

DE Chris Kelsay. Kelsay’s contract, as most of you know, is gigantic.

DE Ryan Denney. If Kelsay’s not a goner, Denney is.

We know one of them is gone. Both of them blew contain last week and do it often. I’d be happier cutting Kelsay, starting Denney for none/part/half the year and letting Ellis take over if he’s the guy. I can see both of them being back but on a reworked (i.e. extended) salary where they would be cheaper next year.

I could do this for every player on your list except McCargo who already was gone but as you accurately described he is playing for his next job anyways. Spot on Brian, as always.

What about Derrick Dockery, Jason Whittle, etc. Are those guys really safe at the guard positions?

by MattRichWarren on Nov 21, 2008 3:03 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Whittle’s a UFA, and enough of a fringe player that the team can let him go or re-sign him at will. Not important enough for this list.

Dockery isn’t going anywhere, as I’ve mentioned in other comments on this article.

Why can’t the Bills have two slot receivers?! Having Johnson and Reed on the field frequently could be devastating enough to take a defender away from Evans’ deep routes. Do what works.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 3:10 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

free agent linemen...

really irritate me most of the time. These are guys who should be developed like Jeff Saturday, Jason Peters, and other late round picks that become great line players. I hear you on Dockry but I don’t like him. How much of his contract is guarenteed??

If the Bills don’t get a new TE, I like the two slot recievers option…. doesn’t Roscoe then become expendable???? having four guys ahead of him on the WR chart doesn’t bode well for him. I like replacing the TE with a WR on third downs and having four wide with a guy in the backfield so I see that as a possibility.

by MattRichWarren on Nov 21, 2008 3:16 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No, it doesn’t eradicate the need for Roscoe. He’s never going to be an acceptable, consistent option as a slot receiver. But the dude can play. He’s the best punt returner in the game, and there are more ways to get him the ball offensively than the Bills have currently explored.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 4:13 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Why not

Why not use Roscoe the same way Carolina uses Steve Smith?

by gjv on Nov 21, 2008 5:51 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Because Roscoe Parrish doesn’t have the sheer physical strength of Steve Smith. They’re not the same type of player.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 6:15 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

How do you know that?

by gjv on Nov 21, 2008 6:20 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

They are the same height and Smith weighs 15 pounds more than Roscoe. Plus the results speak for themselves, Parrish has had enough opportunities that the coaches would have noticed if he could play anything like Steve Smith by now.

by kaisertown on Nov 21, 2008 6:32 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Parrish has not had the same opportunities

Since he has joined the Bills Parrish has been a slot reciever. On occation he played wide out. He has never had the opportunity to master the wide out routes. At Miami he made a name for himself as a wide out. He was the reciever that stretched the defense.

by gjv on Nov 21, 2008 8:14 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

While Parrish hasn’t had the same opportunities as Smith has, this is his fourth year in the league and he has started more than a couple of games. I just think that he has taken so many reps in practice, training camp, preseason games and regular season games that if he was anywhere near as talented a WR as Steve Smith was then the coaches would have noticed a long time ago.

by kaisertown on Nov 21, 2008 9:07 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

LOL well, I’ve seen the two play. Steve Smith is one of the best wideouts in the game – I’d put him in the same class as Anquan Boldin and TO here – at breaking tackles. The guy is a bull. Just watch him play. Parrish isn’t that type of guy; if he’s wrapped up, he’s done.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 22, 2008 8:51 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

HAHA. SOrry, but this question just reminds me of the Chad Johnson/Marvin Lewis posts on Kissing Suzy Kolber. Look it up if you have to

~K

by Kurupt on Nov 23, 2008 2:04 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

When was the last time

When was the last time our defense faced third and eight and you felt good that our front four would sack the QB ? Instead we sit there and hope the OB screws up or the reciever drops the pass. Every defensive lineman on your list including Schoebel is nothing more than a back up. In some cases an over paid back up. For to long we have accepted mediocrity. None of them is worth keeping in a starting role.

by gjv on Nov 21, 2008 6:01 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

For to long we have accepted mediocrity.

I submit that this is the second-most overused phrase by Bills fans. Right behind “billieve”.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 21, 2008 6:17 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Perhaps the phrase fits.

by gjv on Nov 21, 2008 6:22 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Never said it didn’t. Either of them.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 22, 2008 8:52 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The Goners, The Stayers, and the Who Knowers

Goners
Denney- its him or Kelsay, but Kelsay has more contract time, Denney goes and we draft a new guy.
McCargo- After this season’s saga, he gets traded by draft day, or cut soon after to make room for a rookie
Simpson- Scott is making him very expendable, and he has not shown himself much of a Speical Teams guy, so I think they cut bait and let him go.

The Stayers
Kelsay- too much money and too many years to go for the Bills to admit yet he needs to go, besides, we can only toss one bum a season from this spot till we get enough decent players in it.
Edwards- Starting QB, will have another 2 seasons of DJ pulling for him barring unforseen issues.
Johnson- Could become an even better version of Reed, taller and bigger, seems to have the same sort of instincts to find the soft spots in zone, auto keeper, and could be used alot soon in two slot setups with Reed if Turk pays attention.
McGee- Will play out his contract, but the Bills will wait to offer another extension till near the end of next season. He needs to show he can still cover guys and is not injury prone.
Preston- He stays, he is cheap, can play mutliple positions, not well, but play them. He will be the bridge to our Rookie C we draft next season. I think Birk will cost to much for the Bills to be willing to pay to get him.

Who Knowers
Greer- Who knows what will happen, but I have a feeling we see him hit UFA and someone will give him 30+mil to play for them, and the Bills will gameble with a setup of McGee, McKelvin, and Youbuty/Corner. But the Bills also may pull a surprise and bag him for another 4-5 seasons.
Royal- As much as I would like to see his fumbling, bumbling butt gone, the Bills will probably hold onto him, and will not even draft someone to get his sorry rear-end gone. For whatever pathetic reason, they think he is the Bees-Knees at OBD, and we won’t see him leave till his contract it is up.

Fear the mighty helmet wearing gopher, he is coming for your soul....

by WABillsfan on Nov 21, 2008 6:34 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If we get rid of Denney....

I hope whoever replaces him knows how to stay at home and contain.

by jj24 on Nov 22, 2008 10:49 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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