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Bills need mentality adjustment defensively


Stroud, select teammates need more help (buffalobills.com)

We know what the hot-button topics are surrounding the Buffalo Bills these days. Everywhere we turn - including right here at Buffalo Rumblings - the popular topics of discussion are Dick Jauron, the front office, the Bills' general suckitude, and, unsurprisingly, how to fix the team's ailments. Draft talk, depressingly, has already sprung up here. As distressing as that fact is, I'm taking the plunge and diving into the "how to fix the Bills" posts. But as a fair warning, this might be the last time you see this type of post out of me for a while.

In my humble opinion, the Buffalo Bills need a facelift defensively. Take a look at the NFL this year - the best teams in the league this year, if they're anything, are physical, both on the field and in their mindset. Tennessee's got a brutal defense and a run-oriented offensive scheme. The same can be said for Pittsburgh, the Giants and Carolina. Baltimore's defense has them sitting pretty in the AFC. Dallas has revived their season thanks to some outstanding defensive performances. Big, physical defenses are the big winners in today's NFL, and the Bills would do well to get themselves one of those.

Don't get me wrong - I like the Tampa 2 defense (or whatever y'all like to call it these days). I like a lot of the players the Bills use defensively. But let's face it - Buffalo's defense is consistently mediocre. Yeah, they do enough to win - and in reality, it's tough to ask for much more - but they're so close to being a borderline dominant unit; this off-season will provide the Bills some unique opportunities to make that leap.

Changes I'd make
Yeah, this post is a little self-indulgent. I realize that the chances of these moves happening seem pretty remote. I care not at this point - the Bills are 1-7 in their last eight. I'm going to talk about what I want to talk about.

Step 1: Get bigger. That's what she said. This was a goal last off-season, manifested by the trade for Marcus Stroud and the free agent signing of Kawika Mitchell. It has helped morph the Bills' run defense from a terrible one into an average one; it's a start. It needs to be a goal once again.

When Dick Jauron coached in Chicago, his defense was outstanding. Why? Because he had two enormous defensive tackles in Ted Washington and Keith Traylor, and he drafted a gigantic middle linebacker - Brian Urlacher - to play behind them. That defense was the driving force behind Chicago's 13-3 season, and it wasn't bad during their poor seasons, either. I'm not saying Jauron should be back or anything like that, so please don't take your comments in that direction, but his philosophy in building that defense is perfect for Buffalo. I pine for more size up the middle of our defense.

That's why draft prospects like Boston College DT B.J. Raji (6'1", 323), Alabama DT Terrence Cody (6'4", 375) and USC LB Brian Cushing (6'3", 253) are, to me, ideal for the Bills. They're big players, they're athletic enough to play in the current scheme we employ, and, most importantly, they give the Bills schematic flexibility. Segue...

Step 2: Make schematic flexibility a priority. Many Bills fans pine for the days when the Bills ran a far more effective 3-4 scheme. I'm right there with you, folks. Franchises like Pittsburgh are able to play consistent football every year because they employ schemes that makes finding talent easier, and the 3-4 fits that rule. It's far easier to find a pure pass rusher who can cover a tight end occasionally than it is to fit the same type of player into a 4-3 scheme. It just is. The Bills have several players right now who have the talent to play in any scheme.

New England is the shining example of giving multiple looks week in and week out defensively, even though they play a 4-3. How terrifying would a front three of Stroud, Cody and Kyle Williams look on run plays next season? The missing piece, of course, is that ever-elusive pass-rush artist. You're well aware that "one of those" needs to be a priority this off-season.  It may even be "two of those" or "three of those".

Note that I am not saying "switch to the 3-4". As I said, I like the Tampa 2 (even though I think we're a more traditional 4-3 this season), and I like being able to mix zone and man coverages. I like switching between four-man and three-man fronts, and getting athletes on the edges, whether they're down in a stance or standing up. I like applying pressure defensively, rather than limiting big plays. Simply stated, I want more guys on this team who can do a variety of things.

Step 3: Make the D a priority this off-season. Spare me the talk that we need to fix our offense, because offense doesn't win championships. We need to strive for competency and consistency on that side of the ball. People tend to forget that we have a very young offense as well. Looking at the roster, it's pretty clear that though we have holes at tight end and center, there's more young talent to work with on that side of the ball. We need help pretty much everywhere defensively.

Obviously, we need more impact at defensive end. Our DT rotation is only three-deep, and who knows how long it is until Stroud will be considered "over the hill"? Our linebacker depth has been a problem for two years. Despite drafting three cornerbacks and signing another last off-season, potential free agent departures (Jabari Greer) and injuries (Ashton Youboty) still make that position a question mark. Donte Whitner's a mainstay at safety, but he's unremarkable, and we need more help there, too. Depth is an issue everywhere defensively, and we need more playmakers.

***

There. I feel a little better. I've wanted to get this off my chest for a week or so now. I don't care whether Dick Jauron is coaching this team next year or not, a philosophical change defensively is needed. We need to be bigger, tougher, more athletic and a touch deeper. We need a mentality adjustment.  We need playmakers. We need impact. The offense, as pathetic as they've been at times this season, has room to grow. I fear with our current personnel that the defense has peaked. It needs to be addressed.

So as you're gathering your thoughts for the just-around-the-corner off-season, bear this in mind: size matters. Aggressiveness matters. The Bills have a golden opportunity to put together a hard-hitting, physical, flexible defense this off-season. There are building blocks, but I positively salivate when I see some of the names available this off-season. Vote defense this off-season, folks. An attitude adjustment is the biggest change needed for the Bills as a team this off-season, and the easiest spot to do it is on defense.

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I'm wondering, Brian...

how do you feel about Taylor Mays/Rey Maualaga (sp?)?

Or, and this is quite possible, do you think either/both of them will be gone before we are picking anyway?

by nickfeely8 on Dec 18, 2008 10:01 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

p.s.

I love this post. I’m in total agreement that the offense can (and I believe will) have some semblance of consistency and improvement next season, but that we need to start modeling the ravens/steelers/giants, etc. and focus on the defensive end. Obviously, there are a lot of cliches to throw out there about “defense wins championships” and all of that good stuff, but honestly, there is no substitute for an intimidating and dominant defense.

by nickfeely8 on Dec 18, 2008 10:06 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

honestly, there is no substitute for an intimidating and dominant defense

EXACTLY.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 10:09 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Honestly, there is no substitute for an elite quarterback.

An elite quarterback (not coaching, scheme, or defense) gives you the best chance to consistently compete, year after year, at a high level. Put the 2009 Trent Edwards on the 2008 Bills roster, and the Bills could be playoff contenders right now. So in that regard, I agree that the offense needs more experience, particularly at quarterback, than it needs new personnel. New personnel is needed on defense, especially on the defensive line. In general, if Edwards is the real deal, the Bills will be fine.

1. Team versatility (and scheme flexibility) allows you to adjust to your advantage based on your opponent, style, individual matchups, game situation, weather, etc. and improves your chances at success.

2. The game is more about the players than it is about the plays. I’ll take players over coaches, scheme, and playcalling every time. Great plays don’t make great players; great players make great plays.

Brian: Where have I heard these two things before? Are you just now starting to come around?
Yes, I was wrong all along about Edwards/Losman.

Great plays don't make great players; great players make great plays.

by Fort Worth on Dec 18, 2008 1:48 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Brian: Where have I heard these two things before? Are you just now starting to come around?

You heard them from your own mouth, and I was unaware I ever needed to come around on your first point. :)

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 1:52 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

LOL!

I incorrectly speculated that nobody else, including you, agreed with me on those items because I was the only one on this blog at the time driving home those two points, among other things.

Great plays don't make great players; great players make great plays.

by Fort Worth on Dec 18, 2008 1:55 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Haha, “other things” being “Losman > Edwards”. You might remember that I backed Losman for most of last year, too. We’ll never live that one down.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 2:00 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

"other things"

I wanted DRC, you wanted Rucker…LMAO!

Great plays don't make great players; great players make great plays.

by Fort Worth on Dec 18, 2008 2:02 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

LOL uh, dude, I wanted Rucker in January. I wanted Devin Thomas in April!

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 2:03 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer aren’t elite QBs. Heck, neither isnt Jake Delhomme or nor was Rex Grossman. What they all have in common though is the fact that they play on teams with dominant defenses and they limited mistakes to get them to (or win) the Super Bowl. While yes, Tom Brady and Payton Manning have been successful in carrying their teams on their backs to the big game, it isn’t the only way to get there and frankly, we can’t afford drafting QB after QB every couple years looking for this type of player, especially with the needs this team has.

by sabre74kkn on Dec 18, 2008 3:31 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

One and done.

How often have the Bucs, Ravens, Panthers, and Bears legitimately contended for the Super Bowl since their one glory year? I’m not interested in contending for just one year. I want to contend for (and win) the Super Bowl consistently year after year (as I mentioned). An elite quarterback provides the best chance at achieving that.

Great plays don't make great players; great players make great plays.

by Fort Worth on Dec 18, 2008 11:31 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

At this point, I’ll take contending for a playoff spot nearly every season like those teams do. It’s better than the 10 year cycle we’ve got in place now. Anything is. Only a handful of teams have contended for the Super Bowl for the past 5 years (Colts, Pats, Seahawks until this year, Steelers?).

~K

by Kurupt on Dec 19, 2008 12:25 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It’s impossible to project out draft positions at this point, so I won’t make an attempt. But if I had to guess, both of the USC guys you mentioned will be gone.

I like Taylor Mays a lot – I think he’s the type of playmaker we need in our defensive backfield – but so help me football gods if the Bills draft another DB in the first round…

I like Maualuga a lot too, but I don’t view him much differently than I do the other “big” linebackers, Cushing, Curry and Laurinaitis. Cushing is my favorite; I think he’s going to be a terrific pro. He’s the type of guy that can play inside or outside, no matter the scheme. He’s also the best out of this group in coverage.

But Raji and Cody (if he comes out) are my guys. If I were GM, and one of those two were available when I picked, I’d throw out every other name, because those guys are going to be awesome. We need impact along the D-Line first and foremost this year. If I got either of those guys in the first, I’d supplement it with an edge rusher that can put his hand in the dirt or stand up. That’s the flexibility I want.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 10:08 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You think both of those guys are top 10?

~K

by Kurupt on Dec 18, 2008 1:04 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Raji and Cody? No. Mays? Yes. Curry should be Top 10, and maybe Maualuga, but that’s it on the linebackers.

I’d LOVE to see us trade down this year, and given the sheer amount of talent at the top of this draft, it’s entirely plausible.

Is there a particular reason you asked this question? :)

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 1:06 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I meant that question for the USC guys….

Mays, really? Hmmm

IF we were smart enough to trade down and get more picks…finally, taking Raji/Cody makes a lot more sense to me.

Why does it seem like every offseason we have more needs than the prior year? Why is our scouting and personnel staff so bad? Why can’t we draft potential star talent??? Arrrggghhh!!!

~K

by Kurupt on Dec 18, 2008 1:13 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yeah, Mays will end up being a Top 10 pick, I believe, because he’s going to blow up at the Combine and/or his Pro Day.

And since I know you’re asking it internally, yes, there are 2-3 ends I would consider alongside my DTs.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 1:15 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Offseason Needs List

I’m sure this will be coming soon, but as far as the defense is concerned, the priority of needs goes from the front to the back, (DL, LB, DB) correct? By the way, I am probably the only person on the planet that wants to see Crowell and Youboty in a Bills uniform in 2009. Any chance?

Great plays don't make great players; great players make great plays.

by Fort Worth on Dec 18, 2008 2:00 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

We’re putting together another community needs list this off-season. Don’t you worry.

And re: Crowell, don’t get your hopes up. There’s little chance he’ll want to return, particularly if Jauron remains the coach.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 2:03 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Crowell

I’ve read all the talk about Crowell. Besides the possiblity of not returning to his “old form” post-injury and the “burnt bridge” between Crowell and Jauron, what is legitimately wrong with Crowell as a football player, former team captain, and a leader off the field? Seriously…

Great plays don't make great players; great players make great plays.

by Fort Worth on Dec 18, 2008 2:11 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

As a football player
He’s terrible in coverage. Just awful.

Former team captain
Kind of by default. It was Whitner’s defense, everyone knew it, but Crowell was the vet so got the C.

As a leader off the field
Have you not heard the story of Crowell goofing off in the weight room during the off-season and Kawika Mitchell reading him the riot act?

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 2:13 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I give you credit..

Geronimo mentioned that Crowell was “yucking it up” in the weight room. I just know that Crowell has made many big plays in his Bills career. That’s one of the main things the Bills need: big plays. He’s relatively young, so there should be room for improvement in his game (pass coverage).

I just want the best resources spent on the defensive line and not have to dilute them on LB’s, you know?

Great plays don't make great players; great players make great plays.

by Fort Worth on Dec 18, 2008 2:18 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Who wouldn’t want Youboty back? He was arguably our best CB until he got hurt…

~K

by Kurupt on Dec 18, 2008 5:29 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

yeah, he is under contract for next year and everything

by kaisertown on Dec 18, 2008 5:34 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Especially with Blitzing

Case in point, the game against the Dolphins the first time when Corner blitzed and failed on the sack. Thats a stick that Youbuty does NOT miss. He is a great tackler, the only issue its looking like is health with him. But he is by far our best option at Nickel when he is on the field.

Now if only this gopher could play DE, we would be doing better, I mean, who couldn't play better than the corpse brothers Kelsay and Denney?

by WABillsfan on Dec 18, 2008 6:29 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I’m a little skeptical of Cushing actually. I’ve admittedly only watched a few USC games this year, but I didn’t see that many big plays out of him. I feel like he’d be one of those guys that was very solid, but not a game changer. I think Maualuga is much more along those lines in my opinion.

by PozDispenser on Dec 18, 2008 3:20 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Great Post Brian

I’m really hoping that we can snag Matt Birk away from Minn and address our D-Line in the draft. Your point about Stroud needs to be taken seriously because what happens if he gets hurt? exactly…not very good.

So we definately need DT, DE and LB on defense. Also – Raji and Cody would be just great for us and would probably be almost immediate impact players.

If we go defensive backfield the first pick I will be very unhappy. I’m guessing they won’t do that – if they do then they obviously will never learn.

Maybe Fewell needs better players – I think he has shown that he will try and bring pressure and mix it up if he has too. I’m still not sold on Fewell – but if he gets playmakers and shores up that D-Line – everything magically gets better.

Maybe now you'll never slime a guy with a positron collider

by J2 on Dec 18, 2008 10:20 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Alvin Bowen

We drafted this kid last year and got put on IR before the season started, I thought he had a lot of upside, but I may be wrong…any thoughts on he would impact our defence?

by Billsfly48 on Dec 18, 2008 10:27 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He’s a depth guy, and nothing more. Him returning to the team helps depth-wise, and he’ll almost certainly be a member of the team next year based solely on his special teams prowess, but he’s small, and as I mentioned here, small isn’t ideal.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 10:33 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Spencer Johnson

Isn’t that guy supposed to be the third DT behind Stroud and Williams. While I admit I haven’t seen him make a lot of huge plays like Williams and Stroud, he has seemed serviceable in reserve.

by MattRichWarren on Dec 18, 2008 11:21 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

P.S.

I would want to draft or sign a fourth DT anyways but I am saying that it’s not a high need because of Johnson. We need to do it but it’s spot on the list is lower.

by MattRichWarren on Dec 18, 2008 11:22 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

… he is the third DT behind Stroud and Williams. And he is a serviceable reserve.

I HATE drafting for need. Raji and Cody, in my view, are rare talents – they’re gigundous penetrators. I see them in the mold of Shaun Rogers or Kris Jenkins. The Bills need that player. I don’t care what we have at DT. The Bills need that player.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 11:42 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I see Cody in the mold of the 2006-2007 Kris Jenkins. Weight getting out of control with injury issues. Of course, that’s asinine to predict so who knows….

DT depth is needed. If somehow we can address Center in FA, DT really becomes an option for me in the 1st, though right now it’s Mack or a DE. I think the players that’ll be available at those positions are better than your 2 DT’s, so it’s not exactly drafting for need over ability….imo

~K

by Kurupt on Dec 18, 2008 1:07 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Exactly Brian. I’m with you on drafting for talent. Drafting for talent eventually turns into the “need” pick. As in the team stating “we NEED this guy on the field for us to succeed.”

by TheAfghanTwilight on Dec 18, 2008 1:10 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I’ve seen a bunch of people write that it is easier to find talent for a 3-4 now. What is the logic behind that?

A 3-4 requires a dominant NT to be a dominant unit and those are pretty tough to come by.

Inside linebackers have to pretty big considering they have to take on guards with regularity. Go to a draft site and look at the player rankings for middle linebackers and see how many of them are big enough to man the middle in a 3-4. Scott Wright has 20 ILBs listed and only 6 of them weigh more than 240 lbs.

There are only a handful of teams that run a 3-4 in college so every defensive player you draft has to learn an entirely different scheme from what they have done their entire football lives.

Drafting a speed rusher tweener DE like Selvie or Brown probably looks like a lock to be an NFL stud, but look at Vernon Gholston. 3-4 teams have to convert DEs to outside linebackers where their job is entirely different. Covering tight ends and running backs when you weigh 250 pounds can’t be easy and learning where you have to be in zones is something a lot of players who played with a hand on the ground in college never figure out.

by kaisertown on Dec 18, 2008 12:00 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Speaking of Scott Wright, you must have read his response to this very question. :)

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 12:27 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I just did and I’m a little surprised he didn’t mention how it is easier to find inside linebackers in a 4-3 like I did. I do feel pretty good that he agrees with me!

by kaisertown on Dec 18, 2008 5:25 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That’s the one thing I disagreed with you on. If Zach Thomas can play in a 3-4, I’m not worried about size inside.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 7:21 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Zach Thomas has bulked up. He may only be 5-11, but he weighs 242 pounds. That is pretty impressive size considering his height. His partner, Bradie James weighs 245

Mayo and Bruschi average out to about 245 pounds
Barton and Harris also weigh about 245
Foote and Farrior are both 240+ pounders
Matt Wilhelm and Tim Dobbins in SD both way 245+
Ayodele weighs 245 and Crowder weighs 250
Spikes and Willis both weigh 240+
Davis and Jackson in Cleveland average out to 245
Ray Lewis weighs 250 and Bart Scott is 240

You have to have some bulk to play inside in a 3-4 and there aren’t a lot of those guys in the draft each year.

by kaisertown on Dec 18, 2008 7:37 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Sure, but you’re telling me that Kawika Mitchell (253) and Poz (238, could add a pound or two) couldn’t play inside? Again, I’m not suggesting a permanent move to a 3-4 here, so it’s not like we’d have to search far and wide to fit guys to our scheme. We’d still be a base 4-3.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 19, 2008 7:48 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I’m not completely versed on the intricacies between the 3-4 and the 4-3 and which is better in which situations, but as a fan who was an adult during the SB years, I can tell you that I hated the fact that the Bills played a 3-4 then, because they couldn’t stop the run when it counted. At THAT time, all the best defenses were 4-3s, if I remember correctly.

Now, offenses have probably changed quite a bit in the meanwhile, which means the best way of defending them has probably changed. I just wanted to finally put in my $0.02 about how I wished we had a 4-3 back in the SB years.

I also think I’m finally agreeing with Kaisertown on something.

by thefourwinds on Dec 18, 2008 1:49 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

our SB defenses

were soft because we had the super quick but light Jeff Wright. Also Leon Seals wasn’t all that heavy, was he? I loved Leonard Smith and even though he sucked in coverage, his physicality and emotion lifted the defense. If I recall he missed a super bowl game and I remember believing strongly that he would have made a difference.

Anyway. I hate am sad about Scott Norwood. We wouldn’t all be this upset if he had only hooked things a little bit.

by Ono on Dec 18, 2008 4:17 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

re

Lombardi wrote about this recently. No matter how good you are at a position you keep stock piling at that position because in the NFL contract disputes, injuries and bad season just happen. No matter how stocked we think we are at CB we need more. And we need a ton of help on the DL. I like how we develop OL like Butler, Peters and now Demetrius Bell. My hope, is that we could do the same on the DL but guys like Bryan and Mace don’t seem to be long-term solutions. I’m so pissed that McCargo trade didn’t go thru cuz that would have been an extra valuable draft pick. Now we have no extra picks this draft.

We need a C and TE offensively and maybe a veteran WR. But defensively is where our priorities should be I agree. Getting bigger up front and having some playmakers to get after the QB I think will do wonders for what I think is one of the more talented secondaries in the league depending on what happens with Greer. McGee, McKelvin, Whitner, Scott, Youboty, Corner…..I like it.

MARVelous

by MARVelous on Dec 18, 2008 12:27 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Brian...I couldn't agree more.

A couple of additional comments:

  • The DB’s have been playing way too soft…with the speed at CB, I’d like to see them in tighter coverage and be more physical in jamming the receivers at the line.
  • I’ve made no secret of my preference for the 3-4, but kaisertown makes a good point regarding the difficulty finding the dominant NT. But the Bills have managed to scrape up few good ones over the years so I’m sure that this could be overcome if the Bills really want to move in this direction. The question is whether Perry Fewell and the HC are willing to commit to a change defensive strategy. It seems as though they have begrudgingly come to the conclusion—that in some areas—bigger is better. However, their approach seems like more of the trial and error variety, with the emphasis being on error. Realistically, I see them getting a little bigger, but only one maybe two players a year.
  • As much as I want a dominating defense that could make-up for the Bills offensive anemia, the front office cannot neglect the glaring needs on the offensive line. The Peters issue must be addressed and we need a competent FA center or a high draft pick that could be starting by game 3.
  • Does anybody else see the irony in a team with largest mountain of offensive man-meat in the league, also having a complement of relatively scrawny men, not named Marcus Stroud, on the other side of the ball? This truly baffles me.

"They're Killin' Me Whitey. They're Killin' Me" -- Lou Saban

by NJBill on Dec 18, 2008 12:41 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The DB’s have been playing way too soft…with the speed at CB, I’d like to see them in tighter coverage and be more physical in jamming the receivers at the line.

i bet you’ll see that if we can finally get some dominating DT’s or DE’s.

The Peters issue must be addressed and we need a competent FA center or a high draft pick that could be starting by game 3.

They will sign him prior to training camp and I’m thinking Matt Birk at Center then D-line in draft.

Maybe now you'll never slime a guy with a positron collider

by J2 on Dec 18, 2008 12:52 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Why does everyone keep saying Birk will hit FA?

He is right now clearing the way for AP who is one pace to be
1- NFL leading Rusher
2- Possible MVP finalist for the NFL.

If those two things happen, Birk is NOT going anywhere but back into the line for Minny. They’ll either extend him or slap a franchise tag on him, especially considering how CHEAP centers are to franchise.

Now if only this gopher could play DE, we would be doing better, I mean, who couldn't play better than the corpse brothers Kelsay and Denney?

by WABillsfan on Dec 18, 2008 6:37 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

fixed

The Peters issue must be addressed and we need a competent FA center or a high draft pick that could be starting by game 3 game 1.

~K

by Kurupt on Dec 18, 2008 1:09 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I agree on the 3-4 also

My only question is, what do we do with guys like Schobel, Kelsay, Denney, and Ellis if we go to that defense? These guys make huge salaries, and have never played an outside linebacker role in a 3-4.

I think we could get a lot in a trade for Schobel, but the others would bring back minimal returns.

Thoughts?

by bruuuuce_02 on Dec 18, 2008 12:56 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Again, I never said – and made a very clear point to say – that I’m not saying move to a 3-4. I’m saying have the ability to switch between the two by bringing in versatile guys. That’s it.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 12:59 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Cut 'em all

Send the bums a-packing!

Just kidding. Send Kelsay packing and work with the other 3 for now….

~K

by Kurupt on Dec 18, 2008 1:10 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I particularly like Denney here, because he’s long, physical and could conceivably play end quite well in any 3-4 alignment we rolled out (again, only occasionally). He’d be far better for that role than Kelsay, and there’s no way Chris could stand up. Plus, Denney’s a good specialist.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 1:17 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Denney is also cheaper and more productive. I have no idea why we’d keep Kelsay over him. I don’t care if he’s a captain, try producing ya bum!

~K

by Kurupt on Dec 18, 2008 1:26 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I would love to trade Kelsay

But, what could we get for him? 2nd or 3rd rounder maybe. That would be worth it in my mind.

Although his 2 sack season is not helping his stock.

by bruuuuce_02 on Dec 18, 2008 2:14 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Or his 2.5-sack season, or his 5.5-sack season, or his other 2.5-sack season, or his 4.5-sack season, or his 0-sack season…

There’s no chance that Kelsay would EVER net anything more than a second-day pick in my book. 17 sacks in 6 seasons? Pass.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 2:16 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Kelsay was drafted in the 2nd round

and his value has only gone down since then. No way do we get in return what we got him for.

Great plays don't make great players; great players make great plays.

by Fort Worth on Dec 18, 2008 2:46 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Oh my

If someone offered a 2nd or 3rd for Kelsay, they’d need their heads examined!!! I couldn’t imagine anyone offering anything more than a 6th or 7th and that’s if they’re desperate. This guy has a ridiculous contract for what he is, nobody wants to add that when they can just get a cheaper rookie to produce the same way….

~K

by Kurupt on Dec 18, 2008 5:32 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Ok, I hear ya

I would LOVE for us to bring in a big defensive talent. And I agree with you completely. Don’t draft for need… especially a team like the Bills who have very little standout stars. We need to draft the BEST TALENT AVAILABLE. A game changer.

Raji, Cody, Orakpo, Cushing, Maaluga, Laurinaitis, whoever we can get would make this team look a lot better. I would be ecstatic if we grabbed any one of these guys.

I think a center could and should be had in the 2nd round.

by bruuuuce_02 on Dec 18, 2008 1:03 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

On center, we might even be able to wait a little longer than that. There are four good ones this year.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 1:04 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Mack, Luigs, Caldwell…..and Unger? Is he definitely an NFL center?

~K

by Kurupt on Dec 18, 2008 1:11 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He’s definitely an NFL offensive lineman – he can play all five. Regardless of whether we draft a center or not, we should bring in a vet. If Unger doesn’t work out, play the vet and let Unger back up at all 3 interior positions. Our very own ultra-Duke Preston.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 1:18 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Right on, I like your thinking

I still like this draft possibility:

1. Big defensive game changer
2. Center (your choice of the best other than maybe Mack)
3. TE (best available)

That would be GREAT.

by bruuuuce_02 on Dec 18, 2008 1:55 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Later than round 2?

Really? Given that Arizona, Pittsburgh, and KC are all in the mix for a starting C I think it’s dicey waiting until round three to draft one. Simply put, if we wait that long we’ll be drafting the borderline guys, the guys who other teams thought weren’t quite good enough. I think that by waiting on our biggest need (Fowler is by far our least worthy starter) we risk getting a player who isn’t good enough and thus not addressing it at all.
Also, who do you want in FA? If Birk hits I’d love to grab him, but there’s no guarantee that we’ll be able to afford a good C.

On the bigger point, D doesn’t win jack if there isn’t at least a passable offense there too. On offense we are one piece away from a good NFL offense. On defense we are at least 2 pieces away from what you have in mind, I’d think more like 3 or 4 for what you seem to want. If we accept the limits of what we can do in one offseason and aim for a good defense rather than a dominant one we have a shot at putting together a playoff caliber team.
I don’t see the logic in drafting a Cody or a Raji. 4 DT’s do us no good if we fail to upgrade at our positions of need. We could have Pat Williams and Ted Washington in their primes and it would barely improve our team if we stayed the same at C, LB, and DE.

by Hopefulcynic on Dec 18, 2008 1:44 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

4 DT’s do us no good if we fail to upgrade at our positions of need.

Who said we wouldn’t be upgrading our positions of need? There’s a whole free agent season that comes before the draft, and the college prospects I mentioned were just EXAMPLES of guys that would look good here and fit the goals of getting better defensively. Plus, I’m not looking to draft a #4 DT; I’m looking to draft a #1 DT.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 1:55 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Rocky Bernard

Is also a possibility in free agency.

by bruuuuce_02 on Dec 18, 2008 1:57 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not big enough. I want a mamma jamma.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 2:01 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Thoughts on Michael Johnson

Is this guy overrated? Would he be worth a look? I know you like big DT’s, but this dude is a BIG DE.

by bruuuuce_02 on Dec 18, 2008 2:11 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think he’s a bit overrated, yes. Obviously, he’s very physically gifted, but he didn’t play much at Tech until his senior year. He hasn’t been lights-out this year, either. He’s more of a project than an immediate-impact guy, and I don’t think Buffalo’s in a good enough position talent-wise to take that guy with their top pick.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 2:14 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Maybe discussed before...

Everette Brown and Brian Orakpo can play OLB, I believe.

Great plays don't make great players; great players make great plays.

by Fort Worth on Dec 18, 2008 2:48 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not sure what that has to do with the size argument… if we drafted either of those guys, they’d be playing DE here.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 2:51 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I thought we were talking about scheme flexibility?

Maybe I jumped in the wrong line of posts.

Great plays don't make great players; great players make great plays.

by Fort Worth on Dec 18, 2008 2:55 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Now your talkin!

Great plays don't make great players; great players make great plays.

by Fort Worth on Dec 18, 2008 2:46 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You're

Great plays don't make great players; great players make great plays.

by Fort Worth on Dec 18, 2008 2:49 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You really think we can address our other needs so well in FA that we can afford to grab a DT in the first round? I know you’re all for putting off drafting a C, but you think we’ll be able to afford to pass on DE and LB?

We have a #1 DT. The guy we bring in would be at best a #2 DT for at least the next few years.

Peyton Manning, Ed Reed, Brian Urlacher, Albert Haynesworth and Jared Allen would all look good here too, but there’s no chance of any of them coming here, so why talk about it?

by Hopefulcynic on Dec 18, 2008 2:26 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Terrence Cody and B.J. Raji are not close to the five guys you mention. If you think there’s “no chance” of the two DTs coming here, then say that. :)

I think we can pass on LB because I’m betting we’ll end up addressing that in FA.
I think we can pass on DE, but I’ll admit it’s not an inviting prospect, considering there’s no good second-tier guys available as free agents.

Like I said – I don’t like drafting for need.

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 2:46 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I don’t think that we’re going to get Cody or Raji. I think that regardless of what you or I want, OBD will, at least to some extent, be drafting for need.
There are definite downsides to drafting for need, but it’s better than not filling the need at all. If drafting for need can get us into the playoffs next year (combined with one good FA signing, I think it could) then I will take it no questions asked.

by Hopefulcynic on Dec 18, 2008 2:59 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Let’s worry about “not filling the need at all” until after free agency. Until then, I’m allowed to speak as if my every wish will be fulfilled this off-season. :)

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 18, 2008 3:07 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I can see why you don’t, seeing as Alex Smith was a huge waste where he was taken, and the 49ers could have went with someone like Ronnie Brown or Braylon Edwards. Although I think OBD is too stupid to notice this and will probably take someone like William Moore (although I wouldn’t be that upset with this pick, because he could be special).

by NJBillsfan on Dec 18, 2008 5:16 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Bertrand Berry is available as a solid second tier guy. Obviously, I want a top rookie too, but Berry would allow Kelsay to hit the road.

~K

by Kurupt on Dec 18, 2008 5:34 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I agree

We need one of the better prospects at C, and we can get one in round 2.

by bruuuuce_02 on Dec 18, 2008 1:56 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Use Free Agency for Need and the Draft for Best Player Available

The key though is having people in your front office that are good evaluators of football talent. Why is it that teams like the Bills,Lions,Bengals,Browns,Redskins and Chiefs always are looking up to the likes of the Patriots,Steelers, Cowboys,Giants and Eagles? Even though they normally have the better draft positions. The answer is very simple, the winning teams have better people to evaluate players. They know which free agents will have an immediate impact to their schemes for their success. They know which rookies have what it takes to improve their team. The Bills have not had that kind of front office talent for ten years. Until we get it we will remain with the likes of Detroit,etc,etc.

by gjv on Dec 18, 2008 1:35 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Well, thats a great thought

How much do you think it will take to snag Pioli away from NE? Besides, someone like him will go to the Lions or Browns where the owner will give him everything and more that he wants.

Now if only this gopher could play DE, we would be doing better, I mean, who couldn't play better than the corpse brothers Kelsay and Denney?

by WABillsfan on Dec 18, 2008 6:41 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What? You don’t think Wilson is willing to pay for better front office personnel to evaluate players?

by gjv on Dec 18, 2008 6:54 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The versatility of NE and the size of the Giants

That’s what would be nice for Christmas. Totally agree that we MUST get bigger. Whenever I watch the G men I am very envious of their size. With the addition of Stroud and Mitchell it looks like OBD has finally learned their lesson. So I would expect that they will not be drafting any more smurfs on the line. If that is so, Selvie and Everette Brown will not be considered. I do agree with your thoughts on another dominant DT. That would take pressure off the DE’s.
I like the idea of moving Poz to the outside, his natural position. Then we would target a big ILB. Guess I’ll have to take a good look at that crop.
I also like the idea of moving McGee (if Greer stays) to the inside to play the slot receiver. At least let him play close to the line. In the short time he was allowed to do that, he looked like a MUCH better CB.
To me, the key is balance, both offensively and defensively. We are in the middle of the pack defensively now but our offense continues to be puke. Since 2003, our offense has ranked 30, 25, 28, 30, 30, and this year 24. It is easy to say that given the talent on O we should rank higher, but it is what it is and it is puke. So, much as we could always use more big bodies on D, this year we need offensive infusioin. Big time. I am sure, if DJ is back that, being the defensive minded coach that he is, the D will not be neglected in the draft.
I think the size issue is the most important one for us now. If DJ returns then Fewell will return and we will play a 4-3. And I do not think Fewell has a versatile mind so we will never have the different looks that NE has with Perry. I think our defensive stats would improve nicely if we played our DB’s closer.
There are four good centers this year but only one true stud that stands out above the rest. I have read on more than one site that at times Luigs gets manhandled in tight quarters and does not have decent lower body strength. At this point, if we make yet another bonehead move in the draft and do not take Mack, Eric Wood would be a better pick that Luigs.

everything goes better with a BIG MACK

by keuka121 on Dec 18, 2008 1:36 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Some small school guys who could help us out on D late in the draft

Once again thanks to the guys at National Football Post: http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/2008/12/nfl-draft-top-20-small-college-prospects/

Some of these guys I have actually heard of, and all will be 4th round or later types with a couple sneaking into the 3rd in key positions.

CB Domonique Johnson (6-2/190), Jackson State
The Buzz: Johnson, who began his career at Missouri, is this year’s version of Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie – a tall, lean corner from the FCS level (i.e., Division I-AA) with excellent ball skills and knack for the big play. Johnson lacks the same type of awareness in man coverage as Rodgers-Cromartie, but he has a similar skill set and the upside to warrant a first-day pick.
—— He won’t be on our team at all, but its nice to know if DJ feels his oats and wants another CB, we can get another guy who will need time to develop, YAY. But a kid to keep an eye on anyway.

DT Louis Ellis (6-2/312), Shaw (N.C.).
The Buzz: Ellis was a big-time prospect out of high school who signed with Mississippi State but had academic trouble. He’s an explosive athlete who makes a living getting off the snap and penetrating into an opponent’s backfield. Ellis is a gifted athlete who was timed in 4.94 in the 40. He has dominated his level of competition – NCAA Division II – despite seeing consistent double teams. Ellis should see his stock rise with a strong showing in the postseason and could improve significantly on his late-round grade.
—— On the small side I admit, but a monster penetrator would be nice, and he is a good athlete. I haven’t heard anything about him being a troublemaker or football stupid either. Just seems to suffer from being at a big time school and not paying attention to his stuides. No word out there at all about lack of motivation, could be a great rotational guy.

DT Sammie Lee Hill (6-4/328), Stillman (Ala.)
The Buzz: He’s a massive nose tackle prospect who has good athleticism and quickness for his size. Hill has the body control to move laterally as well as hold the point of attack against the run. He’s a developing pass rusher who has the physical attributes to become an every-down lineman.
—— If we want to run a 3-4 at times, or just stone wall a team’s run game, here is our boy. If we want a guy to be a Stroud replacement in a couple of seasons, this kid might be it or you. He is big, fast and NASTY, (nice interview with him here: http://www.nfldraftblitz.com/sammieleehillinterview.htm). Needless to say, I WANT THIS KID.

DE Lawrence Sidbury (6-3/265), Richmond
The Buzz: He’s a strong, good-looking end who has quick feet and body control on his pass rush. Sidbury re-directs quickly in space and may be best-suited to play outside linebacker in a 3-4 scheme.
—— If we want to go 3-4 part time, and have a pure rusher late in the draft, would he satisfy some people?

LB Jason Williams (6-1/236), Western Illinois
The Buzz: Williams is a thickly built outside linebacker who has the frame to play inside. He displays good pop as a tackler, but his best attribute is his sideline-to-sideline speed. Williams has great range on the outside, with the burst and speed to track down the ball in pursuit. He’s an ideal "Cover 2″-type linebacker.
—— Hmmmm, fast, likes to hit, and could get bigger? He would move Ellison back in the depth chart quickly if he comes here.

DT John Faletoese (6-2/295), UC Davis
The Buzz: He’s an explosive, penetrating tackle who has the burst to shoot gaps inside and get after the quarterback. He has a motor that never stops, and he fights like a dog in the run game. He will scrap and claw for every inch. He reminds some scouts of Bills DT Kyle Williams.
—— Hmmm, whats not to love? We could always use another guy like Kyle in our rotation, but kid needs to bulk up some more, he barely outweighs me, though in his case, its muscle!

S Dre’Mail Hardin (6-0/195), Stillman (Ala.)
The Buzz: He’s a physical safety prospect who reads and reacts quickly. He’s at his best at the line of scrimmage attacking downhill versus the run. He’s a physical tackler who takes good angles, but lacks great closing speed and range in the secondary. Hardin plays at one speed and lacks the straight-line speed to handle the centerfield-type role at the next level.
—— Not the best of the small school guys, but he could be a decent 3rd or 4th S. But we already have a big hitter in Scott, so I would pass on him, unless it was the 7th round or something.

Now if only this gopher could play DE, we would be doing better, I mean, who couldn't play better than the corpse brothers Kelsay and Denney?

by WABillsfan on Dec 18, 2008 6:22 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

"We need to be bigger, tougher, more athletic and a touch deeper. We need a mentality adjustment"

IMHO…….this will NOT happen until either Dick Jauron changes his persona……or we get a new coach that instills this……

because this team will continue to take the form of its “fearless” leader until then……

PIPE DREAM: Jim Harbaugh for the Bills next head coach.

by norcaliangelsfan on Dec 18, 2008 6:31 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Great read Brian!

I agree with everything except for who we draft first (haha) but I most definitely agree with you that we need to get more aggressive on the defensive side of the ball. You know my position on the 3-4 so I won’t waste keystrokes but I must say you point about changing the “mindset” is great because that’s exactly the thing that kills us. We are so affraid of giving up big plays that we let them happen in front of us and we never get off the field and we give the opponent hope & momentum. We need to just mix things up & get aggressive and move around (stunts or showing different looks) – predictability is our worse enemy.

BEAST MODE, During the week plan on it & on game day thrive on it!
GO BILLS!
Section 336 Row 13

by keysh67 on Dec 18, 2008 8:20 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

bills identity?

first let’s find one, then let’s stick with it. We shouldn’t be copying others success, because we will never catch up. We do need more talent and I agree we should generally focus on the D (although I would love to have a more athletic TE/receiver or two). As many have mentioned, the biggest problem with the team on D is our generally passive play. On offense, I would like to see Trent (a smart, stanford guy) be given the chance to audible more. And we should bring Jim K in to teach him how to go no huddle once in awhile…

by sestak on Dec 18, 2008 9:11 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I resent what Gregg Williams did by moving us away from our long history with 3-4, but he was able to establish an identity to the Bills D. It was aggressive and attacking. They ranked No. 2 in the league for a couple of years. The problem was the Bills offense had an identity as well: p-u-t-r-i-d. The team is coming around defensively, but with all those mediocre milquetoast do-gooders they don’t seem to have that nasty demeanor to be an elite unit. Offensively, I thought some progress had been made as of late with the strong running game, but the Turk has done his best to stifle that as well.

On the no huddle, I always liked it as a change of pace in certain situations, especially when your offense goes for great stretches without a TD. With a number of games under his belt, I agree that it’s high time to add it to Trent’s toolkit.

Obviously, I like Jimbo, but I’m not sure if he would make a great teacher. He didn’t seem to take to helping his understudies during his playing career; even one of his young ins, AVP has established coaching creds probably way beyond where he’ll ever be. Part of the ownership team? Now that’s where I think Kelly could really help turn things around. I pray his “backers” are real and not a figment of everyone’s good intentions.

"They're Killin' Me Whitey. They're Killin' Me" -- Lou Saban

by NJBill on Dec 18, 2008 9:47 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Apparently Cody hasn’t filed the paperwork to go pro…..or something along those lines

~K

by Kurupt on Dec 20, 2008 12:51 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If I’m not mistaken, he’s got until January 15 to do so. And he would be CRAZY not to. Would you rather skip a year of Nick Satan and make millions of dollars, or… play for Nick Satan?

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by Brian Galliford on Dec 20, 2008 9:59 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I totally agree, but I read that a bunch of Crimson Tides(?) had filed and Cody wasn’t one of them. I bet he will, but hasn’t yet….

~K

by Kurupt on Dec 21, 2008 1:28 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Cheers to Everyone that commented

here that the Bills need an upgrade in DEPTH and SIZE. I agree, trade Kelsay, too much money, little production and little guy. I don’t see the Bills acquiring any more DTs in the offseason, as they have 3 “legitimate” players in ‘their" minds. However, I think they go linebacker or defensive end. They will definately go front seven on D, so don’t get your hopes up on a first round center or TE.

If the Bills want to make the playoffs next year, they MUST obtain a veteran FA DE. They must have someone who can rush the passer and knows NFL offensive lineman techniques, while playing at a very fast pace. CHRIS CANTY. Can u tell I love this guy?

P.S. I told everyone last year that the Bills would draft a CB. what happened??

P.P.S. This year I am undecided, check back in a couple of months. (Love the LB’s)

by Cutter3636 on Dec 20, 2008 12:29 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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