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Wise college juniors hurt Bills' draft prospects


Gresham, other big names staying in school (heismanpundit.com)

The 2009 NFL Draft was supposed to be the richest draft in recent memory in terms of junior-eligible talent. Some of college football's biggest names were going to make big bucks and bring big expectations to NFL cities everywhere - and with the eleventh overall pick in this April's draft, the Buffalo Bills were poised to take advantage of that development.

Then the juniors decided to stay in school.

Sure, there are plenty of top-flight underclassmen who made themselves draft-eligible, including Georgia QB Matt Stafford, Texas Tech WR Michael Crabtree and Florida State DE Everette Brown. There's still a lot of talent available this year. But several players that opted to play out their senior seasons in college have depleted the draft pool, particularly at the top of the first round, and those decisions might come back to hurt the Bills in April.

Players the Bills might have chosen
First of all, let me clarify something: I'm not bitter in the least at any college junior that returns to school to finish out their college careers. For each one of those guys - yes, even Florida QB Tim Tebow - there is always more to prove. In an era in which athletes more often than not make an attempt at riches too soon, these athletes should be applauded for making smart decisions.

But man... talk about what could have been.

No less than eight returning college stars would have been early-round considerations for the Bills this season: Oklahoma TE Jermaine Gresham, South Florida DE George Selvie, Ole Miss DE Greg Hardy, Alabama DT Terrence Cody, Oklahoma DT Gerald McCoy, Boston College OLB Mark Herzlich, Florida ILB Brandon Spikes and S Taylor Mays all would have been significant upgrades over current personnel in Buffalo.

Gresham and Spikes in particular are key losses; I've got good word that Gresham has been held in high regard by Buffalo's scouting department for a while now (how could he not be?), and Spikes may have been the first linebacker taken this year. Both are supreme talents that, at an absolute bare minimum, were first-round picks this year. Both might have been at or near the top of Buffalo's draft board.

Considering the fact that other prospects such as Tebow, Oklahoma QB Sam Bradford, LSU OT Ciron Black and Kentucky CB Trevard Lindley might have eventually been Top-20 picks, that means that talent that might have fallen to Buffalo will slide up the ladder. Again, it's great that these kids decided to stay in school, but in terms of the talent available in this year's draft class, nobody (in the NFL) wins.

Where the Bills go from here
Obviously, considering that this particular off-season development is completely out of the control of the Bills or any NFL team, it's tough to get too upset about what might have been. All of these names will eventually be available in the draft, and knowing the Bills' penchant for putting up 7-9 seasons, they're likely to be picking in the Top 15 in 2010 anyways.

There will still be a lot of talent available to the Bills at #11, particularly at a position where the Bills' need is so desperate that it trumps all others (at least in my opinion) - defensive end. As it stands now, there are four top-flight talents at the position - Texas' Brian Orakpo, Florida State's Brown, Georgia Tech's Michael Johnson and Penn State's Aaron "Project Mayhem" Maybin - and it's anticipated that at least one of those players will be available when the Bills pick in the first round. Other talents such as California C Alex Mack, Boston College DT B.J. Raji and Wake Forest OLB Aaron Curry are all premium players at positions of need that would add a degree of toughness to Buffalo's milquetoast roster.

Still, all signs clearly point to a defensive end being the top pick at this point in time. If those four talented ends aren't available, Buffalo may also explore a trade down - with just seven picks (minus possible compensatory selections) in the draft, Dick Jauron and the Bills' front office have the fewest number of picks available to use since they've been here. This is a franchise that values draft picks, so a move down to stockpile selections seems like a strong possibility as well.

The draft field is largely set, with early entrants declared as of Thursday. Make no mistake about it, this is a talented draft class in many areas. But those pesky, oh-so-wise juniors - while their decision is commendable - have severely depleted what might have been one of the richest draft classes in NFL history.

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i have to think

the uncapped year had something to do with this? Why would guys turn down guaranteed top 20 projections? Guys like Spikes, Mays, Gresham who would be ranked the top 2-3 at their respective position?

Either way this does piss me off this morning, especially if the scouting dept really like Gresham, cuz of course I have huge man-love for Gresh (I got a good vibe with him so I call him Gresh).

Being Jauron is in a make or break season (well at least to us it seems that way but maybe to Ralph it isn’t) I don’t see them trading down. But trading down is something you always consider….and depending on how FA shakes out, OBD may not believe they HAVE to draft a guy at #11. If DE is filled with a VET, and with Schobel and possibly Crowell or other said FA LB coming in, possibly OBD trades down, nabs a Center, acquires picks for 2010? I need to research more about the repercussions if any that the uncapped year has on the draft class in 2010….maybe someone can help me out here

MARVelous

by MARVelous on Jan 16, 2009 9:13 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

The basic is this: cap hits as far as signing bonuses go will no longer be able to be spread out over the life of the deal. In short, no money can be pushed to future cap seasons – you pay for it up front. So rookies will get more money up front starting this year. That means that their decisions to return to school fly in the face of logic, actually, as the cap hit thing starts this year. That’s why it was anticipated that so many juniors would come out. I chalk it up to “Tim Tebow Syndrome”, especially in the case of Spikes.

Really, this shouldn’t make you mad. How can you be mad at 21-year-old kids for finishing out their degrees and making themselves better football players?

Buffalo Rumblings - all you care to know about the Buffalo Bills and more

by Brian Galliford on Jan 16, 2009 9:29 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

well

I’m not mad at them….but I am a firm believer in coming out when you know you will be a top 20 top 10 pick. Guarnateed money is not something I would turn down. I’m just trying to be a realist. More power to them for staying. With the life of a pro football player so short, and injuries so rampant, I worry that they take a chance of losing out on some big time money. Its not like basketball where the career life is much longer. However, best of luck young men….but its not like these guys are “student-athletes” they are “athelete-students”

MARVelous

by MARVelous on Jan 16, 2009 10:02 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Honestly, I think that the big issue with them coming out is that rookie contracts are going to be weird this year. Nobody really knows how the 09-10 transition to uncapped NFL team salaries is going to impact how contracts are structured this year. It could be that the NFL and/or agents advised these kids to stay in school until something ironclad is hammered out as far as how rookie salaries will be structured this year.

Buffalo Rumblings - all you care to know about the Buffalo Bills and more

by Brian Galliford on Jan 16, 2009 10:10 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

It also appears that a lot of the players who stayed did so for their team/school. The students look to be developing a team first mentality and realize that if they and their teammates come back for another year, they might be able to be part of something special. I’m not sure if that is the case for all of these student, but for Florida and OU it sure looks that way. Either way I think it is great. We as fans might be losing out, but the student’s might win in the end.

by BuffaloBrewed on Jan 16, 2009 10:29 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Well, in the case of Tebow and Bradford its a smart move

If they had come out along with Stafford and Dirty Sanchez, one of them was going to fall into the late 20’s real quick. Only 2 teams are really desperate for QB play, so by staying in another season Tebow and Bradford are going to make more money, guranteed, than they would if they came out this year. Supply and demand, thats why Sanchez declared after Tebow and Bradford backed off from it. For the 4 QBs it really was a case of chicken and who felt they would be better served by leaving now, or next year.

Now if only this gopher could play DE, we would be doing better, I mean, who couldn't play better than the corpse brothers Kelsay and Denney?

by WABillsfan on Jan 16, 2009 4:55 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Bills not in a good leverage position

Only 2-3 sure things in this draft in top half. Curry, 2-3 OTs, and 1-2 DE’s will be instant starters and impact guys. Unless Curry or one of the DE’s we like is there, we should look to trade out.

So it might make most sense to trade down and get extra picks – but in this draft as we need talent upgrade at several positions immediately.

Like the idea of getting to back of round 1 and getting an extra 2nd. Detroit will likely go Qb or OT and might want to jump up to our spot to get a top guy at either position. At 20 we could take C Mack or Unger before Pitt or Philly do or grab Pettigrew TE. Whichever position we don’t do at 20, take at 43.

We could likely get pick 65 and 82 from Detroit giving us 3 picks in the 3rd round – or 5 in the top 100. I know Detroit needs bodies too but without a Franchise QB and Franchise LT they are not going anywhere.

by freddyjj on Jan 16, 2009 9:45 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

no such thing as a "sure thing" in the NFL draft.......

Mike Williams sends his regards….

12/19/08 - Thank you KLJ for coming into my life.

by norcaliangelsfan on Jan 16, 2009 12:10 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

From the local In and Out burger shop

And he has a question for you freddyjj, “Would like fries with that?”

Now if only this gopher could play DE, we would be doing better, I mean, who couldn't play better than the corpse brothers Kelsay and Denney?

by WABillsfan on Jan 16, 2009 4:56 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

How can you be mad at 21-year-old kids for finishing out their degrees and making themselves better football players?

you can’t – i’ve always said that NFL players should not be able to say they went to whatever college unless they graduated from that college. Degrees are FAR more important to 90% of the players in college.

Education is the key to unemployment and crime. These kids should be commended for staying in school and thank you Brian for point that out

Maybe now you'll never slime a guy with a positron collider

by J2 on Jan 16, 2009 9:45 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Education is the key to unemployment and crime.

Haha. I know where you’re going here, but that’s funny to read. :)

Buffalo Rumblings - all you care to know about the Buffalo Bills and more

by Brian Galliford on Jan 16, 2009 9:49 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

lol – to stopping those things. i’ve always said that. uneducated people are more likely to commit crimes and be unemployed. i’ve graduated from 3 schools and would never say that i went to whatever school if i didn’t graduate. i really don’t know how the NFL hasn’t addressed this. especially with a lot of players coming from troubled neighborhoods.

i think when they do a college salary cap for players coming into the NFL we will see something along these lines.

Maybe now you'll never slime a guy with a positron collider

by J2 on Jan 16, 2009 9:54 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Most guys who come out early either:

a) Were probably taking classes like basket weaving anyway, and were just using college as a stopping point before going to the NFL.

                                                                 - OR -

b) Go back later and get a degree while they are pros.

The time has come for someone to put his foot down. And that foot is me.

by sireric on Jan 16, 2009 10:07 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

the NFL should still place an emphasis on players that are coming out of college getting degrees.

and your point about them taking basket weaving is correct -which is why it needs to change.

Maybe now you'll never slime a guy with a positron collider

by J2 on Jan 16, 2009 10:10 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Why would they?

What would they gain from it? It does nothing for the NFL. The NCAA is the NFL’s minor league right now. Having a degree in general studies isn’t going to make you a better football player.

by twoeightnine on Jan 16, 2009 11:39 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

really? nothing to gain from it huh?

how apparent is the NFL’s influence on the young? i would say very apparent. if the NFL shows that it cares about the kids future then what are the chances of parents taking more kids to games? buying more merchandise?

why would they do things like the united way? or things of this nature.

its not a football decision – its an ethical and economical decision

Maybe now you'll never slime a guy with a positron collider

by J2 on Jan 16, 2009 11:49 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

The old timers used to go back

These days, I’m not sure how many do…. We should send the NFLPA an email inquiring about that..

Now if only this gopher could play DE, we would be doing better, I mean, who couldn't play better than the corpse brothers Kelsay and Denney?

by WABillsfan on Jan 16, 2009 4:58 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

in reality

many of these top tier kids going back to school will not get their degrees. they will be in school for the fall semester and leave after their bowls games to train at one of the camps to get ready for the combine.

by gatornation on Jan 16, 2009 10:24 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I always find it amusing when long-tenured players mention their college during prime-time game intro.

"Buffalo Bills Football 2009 (sponsored by Labatt): A Future as Uncertain as the Beer You’re Drinking"

by TheAfghanTwilight on Jan 16, 2009 11:42 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I saw some stats once for graduation rates at the top basketball schools for pro prospects. I can’t remenber the specifics but at virtually every school the percentage who got a diploma was just pitiful. Far less than 50%. There are exceptioins (UCLA)but the average is just horrid. Of those who do graduate many get a useless degree if “general studies” or some such rot. About as useful as a BA is psychology is in the real world. College football is big business at the top schools and they coddle their best athletes with tutors, junk classes and junk degrees. It would be nice if it were different but that mentality starts at the top. Colleges and the NFL are only doing what they perceive is in their own best interests. Not the best interests for the athlete, but their own. That’s human nature like it or not.

everything goes better with a BIG MACK

by keuka121 on Jan 16, 2009 12:15 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

norcali – especially if you look at the troubled players in the league. the NFL does NOT want that image placed upon them like it is the NBA. the smarter the athletes the less likely they are to get into trouble. the relationship between uneducated people and crime is staggering.

Maybe now you'll never slime a guy with a positron collider

by J2 on Jan 16, 2009 12:31 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

OJ was only in college 2 years.

"Buffalo Bills Football 2009 (sponsored by Labatt): A Future as Uncertain as the Beer You’re Drinking"

by TheAfghanTwilight on Jan 16, 2009 12:32 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

holy crap did I butcher that......what I meant was....

“If the NFL wanted the kids to get an education before they turned pro”

This is why I should wait to post until after Im fully awake.

12/19/08 - Thank you KLJ for coming into my life.

by norcaliangelsfan on Jan 16, 2009 12:38 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

no your right – its something they need to do and have not yet.

but i beleive they will sooner than later. it won’t be get a degree or else – but more along the lines that when they put in the college salary cap for rookies, players that have degrees will be able to accept higher contracts that players without degrees. something along those lines

Maybe now you'll never slime a guy with a positron collider

by J2 on Jan 16, 2009 12:44 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

For every Myron Rolle, there a hundreds of guys like Brown and the other early entrants

Now I’m not dissing Brown, maybe during the NFL offseason he goes back and finishes his degree in something like Chemistry, but I doubt it. Rolle is THE exception that proves the rule about D-1A college football players and degrees.

Now if only this gopher could play DE, we would be doing better, I mean, who couldn't play better than the corpse brothers Kelsay and Denney?

by WABillsfan on Jan 16, 2009 5:01 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Former Bill ROss Tucker, a Princeton graduate, advocates going pro....

I just wanted to offer a different opinion to Brian. Tucker says that these kids have a finite number of hits and years in them and they should make bank when they can. Reggie Bush is an example he uses. If he had these injuries at USC, his contract would have been incredibly low in the pros. He has set himself up financially for the rest of his life by simply coming out when he did.

He uses other examples and talks about guys getting to their big pay second contracts before their body starts breaking down as well. Good read and as a former player he usually has good insights.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/ross_tucker/01/14/tucks-takes/index.html

Playing Eternal Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008.

by MattRichWarren on Jan 16, 2009 10:27 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

that is correct – but only for maybe 100 college students. obviously the top of the draft they should come out because financially they will be set and can go ahead and get their degrees whenever.

but the numbers are so skewed – there are far more college football players that don’t get degrees because they go to play football and think they will make it big and never end up doing so. i’ve seen players that were 2nd or 3rd stringers on a DIII team and not to taking their classes seriously because they think they will hit the big pay day…..and it never happens.

there’s always exceptions to the rule – however – for the majority – a degree should be their top priority. especially if they get a scholarship. i mean how many students to go Buffstate or UB or where ever and make it to the NFL? i don’t have the numbers, but i’m guessing not a whole heck of a lot. stay in school while it is getting paid by someone else and get your degree. the NFL should put an emphasis on this and make it so players get something extra if the obtain their degrees.

Maybe now you'll never slime a guy with a positron collider

by J2 on Jan 16, 2009 11:37 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

And how many of these students only go to college because of football?

There’s a large number of kids out there who are only attending college because they got a chance to play football. If they weren’t playing football they wouldn’t have even wanted to go to college.

by twoeightnine on Jan 16, 2009 11:47 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

exactly!

now give them greater influence to go ahead and get the degree. be smarter – get a better job and prosper in society. its win/win

are you seriously arguing this point?

Maybe now you'll never slime a guy with a positron collider

by J2 on Jan 16, 2009 11:51 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Therein lies and interesting dicotomy

When I went to college at Oberlin, I played D3 ball, and knew I was there for my degree.

I had a friend from my HS who went to Rutgers on a full ride for football, got redshirted his freshman year and flunked out that spring because he never went to class or did his school work. Why? Because he thought that since he was a big time recruit for the school he didn’t need to work at school, only in the weight room, and he lost out on a free degree. He now works at a Burger King as an Ast. Manager, no BS.

Another friend from that same team went with the other dude to Rutgers on a full ride as well. He took his school work seriously though, got red shirted, completed his degree in 4 years and started on his masters in his 5th season. Why? Because he was only the second kid in his family to go to school, and he KNEW he would never make the NFL, and he made sure he had his degree, esepcially since it was free as long as he played football.

But in the end, it comes down to the individual playing the game. Do they want the paper from the school? Do they just want a chance to make it to the pros? Or do they even care either way? Its for each person to decide…

Now if only this gopher could play DE, we would be doing better, I mean, who couldn't play better than the corpse brothers Kelsay and Denney?

by WABillsfan on Jan 16, 2009 5:07 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

oh nice use of personal experience........you get an "A" WA

and a rec’d.

12/19/08 - Thank you KLJ for coming into my life.

by norcaliangelsfan on Jan 16, 2009 8:51 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

People complain these kids don't get paid while the Athletic dept. gets all this money...

These people are getting free college. That’s like 6 digit student loan debt for many people. It’s getting paid 25k a year to play football. I think paying college players above that is a mistake. room, board, tuition, perks, man these kids have it made. I actually had to work my way through college and am paying back student loans makin 40k a year. They made around that much going to the weight room and in free tutition and books. Treat it as a job cause you’re getting paid like it’s a job, just not in dollar bills.

Sorry, long rant for a second.

Playing Eternal Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008.

by MattRichWarren on Jan 17, 2009 10:19 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

well said.......

12/19/08 - Thank you KLJ for coming into my life.

by norcaliangelsfan on Jan 17, 2009 1:52 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Hey no problems here man

I played D3 because thats the level I could compete at and Ihave over 40k in loans to pay off for doing so. But I loved my school and think it was worth, afterall, I met my wife while there!

But yeah, the NFL will need to make up its mind soon, either they make a true minor league like MLB, or everyone stops bitchin’ about the NCAA guys not getting paid, they are, its the free education, and I would have killed for that, be able to go to school free, AND play ball against the best?!

Now if only this gopher could play DE, we would be doing better, I mean, who couldn't play better than the corpse brothers Kelsay and Denney?

by WABillsfan on Jan 17, 2009 5:39 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Student first and Athelete second

I agree that the NFL should stress and promote the notion of going to school first. But I also understand the logic of Ross Tucker. So why not the NFL make a rule that, a junior must be ranked within the top 100 in the NFL Central Scouting Board in order for him to be elligible for the draft. I know different draft boards have different player evaluations, but I find the NFL scouting board to be quite fair, and there is little to no chance a player is drafted within the 1st 2 rounds if he is ranked outside the top 100 (no matter how crazy some teams draft).

Bills fan half way around the world

by moncheri on Jan 18, 2009 2:12 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

So what exactly do we think the Bills strategy will be in the first and second rounds?
1. OBD wants the best DE available in the first and the best C available in the second. This is the strategy we have assumed will happen. If that is the case we should not be hurt by the players who have opted to stay. At #11 we will get one of the top 3 DE’s in the class. And who’s to say which one will be a star in the NFL? Orakpo is projected top 10 and that is good as far as I can see. That means we’ll get either Brown or Johnson. I’m fine with that. Then there’s the Maybin factor. I’m guessing that he has a superb combine and he rises up the boards. If you are a team that can wait for him to develop he is a great pick in the top 15. Mabye top 10 if the team projects into the future. With our second pick we will definitely get one of the top 3 centers (Oh please, oh please let it be Mack). How can we not be fine with that scenario with the best available TE in the third?

2. We trade down in the first to around 20 or so and get another 3rd round pick. If we do that we probably will not get a top 4 DE (I’m including Maybin). At least that is what I’m seeing relative to team needs. That means DE is not at the top of OBD’s needs list. If Gresh or Mack was a high priority for OBD then this strategy would make the most sense. With Gresh (like it) off the boards, if we do this it looks more likely that we take Mack at #20 or so. Then we would presumably go DE in the second. The DE pool is deep this year. Even with Gresh gone there will be a pretty good TE prospect available in the 3rd. So we get Mack, the best avaliable DE and the best available TE and still have another 3rd round pick. That would be fine too. If that happened I’d guess DT or S with the extra pick. I wish our “deep throat” would weigh in on this.

Whichever way they go it looks like a winner for us.This is still a deep draft for OUR positions of need. I’m thinking some of these underclassmen who opted to stay want to improve their draft position for 2010 in addition to wanting to “stay in school” and win one for the gipper. Any “general studies” majors out there?

everything goes better with a BIG MACK

by keuka121 on Jan 16, 2009 11:48 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

It is a deep draft for our postiions of need but...

The more top ten value players out there, the less likely the guy we want gets picked before we get our hands on him. Makes sense right?

Playing Eternal Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008.

by MattRichWarren on Jan 16, 2009 2:44 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Right

One of the biggest wildcards in this draft for DE will be Maybin. Very hard to project him at this point. ESPN NFL Draft Tracker has him listed at #1 at the DE position. The mocks I see have two DE’s going in the top ten. Brown and Orakpo are mentioned most often. If Maybin rises into the top 10 it is very good news for us wanting Brown. We’ll see. Another name entering the DE picture is Paul Kruger from Utah. He is not top 15 at this point but watch him. 6’5, 265, 61 tackles, 16.5 TFL, 7.5 sacks, 2 FF, 7 pass breakups.

everything goes better with a BIG MACK

by keuka121 on Jan 16, 2009 3:56 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

yup

Now if only this gopher could play DE, we would be doing better, I mean, who couldn't play better than the corpse brothers Kelsay and Denney?

by WABillsfan on Jan 16, 2009 5:08 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

With the Gresham development...

I see no way OBD releases Robert Royal. It’s unfortunate, but I bet they ride the storm out and hope to land him next season. Why should I even think this is the way the organization will go about things? Because they give the air of an organization content with where they’re at right now – yuck.

The great news is that given the extreme difficulty with next season’s schedule, they should have an even higher pick next season!

"Buffalo Bills Football 2009 (sponsored by Labatt): A Future as Uncertain as the Beer You’re Drinking"

by TheAfghanTwilight on Jan 16, 2009 12:00 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Tell me how it doesn’t happen? I just don’t see them releasing him. Man, this team has me second-guessing their ability to do anything right or at least exciting right now.

"Buffalo Bills Football 2009 (sponsored by Labatt): A Future as Uncertain as the Beer You’re Drinking"

by TheAfghanTwilight on Jan 16, 2009 12:19 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

The are other TE's in the draft besides Gresham.......plus there are FA out there.....

so there is some other choices out there……it just depends on OBD

12/19/08 - Thank you KLJ for coming into my life.

by norcaliangelsfan on Jan 16, 2009 12:21 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I think Royal will still be gone, it'll just happen post draft

I think the Bills will make the call after they see who they can get in the draft. There a lot of kids who are good pass catchers and runners this year in the draft in the 3rd-5th rounds due to the Spread offenses proliferation which has a premium on a pass catching seam stretching TE. We got our blocker in Fine and our utility guy in Schou, I think if we get a pass catcher come this draft, Royal is toast.

Now if only this gopher could play DE, we would be doing better, I mean, who couldn't play better than the corpse brothers Kelsay and Denney?

by WABillsfan on Jan 16, 2009 5:10 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

from your typing......to Ralph's ears....

12/19/08 - Thank you KLJ for coming into my life.

by norcaliangelsfan on Jan 16, 2009 8:52 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

There are indeed other players very capable of being NFL TE’s in the draft…..In fact, there are at least 4-5 2nd-4th round level TE’s that can have a very meaningful impact on our passing game….

~K
"I’m Kurupt with Buffalo Rumblings. I am worth hundreds!"

by Kurupt on Jan 16, 2009 12:24 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I truly hope so. I just don’t know yet if OBD can find and coach that player.

"Buffalo Bills Football 2009 (sponsored by Labatt): A Future as Uncertain as the Beer You’re Drinking"

by TheAfghanTwilight on Jan 16, 2009 12:27 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Milquetoast

Well played, sir. You have also given me a new name for Jauron. Since King of CAC quickly fell out of favor, Milquetoast Jauron has a golden opportunity to assume an important role at Rumblings….

I see where you are going with this article, but in a way, I don’t fully agree. Other than Bradford and maybe Gresham and Spikes, I’m not sure how any of the others really would have any impact on the Bills. Bradford could be top 10, so a player would get pushed down. Gresham and Spikes were potential picks for the Bills, but I’m not sure any teams higher, maybe Spikes. The others really have no impact on the Bills #11 pick.

They could impact the 2nd rounder though, pushing a bit more talent down to the Bills. Too bad there aren’t more top 2-3 round Center prospects that had the ability to come out early….

This is a franchise that values draft picks, so a move down to stockpile selections seems like a strong possibility as well.

That I do disagree with. Values draft picks? Is that why they’ve traded away top 75 picks to go after questionable talents in McCargo and Poz? Is that why they didn’t take an offer from Denver to move down in 2006 in order to stay put for Whitner?? They haven’t traded down in a draft to get more picks since….2001? That worked out quite well if I do recall. I think if anything, this franchise has devalued draft picks in a sense. As a team that should have been rebuilding in 2006, they seemed to go the opposite way….

~K
"I’m Kurupt with Buffalo Rumblings. I am worth hundreds!"

by Kurupt on Jan 16, 2009 12:44 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Is that why they’ve traded away top 75 picks to go after questionable talents in McCargo and Poz? Is that why they didn’t take an offer from Denver to move down in 2006 in order to stay put for Whitner?? They haven’t traded down in a draft to get more picks since….2001?

The trades in-draft are so vastly different situation-to-situation that it’s hard to lump them all under one “they don’t value draft picks” argument. They didn’t take that deal from Denver because – whether we agree with it or not – Whitner was the top guy on their list, and they believed that Detroit was going to take him at #9, so they got their guy. The McCargo trade sucks in hindsight, but at the time, they were making a move for the only “good” DT left on the board. To call Poz a questionable talent, I think, is a bit absurd at this point.

At any rate, I was more dealing with the fact that the Bills have had a lot of draft picks. They’ve traded players for picks – Spikes, McGahee, etc., hell, they even tried with McCargo – fairly often for an NFL team. Those guys had fallen out of favor in Buffalo, but they were pretty well-established vets (save McCargo) when they were dealt. That’s what I meant when I said “values draft picks”. Are you saying that there’s NO chance that the Bills trade down in April?

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by Brian Galliford on Jan 16, 2009 12:54 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Well trading away guys who were gone regardless is just getting something for dead weight. Not sure that’s valuing draft picks as I would define it. I consider valuing draft picks the way the Pats, Eagles, etc go about it. They acquire as many as possible on draft day and very, very rarely give up those higher picks.

The McCargo trade was bad because they were basically giving away picks just to fill a positional need. Had they simply picked Ngata, none of that would have been an issue, but that’s not the discussion here. I do think Poz is a questionable talent. Not questionable in that he’s a borderline starter or whatever, but questionable in the sense that I didn’t think he was worth trading up for.

Obviously there’s always a chance they could trade down, it just doesn’t seem very likely. I’m not saying I want them to trade down either (unless the top DE’s are off the board). It just doesn’t seem like their MO.

~K
"I’m Kurupt with Buffalo Rumblings. I am worth hundreds!"

by Kurupt on Jan 16, 2009 1:05 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I have to agree with Kurupt in some point of view. Draft is not a best place to fill a positional need. You fill your needs os FA, and draft you can add talent to yor team.
But, I don’t agree with Kurupt’s point of view about Poz. They trade up for him and after his first full season he did a decent job there. I still think he can improve, but it for another discussion.
About juniors nothing getting in, can hurt a little, especially in our first round, but I still think there are a lot of good talents in outhers rounds there who can contribute a lot for us. If the scouts and FO do a good job, they can do a good draft, but the FO has to do their job on the FA.

by hightower_mc on Jan 16, 2009 10:15 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Pete Carroll sound a bit selfish...

in stating he feels Sanchez should be returning for a 5th year. Come on now. I don’t know much about the kid, but did he not get his undergrad finished in the 4 years?

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Jan 16, 2009 1:38 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

actually just answered my own question:

Sanchez said he came to USC to get an education, to compete at the highest college level and earn a chance to play in the NFL.

“I’m proud to say that this spring, I’ll have the opportunity to do both,” said Sanchez, on track to receive his degree in communications.

His father, Nick, said he had mixed emotions about his son’s decision to enter the draft.

“As a parent, I’d like for him to stay in school for another 10 years,” he said. “But it’s great to see a young man trying to live his dream.”


I also didn’t know he only started 1 season.

"Buffalo Bills Football 2009 (sponsored by Labatt): A Future as Uncertain as the Beer You’re Drinking"

by TheAfghanTwilight on Jan 16, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

He had one more year of eligibility

But he didn’t need to use it. He graduated and is going pro. What more could he want??

Playing Eternal Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008.

by MattRichWarren on Jan 16, 2009 2:47 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Nothing, nothing at all

Especially with Tebow and Bradford staying? He just made himself a huge huge huge pile of money coming out.

Smart kid, and I don’t mean just because he gradtuated on time either!

Now if only this gopher could play DE, we would be doing better, I mean, who couldn't play better than the corpse brothers Kelsay and Denney?

by WABillsfan on Jan 16, 2009 5:13 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

He started a couple last year when John David Booty got hurt.....

speaking of which….the Vikings have their answer at QB with him…..if given a shot….in that dome….he’ll be more than servicable.

12/19/08 - Thank you KLJ for coming into my life.

by norcaliangelsfan on Jan 16, 2009 8:54 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

After this year, teams may be more willing to give their playoff teams to rookies....

although how are USC QBs doing now? Palmer, Leinart…. nope on the Heisman winners…. What about that other USC QB going to Minnesota? I can see Matt Cassell there.

Playing Eternal Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008.

by MattRichWarren on Jan 17, 2009 10:22 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Avoid Michael Johnson

HE had a terrible season and didn’t even play on all downs. His stock has dropped significantly and I don’t understand why so many people are high on him.
Doubt Bills would draft a tight end in first round, since they have more serious needs at other positions. I love Mack, who has been All-American for last two years, and Curry from Wake Forest is ranked in the top-5 now!
Brandon Spikes would have been a nice fit for the Bills.
Brandon Pettigrew is still ranked as the #1 tight end out of Oklahoma State.

by BuffaloWhiner on Jan 19, 2009 10:46 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

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