Was Wade Phillips really that bad?

by sireric on Oct 7, 2009 8:48 PM EDT Comment 26 comments

When I think back to the end of the 2000 season, all I remember is the collective sign of relief from Bills fans after Wade Phillips was fired. I never understood it. I though Wade did an o.k. job. So the question is, would you rather have Wade still here? First lets look at some history:

Quick! Name the winning-est coaches in Bills history. Well first is obviously Marv Levy. With 112 wins over 11.5 seasons, (not counting 11 post season wins) Marv is tops on the Bills coaching wins list. Lou Saban is second with 68 wins over 8.5 seasons, (again not counting his 2 post season victories). Third is Chuck Knox who in 5 years collected 37 wins, (1 post season win again not counted). Right now those three men are the no-contest top three coaches in Bills history. I suppose you could debate the order if you want (Lou had shorter seasons and did win two championships, a case could be made for Saban over Marv), but that isn't the point of this post. Next on the wins list? I'll give you a hint: It's not Kay Stephenson, Jim Ringo, Gregg Williams, or Joe Collier. Thats right Wade Phillips is next on the list with 29 career victories. He also made two post season appearances, yes his post season record for the Bills is 0-2, but he got there twice...in three years. In three years Wade has 29 wins and two playoff appearances...not bad. Want to know how bad the Bills coaching records are? Dick Jauron is currently 5th on the list with 22.

After Wade caught the axe from Ralph, the Bills then brought in Gregg Williams who's 3 year record for the Bills is 17 - 31, with no play-offs. After Double G, it was Mike Mularkey who ran up a record of 14 - 18 in two years. Mularkey did lead the Bills to their last winning season at 9-7 in 2004. After Mularkey it has been Dick Jauron...need I say more?

So the question is was Wade Phillips all that bad? 29 - 19 and two play-off appearances in three years looks pretty good right about now. Sometimes you need to be careful what you ask for Bills fans, sometimes the coach you know is better then the coach you don't know. I'm not saying that Jauron shouldn't be fired if the Bills continue to stink it up, just that there are some worse coaches out there that might just have us pining to have D.J. back once he is gone.

Ralph doesn't really have the greatest history when it comes to making hires. He seems to be more of a "shoot from the hip" kind of guy, who follows his gut feeling more often then not. Sometimes it works, he hired Bill Polian without doing very much research, sometimes not, Hank Bullough, John Rauch...need I go on? If Ralph does in fact clean house, I'm not sure that we can all count on him to hire the right guy, he has a history of under paying his coaches and quite honestly, I'm not sure we will get the big name guy that we are all craving. It may get worse before it gets better....

This FanPost was written by a registered user of Buffalo Rumblings. Its views do not necessarily reflect the views of Rumblings' editorial staff, but are just as valued as our own.

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Not sure that your point (the last paragraph) matches the title.

I think what the historical data you provided shows is that after Levy, Saban, and Knox, the Bills haven’t had any other good coaches. Phillips was the best of an extremely mediocre-to-bad bunch.

I remain convinced that somehow Drew Rosenhaus negotiated a playing time deal for Roscoe into the contract for TO.

by thefourwinds on Oct 7, 2009 9:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I wasn’t really sure what to name it. Maybe the title doesn’t fit, but you get the point. Maybe Wade is the best of a bad bunch, but the point is that it could be much worse.

No weekend spent pantsless is a wasted weekend.

by sireric on Oct 7, 2009 9:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

it could be much worse

Reminds me of the scene in Monty Python’s Life of Brian where the guy heading up the stoning tells the guy who’s about to get stoned, “You’re only making it worse for yourself,” to which the guy about to get stoned replies, “How could it be worse?? Jehovah, Jehovah, Jehovah!”

I remain convinced that somehow Drew Rosenhaus negotiated a playing time deal for Roscoe into the contract for TO.

by thefourwinds on Oct 7, 2009 9:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

but it was a lovely piece of fish

The past is fixed, the future is unknown, try dealing with the present!

by gregeng on Oct 9, 2009 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

It is a great example of how expectations have changed

At the time Wade was hired, Bills fans were used to and expected to make the playoffs every year. Wade might be able to get you to the playoffs, but isn’t going to get you to the SuperBowl. Fans saw that. Fast forward to the present. Bills fans would dance naked in the streets if we could win a meaningful game in December.

Poor ball security leads to very painful outcomes

by Joe P. on Oct 7, 2009 10:06 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

sadly yes I would

by guruu on Oct 7, 2009 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

At least then I would have a reason to be naked in the streets…

"Next time I get the opportunity I am going to hold on and make a better decision." ~ Leodis McKelvin. (Can't ask for anythitng more than that)

by NolaBillsFan on Oct 8, 2009 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Bills fans would dance naked in the streets if we could win a meaningful game in December.

Where I come from, this is called New Years Eve

by bluecollarbuffalo on Oct 10, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Unfortunately I agree with you

If the Bills didn’t get screwed in the Music City Miricale Wade would have definetly kept his job and the debate over Flutie and Rob Johnson would have been settled. Not many people remember that it was Rob Johnson who played well in that game and led the Bills down the field for the go ahead FG with :05 left. In 99% of NFL games you could have considered that a win but it didn’t happen and both of them were sent packing. I’m not saying he would still be the coach today but he sure would have had a few more years and maybe Donahue (not sure when he came aboard?) would never have been hired.
Kind of like wide right (sorry everyone) we are a cursed franchise…… Go Bills!!!!

by Honestabe75 on Oct 7, 2009 11:29 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Wade's not a bad coach.

I’d rather have him over Jauron, but I see no superbowl wins in Wade’s future.

There's not a wide receiver who is fast enough, that J.P. Losman can't overthrow him on a fly pattern.

by The Buffalo Kid on Oct 8, 2009 3:42 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

There’s only been what, 6 SB-winning coaches since Wade Phillips was fired…right

Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.

by TheAfghanTwilight on Oct 8, 2009 7:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

He should have started Flutie.

by TJJ on Oct 8, 2009 8:06 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Johnson had the game won. The kick coverage unit lost the game, not Johnson, and you can’t tell me that Flutie would have made the tackle on special teams if he was the starting QB.

No weekend spent pantsless is a wasted weekend.

by sireric on Oct 8, 2009 9:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I know how the game played out and it was a fluke loss. That doesn’t change my opinion that Flutie should have started that game, he earned it., he was 10-5 if I remember correctly.

by TJJ on Oct 8, 2009 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sure Flutie earned the start, and I agree, but Johnson didn’t lose that game and I hate when people insinuate that the Bills would have won that game if Flutie started. I’m not saying that that is what you meant, but I get touchy with that one…

No weekend spent pantsless is a wasted weekend.

by sireric on Oct 8, 2009 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Fair enough, and no I’m definitely not saying that is what lost the game or that the Bills would have won if Flutie started. I don’t even disagree with your post, that is just the first thing that sticks in my mind when I remember Wade’s tenure with the Bills.

Just a controversial decision that I didn’t agree with. According to Wade he was forced to make the move by Ralph, so it may not have been his decision anyways.

by TJJ on Oct 8, 2009 10:39 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Simple answer

"Potential just means you haven’t done sh## yet"

by willgarr15 on Oct 8, 2009 10:50 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

The reason Wade got fired is cause he couldn’t win a playoff game (and still hasn’t) and the Bills franchise thought bringing in another HC could change that, unfortunately it backfired.
I don’t think any fan out there wouldn’t love to see a playoff game, but after losing two, wouldn’t you want to win a playoff game?
DJ just comes across as mediocre – just like Wade can’t win a playoff game; DJ can’t get to the playoffs… and I don’t want a front office or HC that can’t get to a playoff game in what looks like 4 yrs

I was born in Buffalo, and NO, it's not a suburb of New York City

by Ghetts on Oct 8, 2009 1:33 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Wade was/is a great coach. Ralph Wilson just seemingly blew a gasket and couldn’t bear having him around anymore. It’s sad, because he’s the last good coach this team has had, and he was coach at a time when John Butler was still capable at calling the shots from the GM office. I wish we’d kept him on. The Bills twice made the playoffs under his watch. It seems a moot point about whether Buffalo would have him now — that’s just not happening — or whether Flutie would have won the Music City Miracle (I think he surely would have played the Bills to a better lead).

Mmmph rrgh prrmf! - someone with his mouth gagged

by Dyl on Oct 8, 2009 1:46 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

No he wasn’t. He wasn’t that great but he wasn’t that bad.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Ignoring the grumblings on Rumblings.

by MattRichWarren on Oct 8, 2009 2:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I agree

He’s not bad, he’s just not great.

He’ll get you to the playoffs, he’ll help your D if you run a 3-4, he won’t win a super bowl.

The saddest part is he is better than Jauron.

There's not a wide receiver who is fast enough, that J.P. Losman can't overthrow him on a fly pattern.

by The Buffalo Kid on Oct 10, 2009 1:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

He’ll get you to the playoffs

Sign me up! I just want to watch a playoff game with the Bills in it again. People talked about Marty Schottenheimer (sp?) a few years back and some responded “He can’t win in the playoffs”. We’ll cross that bridge when we get there! All I know, is that while approaching said bridge, I will have a smile on my face.

by bluecollarbuffalo on Oct 10, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Bill Cowher didn’t win the super bowl till his 13th year. Sometimes you have to stick with a coach. (I am not saying stick with Jauron)

"I lost my mind three months ago when I woke up married to a pineapple, an ugly pineapple... I still love her though."

by Seattlite on Oct 9, 2009 12:16 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Cowher was able to muster up more than seven wins in each of his first 3 seasons.

I think that says it all for Dick.

There's not a wide receiver who is fast enough, that J.P. Losman can't overthrow him on a fly pattern.

by The Buffalo Kid on Oct 10, 2009 1:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wade Philips is a lousy HC

I think he’s a good DC but a horrible HC, I hate his decision making.

Either believe in your team or don’t coach it
FEED the BEAST!

by keysh67 on Oct 9, 2009 10:53 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Unfortunately for Wade, in his last two positions, he’s had meddling owners. Ralph Wilson stepping in and ordering a Johnson start before the playoffs is beyond ludicrous (even if you agreed w/ the decision). And Jerry Jones….well, we all know about Jerry Jones.

by bluecollarbuffalo on Oct 10, 2009 1:31 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs