More Dungy commentary on Vick-to-Buffalo speculation

by Brian Galliford on Nov 11, 2009 12:51 PM EST in News Comment 104 comments

Former Indianapolis Colts head coach Tony Dungy made quite the splash Sunday night when he mentioned in passing the possibility of quarterback Michael Vick becoming a member of the Buffalo Bills in 2010. We discussed that story on Monday, but Dungy has now made further comments about what he terms "speculation" on Vick-to-Buffalo.

I've got three things to discuss briefly on the topic. After the jump: Dungy's contradiction, Dungy's opinion, and Dungy's assertion.

Dungy's contradiction
Here's what Dungy said on NBC's Football Night in America on Sunday night:

If (Philadelphia wants) him back, (Vick) has to stay there. If they don't, there are some teams looking for quarterbacks - Cleveland, St. Louis and Washington. But I think a dark horse is Buffalo... They talked originally. There was some communication there. I think that could be a good spot.

Here's what Dungy said today (text provided by Tim Graham):

I mentioned Cleveland, Washington and St. Louis as obvious teams, but stated that one, not-so-obvious choice could be Buffalo. I don't have any inside information but just feel that the Bills have some excellent players at their skill positions and could be a place where Michael - or any QB for that matter - would flourish.

Well, that's a fascinating little contradiction, is it not? (If you missed it, just read the bold words.)

Dungy is obviously very close to this situation. He's served as a mentor to Vick even before his release from prison, and without Dungy's presence, there's a very strong chance that Vick never makes it back into pro football, period. Dungy is a respected mind, and has almost innumerable coaching connections in the league. Any team that discussed signing Vick back in August would have been insane to not solicit Dungy's opinion on Vick and his reformation as a person.

Knowing what we know now, no matter how Dungy tried to amend that first claim today, it still appears more likely that Buffalo did contact Dungy about Vick and, for all we know, discussed the possibility of signing him. As I'm sure you all recall, there was a vicious little Internet rumor last August that the Bills were interested in him, and it was quickly shot down not just by the team, but by local media as well. Buffalo's interest may have only been exploratory, but at the very least, I'd be willing to bet that Buffalo placed a phone call to Dungy last August. I'd also be willing to bet that the call wasn't placed by Dick Jauron - he had, for better or worse (and I think we now have that answer), committed to Trent Edwards at that point. If that call was made, it came from a more important office than Jauron's.

Dungy's opinion
As ESPN's Graham pointed out in this article, Dungy has some veiled, not-so-transparent viewpoints about the current quarterback situation in Buffalo.

... the Bills have some excellent players at their skill positions and could be a place where Michael - or any QB for that matter - would flourish.

Following logically, if any quarterback can flourish in Buffalo, why haven't Trent Edwards or Ryan Fitzpatrick this season? They must not be quarterbacks, right? It says something when a coach that tried to ride players like Trent Dilfer, Shaun King and Brad Johnson to post-season success thinks your quarterbacks stink.

Dungy's right. There are two things that can make or break a coach in the NFL: having a good quarterback, or having a dominant defense. Dungy took Tampa Bay to the playoffs in four of six seasons thanks largely to building one of the NFL's most dominant defenses ever, but he got fired because he didn't have the quarterback to finish the job in the post-season. He won 85 games in seven seasons (and a Super Bowl) with Indianapolis for one big reason: Peyton Manning. I mentioned Dilfer and Johnson above - yes, both won championships, but both rode the coattails of dominant defenses. Notice, too, that both coaches they won with - Brian Billick and Jon Gruden - are out of football, and not of their own accord the way Dungy is.

It won't matter who that next head coach is, folks, unless he builds himself a legendary defense or finds himself a good quarterback. Which, of course, leads us to Dungy's assertion.

Dungy's assertion
To assert something, you need to have an opinion, and vice versa. Clearly, Dungy still believes that Vick can play quarterback at a high level in the NFL. That's his opinion; his assertion, in the quote that I've mentioned twice now, is that Vick would flourish in Buffalo. And really, when talking about the possibility of Vick in a Bills uniform, isn't that all that matters?

Dungy himself has continuously stressed the fact that Vick needs an established, controlled environment to be an efficient person, let alone a good football player. Right now, that notion is nothing but a pipe dream in Buffalo. That's not to say that the Bills don't have solid individuals in their football hierarchy - there are clear advantages to having men like Russ Brandon, Tom Modrak and even Jauron around - but Ralph Wilson hasn't had a cohesive plan for his football team since Tom Donahoe's failure became apparent. For four years, the Bills have functioned without a true GM or a singular, visionary voice from the front office, and that's absolutely had a trickle-down effect to the team's play. If that doesn't change, any new coach/quarterback combination would be facing long odds right from the start.

On the field, though, it makes a bit more sense. Forgetting about all of Vick's misdeeds and the controversy that still surrounds those actions, and assuming that Vick's skills have not deteriorated to the point that he's only a shell of his former self, he'd certainly be the most established quarterback to play in Buffalo since Drew Bledsoe. No, that's not a particularly ringing endorsement, but the chance exists, at least, that Vick could resurrect his career in Buffalo. Again, question his quarterback abilities and his person all you want, but a 38-28-1 record is something many Bills fans would jump at without (many) question(s) right now.

This is a story that isn't going to die for a while, folks. It's pretty apparent that the Bills contacted Dungy about Vick this past August - and even if it was only exploratory, it's still interesting. Buffalo clearly needs a quarterback, and there's no guarantee that they'd be able to get their guy in next year's draft. It would take a minor miracle for Vick to resurrect his career anywhere, let alone in Buffalo, where the organization is in need of a massive face lift. But Wilson has proven in recent seasons that he'll make cosmetic changes rather than do things the right way, so Vick to Buffalo isn't completely out of the question. Feel free to continue to solidify your stance on the issue as we discuss in the comments section, but don't expect the story to go away.

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AHHHH

It’s like a bad dream I can’t wake up from…
And honestly I don’t think Vick has ‘it’ to be a force like he once was and I think if the Bills traded anything for Vick it would be a waste. I would rather pick up Culpepper off of FA then trade for Vick.

I was born in Buffalo, and NO, it's not a suburb of New York City

by Ghetts on Nov 11, 2009 1:00 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Does this make Tony Dungy a liar that fans shouldn’t trust?

But seriously, his comments were never really a big deal. Originally, all he did was list every team he thought might go after a QB this offseason and Buffalo happened to be one of them. Buffalo is going to be talked about as a potential landing spot for VIck because Buffalo needs a QB and for no other reason. We need to get used to that.

Personally, I feel like Vick is a terrible option for any team that won’t fully commit to him and either a spread offense that’s still run heavy or an offense like Atlanta ran that just pounded the run and used bootlegs and playaction to open up things for Vick. I think pairing a young pocket QB with Michael Vick and letting them battle it out is a bad idea because I want an offensive system built around our players and not some scheme that looks great on paper.

I signed up for Second Life about a year ago. Back then my life was so great that I literally wanted a second one. In my Second Life I was also a paper salesman and I was also named Dwight. Absolutely everything was the same. Except I could fly. - Dwight Schrute

by kaisertown on Nov 11, 2009 1:02 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Does this make Tony Dungy a liar that fans shouldn’t trust?

Negative. I agree that the comments aren’t that big of a deal, but the whole situation – particularly that contradiction – fascinates me. I hate myself for even bringing this up twice in one week, but when I saw that contradiction, I couldn’t not address it. :)

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"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott

by Brian Galliford on Nov 11, 2009 1:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, I was mostly joking after the whole Russ Brandon lied debate of a few days ago. There aren’t many people in sports who are more trustworthy than Tony Dungy.

by kaisertown on Nov 11, 2009 1:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Am I the only one who reads into it as the Bills’ brass contacting Dungy and telling him to alter his original comment? I can see them playing damage control here.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 11, 2009 2:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

No, you're not alone.

They are hard to play but not hard to beat.
- Mike Lombardi on the Buffalo Bills

by Sluss88 on Nov 11, 2009 3:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Would they do that when any media person brings up the team

or their future?

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Nov 12, 2009 1:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Dungy didn't even contradict himself

There’s no lies going on here. Dungy certainly had inside info last August, but when he said in the interview that he doesn’t have inside information, he is talking about the current situation, not last August. The current situation is this: Mike Vick plays for the Eagles. Since the trade deadline has passed, the Bills are not allowed to talk to the Eagles, Vick, his agent or anyone else about acquiring Vick. There are harsh penalties for “tampering” so the Bills flat out would not be doing that right now. Dungy never said that they were. He was strictly speculating that 1. The Bills team might be a good fit for Vick and 2. Since the Bills showed a trace of interest last summer, it might not be out of the question. He didn’t say anything more than that. This whole story has been blown way out of proportion. I seriously doubt that Vick will be coming to Buffalo unless it is as a backup. The Bills will try (probably in vain) to draft the next starting QB.

by Polish Lover on Nov 12, 2009 11:09 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I think pairing a young pocket QB with Michael Vick and letting them battle it out is a bad idea because I want an offensive system built around our players and not some scheme that looks great on paper.

I think it’s a terrible idea on many levels but here’s one I haven’t thrown out there yet. Say Buffalo keeps Edwards or drafts a pocket passer. The team installs an offense for Vick, who then either is ineffective (almost a certainty) or gets injured (fairly likely). Enter the pocket passer…into an offense for which he is not at all suited. Plus, Vick has, what, maybe 3-4 years of football left in him?

Buffalo may be a great fit for Vick but Vick is not a great fit for Buffalo.

Of course we could make things more challenging, Lisa, but then the stupider students would be in here complaining, furrowing their brows in a vain attempt to understand the situation--Seymour Skinner

by Ron From NM on Nov 11, 2009 1:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

But

When Vick was hurt in ATL, Matt Schaub came in and played quite well. It can be done…

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Nov 11, 2009 1:41 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs

Didn’t the Falcons pretty much re-tool their entire offensive scheme when Schaub came into the game? Also, wasn’t Atlanta one of the better rushing teams in the league at that time?

by Ron From NM on Nov 11, 2009 2:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Vick was in and out of the lineup during Schaub’s time in Atlanta. Seems, nearly everytime Schaub came in, he was successful. So, for argument’s sake, you can “re-tool” your offense on the fly if you have a situation like the Falcon’s did in the past.

Please don’t let my comments make you think I am for the Vick signing. I didn’t think he was a Superbowl QB in his Prime (which I think we can all agree has since past).

We don’t need to bring in a QB unless we think he can win it all…

by Slick Shifty on Nov 11, 2009 2:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I’d argue he’s not past his prime. This season can only be viewed as a wash. He just got out of a federal program. This was the time period for him to become matriculated back into the league. He’s going to be 30, and if like any other QB, should have plenty of great years ahead of him and a better ability to understand defenses. His game may have changed, but he might still have great abilities, once he’s back in game shape.

I don’t see him coming to B-lo, but I don’t think signing him would be as horrible (play-wise) as doom and gloom.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 11, 2009 3:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Tough sell...

I agree that a lot of QB’s have plenty of good years ahead of them after 30, but just like a RB, Vick’s legs are his biggest assett. His prime was when he could still run…without that burst of speed, he might as well be Jeff George.. Rocket arm, but no accuracy.

by Slick Shifty on Nov 12, 2009 10:58 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Well

Haven’t many people on this blog had the notion that buffalo should become a run first type of offense? I mean the wheather dictates that maybe we should move more to that approach anyways. And think about it, if they do bring in vick, do you think maybe that would open the door wider for a mobile qb to be drafted? Someone named tebow or lafavour (I don’t know how to spell his name and I don’t care enough to look it up). I really could care less about vick and his past indescretions, he has been making amends for them all season. There’s a point you have to let it go. The man did have some good talent back there and I think a place like buffalo (that should focus more on the run anyways) would be a good fit.

Buffalo, that's where it's at baby. - Adam 'Pacman' Jones

by silverstreak3k on Nov 11, 2009 2:26 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs

The team already has QBs for an offense not built for them: the now-scrapped no huddle.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 11, 2009 2:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

But the no huddle vs. huddle doesn’t change the offense. It just changes pacing.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008.
"Matt’s pretty valuable to y’all. Cherish him." - BG

by MattRichWarren on Nov 11, 2009 2:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I think a true no-huddle changes the offense quite a bit. It changes the amount of plays that are designed and called, changes who calls them, changes the way a QB’s brain needs to read and react. I think the no-huddle was a huge gamble from the start. People had starry eyes for the old no-huddle. Too bad the team doesn’t have those stars.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 11, 2009 3:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

oddly enough

The Bills best offensive performances this season were when they were running the no-huddle… Ever since they scrapped it, the penalties have reduced, but so have the yards gained and the points scored… Injuries on the o-line were making it hard to avoid penalties in the no-huddle, but at least the team was moving the ball and scoring. The Bills averaged 28.5 points in the first two games (one of which was vs the Patriots). Since then, 11 per game. Without the 20 points against Carolina, the numbers are even uglier…

by Polish Lover on Nov 12, 2009 11:16 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

kaiser: I could get used to a Bills team that fully realized and utilized the potential of playaction. I don’t know if the team has the time to build for Vick (the natives are restless), but I also don’t know if Vick would be much more a degradation from what an unproven rookie would bring to the table. Long term, probably, but 3 years – who knows.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 11, 2009 2:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I'd rather wait if I knew they were bulding something

Honestly, if there was a goal that we could see I would rather wait and build around a guy, or a group of players than win right away. This is what Tampa Bay is doing. I think they are going to be a good team next year. They are grooming a young QB slowly and have a lot of young talent down there. However, I do agree that if we are going to build, let’s build for a young QB rather than an aging QB who might have lost a step.

B-B-B-Byrd Byrd Byrd, Byrd is the Wyrd!"

by willgarr15 on Nov 12, 2009 6:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Agree with Kaiser

That still leaves us without an answer to our QB problem though. I do agree with Dungy in the aspect that a decent QB could come into Buffalo and flourish because of the players we have in our skill positions.

Excuses are a sign of weakness!!!!!!

by VanScottM on Nov 11, 2009 1:06 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

If all of this came out in like, May or June, then it’s a big story.

But since we are in Novemeber, and it looks like the Bills are starting over (hopefully!) in January, I don’t think this story carries any weight. New GM/Coach = There own choice @ QB. Less then 40% chance it’s Vick.

by Michael_Necci on Nov 11, 2009 1:11 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

not a Vick fan but...

until our O-Line proves that they can consistently block and open holes, we do need a QB that can scramble (or run for their lives)! I do remember Vick playing for the Falcons and the Bills dominated the game, but Vick ran away from the pressure and stole the win. If he still has the skill to change a game like that, then that gives the team some time to develop a QB of the future – something we never allow to happen as well as let the O line develop.

by brewSTL on Nov 11, 2009 1:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i think Trent

comes out playing with a chip on his shoulder after the fans have lost faith, Fitzpatrick won some games and now this. I expect him to fire downfield a lot. Expect big plays and interceptions downfield being scooped up by Cortland Finnegan. I’m going to say Edwards statline Sunday: 3 TDs, 3 INTs, 289 yards.

Lucky for us, I bet Vince Young’s honeymoon ends with some picks too.

To me, the sucker is the person who runs when there’s trouble, especially when this situation was so easily foreshadowed….

by poz on Nov 11, 2009 1:27 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

3 TDs, 3 INTs, 289 yards

You know, I wouldn’t mind that stat line one bit. Sure, it would be better with 0 INTs but man it would mean that Edwards was letting it rip. Plus, when is the last time a Buffalo QB topped 300 yards in a game?

by Ron From NM on Nov 11, 2009 1:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I know it was a rhetorical question, but I thought it might be worth noting for the others:

JP Losman passed for 340 yds against the Houston Texans on Nov. 19, 2006. That’s almost THREE years ago.

"They're Killin' Me Whitey. They're Killin' Me" -- Lou Saban

by NJBill on Nov 11, 2009 2:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Yep, that was the last 300 yrd QB in a Bills uniform, where 166 yards came on 2 passes. He did fall 5 yards short of 300 when they played Cinci the following year.

I don’t know who’s had it worse from the QB positon: Buffalo or Chicago.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 11, 2009 3:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Buffalo

I’d take Kyle Orton over Edwards any day. And they now have Cutler so I think it’s a no-contest

B-B-B-Byrd Byrd Byrd, Byrd is the Wyrd!"

by willgarr15 on Nov 12, 2009 6:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

it would mean that Edwards was letting it rip

Will he be a man or a mouse? Captain Check down or Captain Chuck it? Trentative or Trentastic?

"They're Killin' Me Whitey. They're Killin' Me" -- Lou Saban

by NJBill on Nov 11, 2009 2:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

If he’s going to let it rip, i’d prefer he doesn’t stink up the joint.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 11, 2009 4:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

trentative

ha.

terrific nickname.

by sri on Nov 11, 2009 7:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i agree, Ron

at this point, just letting it rip is a step in the right direction.

To me, the sucker is the person who runs when there’s trouble, especially when this situation was so easily foreshadowed….

by poz on Nov 12, 2009 3:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I would love to see that...

but it probably is not going to happen, especially now that TO is injured!

They are hard to play but not hard to beat.
- Mike Lombardi on the Buffalo Bills

by Sluss88 on Nov 11, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Hardy is ready to come back in. :-)

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008.
"Matt’s pretty valuable to y’all. Cherish him." - BG

by MattRichWarren on Nov 11, 2009 1:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

What is the TO injury?

by TJJ on Nov 11, 2009 1:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Nevermind, I saw him listed as not injury related, just found the Chris Brown post.

by TJJ on Nov 11, 2009 1:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

It’s a strained hip. No idea WTF a strained hip is, but there you have it.

Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott

by Brian Galliford on Nov 11, 2009 2:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

It sounds like he needs to practice more, stretch more.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 11, 2009 3:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Well, if you spend as much time patting your back as he does, that will happen

Or maybe he did it while checking for a kick me sign that Trent placed there.

As my mother once said, common sense isn't as common as it should be, I'm looking at you Fewell, common sense says to play UP on the line against the slant.

by WABillsfan on Nov 11, 2009 6:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The whole situation is confusing...

To me it seems like Dungy really wants to say something else but obviously cant with the rules in the NFL that regulate tampering with another teams player… Hes putting Buffalo in a tough place too because they cant really comment on it at all for the same reasons.

While the whole Vick to Buffalo thing seems intreaging… I just dont see him ever being a starting quarterback in this league, I know he says he can or whatever but I just dont see it. Wasnt a good passer to begin with and he has lost a step or two…

Like I said Mike Vick to us is like duct tape… and you cant fix this team with duct tape. It needs to be rebuilt not patched up.

People in western New York would respect you a lot more if you went out, busted butt and they saw it in the way you did things on and off the field. - Darryl Talley

by bflo on Nov 11, 2009 1:31 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Can't we just wait until the offseason for this?

He is an Eagle still, after all.

Dungy probably sees Buffalo as the most desperate situation, that’s also more than willing to bring in the convict. Of the team in despeate need of a QB, the Bills might have been the only one interested this past summer.

I wish this story would die because its all speculation and conjecture right now.

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Nov 11, 2009 1:34 PM EST via mobile reply actions 0 recs

off the Vick topic.

I gotta ask about your sig… That cant be a real quote…can it? haha or is there another Chris Kelsey in the Louisiana govt? Either way its funny.

People in western New York would respect you a lot more if you went out, busted butt and they saw it in the way you did things on and off the field. - Darryl Talley

by bflo on Nov 11, 2009 1:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Edwin Edwards (awesome name) who was the Governer of Louisiana on three different occasions and is now in jail for being one of the most corrupt politicians in recent memory once said:

“The only way I can lose is if I’m caught in bed with either a dead girl or a live boy. "

by kaisertown on Nov 11, 2009 1:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Of course now if he were caught the the live boy he’d have some people come to his defense—NAMBLA types. I don’t know that anyone would try to bail him out if he were caught with the dead girl though…

by Ron From NM on Nov 11, 2009 2:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

ahh, NAMBLA. So funny that it’s a real thing. I remember watching the South Park episode that rips them and thinking there was no way in hell that a North American Man/Boy Love Association could actually exist, but freedom is a funny thing.

by kaisertown on Nov 11, 2009 2:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

hahahaha

wait this is a real thing?!

People in western New York would respect you a lot more if you went out, busted butt and they saw it in the way you did things on and off the field. - Darryl Talley

by bflo on Nov 11, 2009 2:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

http://www.nambla.org/

by kaisertown on Nov 11, 2009 2:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Probably not a link you want to click on at work.

Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.

by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 11, 2009 3:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

haha good call.

"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."

by bflo on Nov 11, 2009 5:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

It’s a terrible link to click on if anybody checks up on your internet activity or history. But as far as having it up on the screen, it’s no big deal. It’s actually a pretty classy site if you ignore that what they are fighting for is the right for grown men to have sexual relationships with underaged minors. It’s mostly news stories and pamphlet type info.

by kaisertown on Nov 11, 2009 7:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

im definately going to have to find that episode of South Park online

People in western New York would respect you a lot more if you went out, busted butt and they saw it in the way you did things on and off the field. - Darryl Talley

by bflo on Nov 11, 2009 2:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

http://www.southparkstudios.com/guide/406/

by kaisertown on Nov 11, 2009 2:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

haha

damn every question I ask you answer. Like my own personal google right here on the rumblings. lol

People in western New York would respect you a lot more if you went out, busted butt and they saw it in the way you did things on and off the field. - Darryl Talley

by bflo on Nov 11, 2009 2:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I try to watch every south park

You’d be surprised how righ they are on alot of issues/organizations. You should watch their Scientology episode.

Buffalo, that's where it's at baby. - Adam 'Pacman' Jones

by silverstreak3k on Nov 11, 2009 2:31 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs

the pirate episode might be one of my favorites.

People in western New York would respect you a lot more if you went out, busted butt and they saw it in the way you did things on and off the field. - Darryl Talley

by bflo on Nov 11, 2009 2:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

hahaha alright thanks. I figured Kelseys name got thrown in there as a joke. Thats pretty funny that he actually said that tho.

People in western New York would respect you a lot more if you went out, busted butt and they saw it in the way you did things on and off the field. - Darryl Talley

by bflo on Nov 11, 2009 2:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Amen

by TJJ on Nov 11, 2009 1:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Vick would help at the Q.B position

Since our line is so bad, they give our “pocket” Q.B’s no time the throw the ball. Vick would probably help because he is very good at escaping a collapsing pocket. I dunno If I want Vick, but as of now, with our horrible line, Vick would be an upgrade at the position.

by csc06258 on Nov 11, 2009 1:55 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I agree, not that I think he’s the answer, but maybe the ST fix while drafting a money rook!

They are hard to play but not hard to beat.
- Mike Lombardi on the Buffalo Bills

by Sluss88 on Nov 11, 2009 3:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Dungy's contradiction

i think when he says he has no inside information, he is talking about current information related to him possibly coming to Buffalo next year. He is basing on his past info from the Bills inquiries last offseason, IMO

Good Luck With Your Firings Mr. Wilson….Go Bills!

by killascript on Nov 11, 2009 1:58 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I read this the same way you did. I don’t think it is necessarily a contradiction.

by TJJ on Nov 11, 2009 2:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I think (hope) that you’re right — that it’s just the old info from the summer.

Dungy’s contradiction, if you want to call it that, or slip, or insult to Edwards, though is intriguing. Intriguing because he seems to be promoting Vick as a starting QB. While I have to respect Dungy’s opinion, I cannot understand how Vick would be an asset at this point to any team with a weak or struggling O line. I can’t help but think that Dungy is putting the most optimistic possible spin on Vick’s situation — optimistic for Vick, not for the team that employs him.

by Sixteenthback on Nov 11, 2009 2:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

That is exactly right. To me, he’s acting more as an agent than a football coach at this time. I don’t think his intentions are poor, I just think it’s confusing whether he’s acting as Vick’s representative or an independent 3rd party.

Official ledge-talker-offer of the Buffalo Bills.

by WhyBillsWhy on Nov 11, 2009 3:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Dungy could be making a play to be a coach as well

Good Luck With Your Firings Mr. Wilson….Go Bills!

by killascript on Nov 11, 2009 4:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

not-so-obvious choice could be Buffalo. I don’t have any inside information but just feel that the Bills have some excellent players at their skill positions and could be a place where Michael – or any QB for that matter – would flourish.

I think what Dungy is saying is that, of the teams that need a QB, Buffalo is the most intriguing because we have the most weapons, talent, etc.

If you were a stud free agent QB, where would you rather go, St. Louis, Washington, Cleveland or Buffalo? I firmly believe we have more talent and are closer to winning than those other three teams.

by Slick Shifty on Nov 11, 2009 2:15 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

The Rams?

They’ve allowed the fewest sacks. You, know, if I’m a stud QB who wants to be lucid when I’m 50.

by oompaloompa on Nov 11, 2009 2:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Still in the bottom half of the NFL, mind you. My next criterion might be, who’s most committed to getting me some protection -

woops, that eliminates Buffalo.

by oompaloompa on Nov 11, 2009 2:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

as long as we are committing to a strategy of “youth” on the O-line, Vick might be the kind of guy we want -

RUN, MICHAEL, RUN!

by oompaloompa on Nov 11, 2009 2:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I hear that…

by Slick Shifty on Nov 12, 2009 10:59 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I think he'd prefer the fatest contract

And if he’s smart, he’d balance that with getting the best O line, without which he could fail and be soon cut. Buffalo should scare him at this point.

by Sixteenthback on Nov 11, 2009 2:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

um in the last 3 games the bills have allowed 4 sacks on fizz

by 14fizzpatrick on Nov 11, 2009 2:47 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

i hope its the trend and not Fitz’s superior pocket presence.

by oompaloompa on Nov 11, 2009 2:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

awareness – sorry, not presence.

by oompaloompa on Nov 11, 2009 2:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Fitz is much better at getting rid of the ball…now if those throws were in the vicinity of a receiver, then he’d be what the experts call “the complete package”. But he’s got that ball-leaving-the-hand part down pat.

"They're Killin' Me Whitey. They're Killin' Me" -- Lou Saban

by NJBill on Nov 11, 2009 3:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Ha! Can we put Fitz and Trent into one of those transporter machines like in the Fly? Then again, we might end up with a guy who hesitates to throw and has no accuracy.

by oompaloompa on Nov 12, 2009 9:43 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

well the 3 d line we have gone up vs are in the top 15 in nfl

by 14fizzpatrick on Nov 11, 2009 2:50 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

cautiously optimistic on your assurances.

seriously, though, I hope for Trent’s sake you are right. Beyond football, getting concussions so often is not good, and once you’ve had them, you just seem prone to getting them again and again. however his career turns out, I hope he can talk about it when he’s an old man.

by oompaloompa on Nov 11, 2009 2:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

ugh

Michael Vick….I’m so sick of hearing about this guy. He was never that good of a QB anyway, he was just an electryifing athlete in ATL. He’s not the same athlete anymore, he was in prison for ~20 months for crying out loud! He’s 29, players peak at 27 in the NFL and as athletes premium skill level (which is scary to think how good Lebron is going to get). I want a legit NFL QB. While Dungy thinks our QB’s stink, the players around them also stink. That OL was pathetic for 8 games as a unit. There are bright spots, but as a unit they performed poorly. Besides week 1 against NE, the offense has been ridiculously awful. Which is why I actually think with 2 weeks to prepare and get healthy they will come out very well this week in TEN. I expect the Bills to win this week. The problem is, they don’t have an identity and don’t do anything above average to sustain success week to week in the NFL.

My problem is like Brian pointed out. The trickle down effect of having no one voice. It will continue to prevent this franchise from ever being elite again. No matter what diva player(s) we bring in it is a moot point until a plan of how to build a team is in place

MARVelous - "I went from America's team to North America's Team" Terrell Owens

by MARVelous on Nov 11, 2009 3:02 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Amen

While acknowledging it’s impossible to know exactly what he has left given his (appropriate) lack of PT in Philly, I think it’s safe to say he didn’t get any better in prison, and he wasn’t that good to begin with. We should make him prove himself before we start clamoring for him; too bad they can’t loan him out to an arena football team or something like they do in soccer. Dungy talks about our team as if he just glanced at the roster: “hey, they have TO, Evans and Lynch, they should be good!” Yeah we have good skill players but who cares if your OL can’t give the QB time or open holes.

by Frank Reich Revolution on Nov 11, 2009 3:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

yes we got a beter o line then the 3 guys in the afc east think we do
well the d backs we have going vs are playing like decon jones

by 14fizzpatrick on Nov 11, 2009 3:03 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I know you are new so I’ll let you in on a trick. If you click “reply” at the bottom of the comment you are replying to it will respond nicely so nobody has to guess where it is supposed to be.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008.
"Matt’s pretty valuable to y’all. Cherish him." - BG

by MattRichWarren on Nov 11, 2009 5:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

thank you editor but i did hit reply to marvelous but the post was deleted that why it looks odd

by 14fizzpatrick on Nov 11, 2009 6:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

It wasn’t the only time you’ve done it. Just thought I’d let you know. :-) And you can call me Matt.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008.
"Matt’s pretty valuable to y’all. Cherish him." - BG

by MattRichWarren on Nov 11, 2009 8:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

What if...

Dungy said what he said because he was contacted by the organization to come coach the team next year, and to bring Vick with him? What if that’s why he sees it as a good fit?

Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.

by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 11, 2009 3:52 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Maybe

He just needs a chance to assert himself as a starter. Pre-season and in his few snaps this year, Vick has simply played like a guy being given his token time, knowing there’s already an established back up on the team. He’s like the poor adopted kid taken in by the rich family. He’s offered things and goes through the motions, but in the end, knows it’s simply charity they’re doing for him.

Perhaps he needs a legit shot to start, and maybe he’ll play like a guy who’s got a starting job on the line, rather than because he’s being given charity time. No matter where he goes, I’d like to see what he can do with the job on the line.

Trample the weak, hurdle the dead!

by fansince83 on Nov 11, 2009 4:05 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Or like the poor adopted puppy?

Sorry, had to. Yeah, I’m sure we all would like to know what he’s capable of before taking a risk, but unfortunately that’s not likely to happen. In retrospect I wonder why Philly took him; they really haven’t worked him in in any relevant way. Maybe they were just doing Dungy a favor or something.

by Frank Reich Revolution on Nov 11, 2009 4:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Philly is definitely his bridge back to the league, and i’d say both sides went in knowing that was the desired relationship. If Vick was put on a team to be their starting QB this year, it would have doomed him for sure.

I’d also have to wonder if Andy Reid felt it was a great opportunity to help a troubled person out. He hasn’t been able to do that with his son.

Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.

by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 11, 2009 4:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly

Charity work, and Vick knows it. I doubt we’ll see him in a Bills uniform, but if it happens, it’ll be nice to see if he’s still got it.

Trample the weak, hurdle the dead!

by fansince83 on Nov 11, 2009 4:19 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

He’s got the arm and legs to be a Raider.

Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.

by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 11, 2009 4:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

HAHA

And Al Davis is just the guy to take the risk. Probably won’t see him in Cleveland, though, not a good marketing match with the Dog Pound….

Trample the weak, hurdle the dead!

by fansince83 on Nov 11, 2009 4:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

This is a good caption photo, by the way.

“… well, that was a dumb answer.”

Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott

by Brian Galliford on Nov 11, 2009 5:55 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Nah…. Dungy’s controlling him with his mind.

“You don’t need to see his identification. "
“These aren’t the droids you’re looking for.”

etc.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008.
"Matt’s pretty valuable to y’all. Cherish him." - BG

by MattRichWarren on Nov 11, 2009 8:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Why have there been no caption contests lately?

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Nov 12, 2009 1:07 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

When he did them in the offseason he made it clear it was an offseason thing. We have to save something for the offseason.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008.
"Matt’s pretty valuable to y’all. Cherish him." - BG

by MattRichWarren on Nov 12, 2009 9:50 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I would support Vick in Buffalo if he came (Hell, I would support just about any QB short of Tim Tebow in Buffalo) but I still would have to wonder about how well he could do here. The guy has never had a 3000 yard or 60% passing season…

Bills fan? In Colorado? It's more likely than you think.

by UZ on Nov 11, 2009 6:13 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

short of tim tebow?

ill support any qb that comes in. cant hate from day one!

Buffalo, that's where it's at baby. - Adam 'Pacman' Jones

by silverstreak3k on Nov 11, 2009 9:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Uhm...

“I’d also be willing to bet that the call wasn’t placed by Dick Jauron – he had, for better or worse (and I think we now have that answer), committed to Trent Edwards at that point.”

Exactly how do we have an answer on this “better or worse” now? Vick hasn’t really done ANYTHING with the eagles this year. Not to mention the fact that even if he had done something with them and he looked good, which he totally hasn’t, he would be playing with a decent line in front of him, something he wouldn’t have had here.

I’m not saying Trent is awesome, but really, he might be just as awesome as Vick is right now… or I guess if you want to be all negative about it, Vick might suck just as much as Trent does. Vick certainly isn’t in the same place he was when he left the NFL, what with hardly playing at all. It is hard to say if he is in good enough shape right now to be a starter in the league.

by clownfat on Nov 11, 2009 8:03 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

To be completely honest...

this whole discussion makes me sick to my stomach. It’s one thing if this were 5 years ago when hestill ran like Deion Sanders. Now he looks like he runs more like a LB 4.5-4.6 range, which is still fast for a QB, but not the kind of speed that would allow him to be a gamechanger with that aspect of his game. Even at his peak, he was never even proficient by NFL starting QB standards. If you made the Pennington argument from a veteran QB standpoint for next year, I can handle that, but Vick is useless in my opinion at this point in his career.

by live6453 on Nov 11, 2009 8:25 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Nice Article Brian, but kill this thread and its insanity now please...

No way, not even in the alternate universe will this ever happen.
I’m all in with “live6453” and “MARVelous”.
“Michael Vick….I’m so sick of hearing about this guy. He was never that good of a QB anyway, he was just an electryifing athlete in ATL. He’s not the same athlete anymore, he was in prison for ~20 months for crying out loud! He’s 29, players peak at 27 in the NFL and as athletes premium skill level (which is scary to think how good Lebron is going to get). I want a legit NFL QB.”
KILL IT NOW BRIAN!!! This is insanity!!

"A failure becomes just one time at bat if you refuse to let it defeat you." Marv Levy.

by SERGEANT MAJOR THOR on Nov 11, 2009 10:52 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

With Vick comes Dungy

I agree with everyone in this discussion. Vick is not the answer for this Buffalo Bills franchise. He was never that good before his exit from football a couple years ago. Sure he has a winning record as a Falcon, but what does that mean? That division was no good back in those days and playing in the NFC is different from playing in the AFC. Teams are better in the AFC and have much stronger defenses. Vick won’t be productive in the AFC East, although he will give the fans something to cheer about and maybe some exciting football.

I think the only positive out of this whole conversation and possibility of this happening is if Vick comes here, I think Dungy comes too. He’s his mentor, he is definitely coming back to the NFL next year. Why not Buffalo? That guy could make this team a winner. He did it in Tampa Bay, he did it in Indy. If Dungy comes here next year, I welcome Vick with open arms

by jay17386 on Nov 12, 2009 11:03 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

he is definitely coming back to the NFL next year

I have yet to read, see, or hear one person say he is coming back to the NFL ever let alone next year. Except you.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008.
"Matt’s pretty valuable to y’all. Cherish him." - BG

by MattRichWarren on Nov 12, 2009 11:46 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I dont think

Dungy would be making this much of a splash if he wasn’t. To me, between all his comments and invovling himself in the Vick thing Dungy seems poised to return.

To me, the sucker is the person who runs when there’s trouble, especially when this situation was so easily foreshadowed….

by poz on Nov 13, 2009 6:43 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Dungy

Would Dungy be saying these things if he wasn’t on TV and in the spotlight every week? If he was enjoying retirement out of the public eye, do you think he’d be talking like he has? That doesn’t mean he’s coming back to the NFL any time soon….

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Nov 13, 2009 9:55 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs