Bills' battered O-Line takes another big blow
by Brian Galliford on Nov 23, 2009 12:05 PM EST
in Buffalo Bills News
Email
PrintWe knew, as the Buffalo Bills entered the 2009 regular season, that the team's top-to-bottom re-structure of the offensive line was a huge question mark. Jason Peters had been traded. Derrick Dockery and Langston Walker had been released. Melvin Fowler and Duke Preston were unceremoniously allowed to test the free-agent waters. Demetrius Bell made a seemingly miraculous leap from 16-game healthy scratch to starting NFL left tackle, Geoff Hangartner was signed from Carolina, Eric Wood and Andy Levitre were drafted early, and Brad Butler moved to the position he manned in college.
Presto change-o! Buffalo had the NFL's most inexperienced offensive line. It was painfully clear that bumps in the road were expected - and they came in the form of drive-killing penalties and inconsistent blocking. But through it all, we decided by and large that it would be entertaining and interesting to watch these young guys develop as individuals and come together as one cohesive unit.
So much for that pipe dream. Through the first ten games of the season, Buffalo has been absolutely ravaged by injuries up front. They've been forced to field eight different line combinations during that time frame. The tackle position has been hit so hard by the injury bug that it's now affecting the guards; add in the latest and most brutal injury, a double fracture to Wood's lower left leg, and the verdict is simple. Buffalo can no longer hope to see tangible development from this offensive line. It is in complete disarray.
By the way, folks - Wood's surgery was successful. Seth McKinney, meanwhile, was lost for the season on Sunday as well. Buffalo now has one healthy guard - Levitre.
The line combinations
Look, I tried to comb through each of the Bills' ten games to chart each and every line combination the Bills have used this season. I went through each game twice to fleece out every minor injury that forced a player in for even a snap or two. I'm fairly confident I still missed something, so keep an eye on Ron From NM's comments in this post, if he has any. He's the line guru, after all.
The original starting five didn't even get through two full games. Four opening-day reserves - Seth McKinney, Jonathan Scott, Kirk Chambers and Jamon Meredith - have seen significant playing time.
1. Bell - Levitre - Hangartner - Wood - Butler
2. Bell - Levitre - Hangartner - Wood - Scott
3. Chambers - Levitre - Hangartner - Wood - Scott
4. Scott - Levitre - Hangartner - Wood - Chambers
5. Bell - Levitre - Hangartner - Wood - Meredith
6. Bell - Levitre - Hangartner - Wood - Chambers
7. Levitre - McKinney - Hangartner - Wood - Chambers
8. Scott - Levitre - Hangartner - Chambers - Meredith
Where the Bills once had continuity - in the interior - that's gone by the wayside. Only Geoff Hangartner has been the constant, and even he has been battered, dealing with a back injury earlier in the season.
Not much more development to be had
If you've seen the replay of Wood's injury, you're painfully aware of just how over his rookie season is. He suffered fractures to both his tibia and his fibula - word is one or both were compound fractures - and stayed in Jacksonville last night to have metal rods inserted to stabilize the leg. He'll end up on IR, and will have played a little under ten games. He got some development and played reasonably well this season, but there's no more development to be had for Wood this season - hopefully, just a lot of healing.
Bell might get a little development time if he ever gets healthy, but he's been in and out of the lineup so much this season that any development he's made has been negligible. Levitre might continue to develop, so long as he isn't forced to play two different positions each and every game. The guy is a guard, and while he's to be commended for capably manning both spots, it's best if he sticks to left guard.
Hangartner is what he is. There's no development to be had there, though the guy deserves a steak or something for finding a way to make it through ten games. That's a rarity in Buffalo. The rest of the players that have seen field time aren't worth considering, as they're not the types of players around which championship-caliber offenses can be built. For the young players that really matter - Wood, Levitre and Bell - hopes for further development this season are minimal at best.
Buffalo needs a franchise quarterback. It is, without doubt, the organization's biggest issue from a personnel standpoint. Given the sheer amount of upheaval along the offensive line, that unit rates a very close second.
142 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
I fully agree that we need a stud franchise quarterback, but i think the line should be first priority. I don’t think there’s any point to getting one if he won’t make it past his third or fourth game due to a sudden case of linebacker-induced death.
They key to developing a qb, the right way is with limited play sets that involve heavy doses of running, as seen in atlanta and baltimore last year. Neither of those are a reality without a manageable offensive line.
by quantumuprising on Nov 23, 2009 12:13 PM EST reply actions
Totally agree. I think this is the main point of contention I’ve seen recurring on the draft threads: whether to grab a franchise QB now or try to build the line first. I say build the line. And address other needs. We are just too far away from being a good/competitive team now to be looking for a young stud QB to be our saviour.
Yes!!!!
Line first. The Bills have no business destroying another young QB’s career.
"They're Killin' Me Whitey. They're Killin' Me" -- Lou Saban
This whole “first” argument is moot, because we need BOTH.
Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott
by Brian Galliford on Nov 23, 2009 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
but its not moot, because one should take precedence. A crappy qb can semi function with a good oline.
A good qb cannot really function behind an oline like we’ve got now.
by quantumuprising on Nov 23, 2009 2:27 PM EST up reply actions
No, it’s definitely moot. One doesn’t have to take precedent if you need them both ASAP. And there’s more than one method to address these – if we’re looking at this debate with our top pick, we’re screwed.
Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott
by Brian Galliford on Nov 23, 2009 4:21 PM EST up reply actions
I don't see it as a debate that we need both, but which one do we take with our first round pick
"I want Winners. ... Cannot win with them. Cannot coach with them. Can't do it. I want winners. I want people that want to win. ..." - Mike Singletary
Again, I re-iterate – if we’re debating that come the last week of April, we screwed the pooch in free agency.
Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott
by Brian Galliford on Nov 23, 2009 5:48 PM EST up reply actions
And that never happens :-)
Or are you saying Dungy will be our HC and Vick will be our QB? Baawhahahahhaha!!!!!
"I want Winners. ... Cannot win with them. Cannot coach with them. Can't do it. I want winners. I want people that want to win. ..." - Mike Singletary
I am most definitely not saying that. :)
Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott
by Brian Galliford on Nov 23, 2009 9:56 PM EST up reply actions
Why can’t Buffalo do both at the same time? Why not draft a QB in the first round, and draft an offensive lineman in the 2nd and then add another one via FA on top of that? Buffalo could always let a rookie QB learn on the bench for a season too.
I signed up for Second Life about a year ago. Back then my life was so great that I literally wanted a second one. In my Second Life I was also a paper salesman and I was also named Dwight. Absolutely everything was the same. Except I could fly. - Dwight Schrute
Totally agree
If there’s a franchise QB available when we pick, or available if we trade up, I would hope we don’t hesitate in drafting him.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
We need to draft Jake Locker or Jimmy Clausen in the first round and then sign LT Alex Barron to a big contract. Then our O-line would – in my opinion – look like this:
Alex Barron – Andy Levitre – Geoff Hangartner – Eric Wood – Brad Butler
If the new regime decides that Wood, who’ll hopefully be ready for next year, is a better fit for center, which I think you can easily argue he is, then Hangartner becomes a backup and we’ll need to figure out who the new RG would be or if Butler should move back to RG, where he did well.
A LOT of question marks in regards to our O-line, which is in a state of utter shambles, and the new regime, hopefully led by Mike Shanahan, will need to find our LT of the future. Alex Barron is a very good pass-protector, who has actually done an admirable job at LT the last few seasons in St. Louis.
Our overall needs are as follows:
1) QB
2) LT
3) DT
4) OLB
5) O-line depth!!!
by BillsfanfromDenmark on Nov 23, 2009 12:15 PM EST reply actions
how is DT a bigger priority than OLB, or MLB for that matter?
Jonathan Stupar won the Heisman…while playing in the NFL!
I agree. Stroud and Williams are fine at DT. And I thought McCargo did ok as a reserve yesterday and seems to be coming around. Let the other teams go DT-crazy in the first round while we grab a QB or a LT.
not if we switch to a 3-4
"I want Winners. ... Cannot win with them. Cannot coach with them. Can't do it. I want winners. I want people that want to win. ..." - Mike Singletary
Don’t forget at least 3 DB’s!!
Oh wait….nevermind
"Security comes from earning it--not seeking it." Marv Levy
Alex Barron is a very good pass-protector,
You sure? I’m sure Marc Bulger would disagree with all the blind side hits he’s taken…
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
The Rams drafted a pass blocking LT 2nd overall for a reason.
I signed up for Second Life about a year ago. Back then my life was so great that I literally wanted a second one. In my Second Life I was also a paper salesman and I was also named Dwight. Absolutely everything was the same. Except I could fly. - Dwight Schrute
Yeah, that too
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
If Wood is able to resume his career, he should definitely be moved to Center next year. Levitre has a lock on an OG position and Bell in my view should have a lock as an OT (whether RT or LT still to be determined). Hang is probably best as the first back-up on the interior (a very important job on any o-line, as we have seen this year). Brad Butler is probably too fragile to count on. That means we need to find a starting OG and OT during the offseason. It’s a tall order given all the needs at other positions, but it’s crucial to get a unit together and let them develop. With luck we can pick up an OG in free agency, though it could be pretty expensive to get a good one.
Any word on Sanborn?
Didnt he get injured yesterday as well?
Pass the chocolate cake!
by norcaliangelsfan on Nov 23, 2009 12:24 PM EST reply actions
I remember him going down but cant recall if I saw him back in there later… or if there was even a long snap the rest of the game. Havent seen an update anywhere either.
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
Yeah he got injured. Yeah he was back in the game later.
"Play like hell and win." - Perry Fewell
Your daily source for Buffalo Bills information.
by MattRichWarren on Nov 23, 2009 1:48 PM EST up reply actions
Scott – Levitre – Hangartner – Chambers – Meredith
That has to be one of the worst OLs in the history of the NFL.
I signed up for Second Life about a year ago. Back then my life was so great that I literally wanted a second one. In my Second Life I was also a paper salesman and I was also named Dwight. Absolutely everything was the same. Except I could fly. - Dwight Schrute
Remember when Jamon Meridith was going to save this season? Oh right, nevermind.
Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.
by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 23, 2009 12:51 PM EST up reply actions
Looking at it more closely, I say we go for LT Barron and RG Harvey Dahl in free agency as our main priorities. Dahl is a massive run-blocker and Barron is a very good pass-blocker. That way we would have covered our bases even if Wood isn’t back at the beginning, because Hangartner would then be our center and Butler could be our RT.
An O-line that would look like this:
Alex Barron – Andy Levitre – Eric Wood – Harvey Dahl – Brad Butler
by BillsfanfromDenmark on Nov 23, 2009 12:40 PM EST reply actions
anyone think maybe the inexperience of the line is contributing to the injuries? I know i’d get hurt pretty quick if you put me out there. it might be my lack of size, weighing in at a lean 170, but I could see lack of experience being a big factor too.
A lean 170 vs 260+ yeah, you'd get hurt.
When I was in middle school, they had us doing practice O for the JV defense. I got thrown right to the ground and broke my tail bone. And that was by a guy maybe 40 pounds more than me.
Trample the weak, hurdle the dead!
I should add
Do you know how embarassing it is to break your A$$ bone??
Trample the weak, hurdle the dead!
at the very least, you’d be the butt of many jokes.
by quantumuprising on Nov 23, 2009 1:32 PM EST up reply actions
Like Devin Hester, right?
(ba dum pssh)
Bills fan? In Colorado? It's more likely than you think.
by UZ on Nov 23, 2009 3:02 PM EST up reply actions
ha – I broke my coccyx, too, but not in a game, just fell on my butt hard clowning around in high school – not an injury that has any show off factor at all – just makes it painful to sit or force an evacuation :)
i’m obviously a bad example – i kind of mentioned my weight tongue in cheek… I’d probably fall with an injury just lining up across from a professional lineman, or at least fake one to get out of there…
the question though was serious – this is sort of a general observation – if you are outmatched – physically or experience wise- you might tend to over compensate in other areas. for instance, the example of the relatively un-gifted or inexperienced athlete who puts in extra extra effort and comes through in the key situation is a staple of sports lore. its the feel good story a lot of us fans love to see. One thing though, in the process of putting in that extra effort, you might tend to put yourself in a physically vulnerable position that opens you up to injury.
I don’t know if you can attribute any particular injury to any of our linemen putting themselves out, but the ridiculously high rate this year has got to be a little more than just coincidence. Maybe they’re seeing themselves outmatched in terms of skill and experience and do things that put themselves out a little – and doing that down after down just increases the chance of getting hurt. COuld also be that they are getting exhausted, and being exhausted tends to open you up to injury also – your form breaks down, the correct effort is too much to make so you do other things that are not particularly stable.
Another analogy, and this is probably further off the mark, but to illustrate – one of the things I’ve learned about back pain which I’ve dealt with for the last ten years – what hurts is not the injury necessarily, but rather the muscles surrounding the injured area tightening up in an effort to stabilize the area. And once you have an injury, the body tends to compensate in a way that opens other areas up to injury because the movements are not natural.
Anyways. Just a thought.
Seth McKinney is out for the year too!!!
I wonder if Bryan Scott can play the OL?
"Security comes from earning it--not seeking it." Marv Levy
He’ll end up on IR, and will have played a little over ten games.
Color me confused but who did Wood play with during the bye week to pick up an extra game?
Don’t worry, the Bills can’t even do the math right. 1×10=9?
http://www.buffalobills.com/team/roster/Eric-Wood/28177895-2da7-45bc-bdcf-80ff3f3995f2
Meant “under.”
Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott
by Brian Galliford on Nov 23, 2009 1:13 PM EST up reply actions
Let’s hope Buffalo gets Bell back and puts Levitre back at LG. That combination needs game reps. Throw in Hang and the entire left side is more or less in tact. The right side? Well, ugh, what a mess.
Buffalo simply must bring in another OL this week. While there’s no point in bringing in a free agent like Runyan (available?) to save a playoff run, a vet could help stabalize the line and let the other guys (Bell, Levitre) continue to develop. Wood is going to IR, the line has been brutalized by injuries, and the scrubs are just that. Why not bring in a vet OL? No, it doesn’t have to be a guy like Runyan necessarily so much as someone who can hold the fort at RG well enough not to need to move Levitre.
Of course we could make things more challenging, Lisa, but then the stupider students would be in here complaining, furrowing their brows in a vain attempt to understand the situation--Seymour Skinner
Need to bring in 2 OL this week
With Wood and McKinney now out of the year, as well as Bell still be banged up at best.
Thing is, are there any vet FA’s that could actually play right away and not be terrible? That’s probably highly questionable at this point. They’ll probably bring up Christian Gaddis and Nick Hennessey off the PS. Ouch.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
Yeah, basically
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
dude, the franchise QB t-shirt… Genius. Haha. Gotta get one.
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
haha. Ill think about that. I have a whole family of disappointed Bills fans to buy for… Just curious too did you come up with all those?
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
Everything on my site is something I came up with.
by twoeightnine on Nov 23, 2009 5:01 PM EST up reply actions
Thats awesome. Pretty good stuff. Definately going to have to wear the QB list one.
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
If you take this survey you should be able to get $5 off.
http://isk.spreadshirt.net/503/
by twoeightnine on Nov 23, 2009 6:43 PM EST up reply actions
When Buffalo does add their franchise QB, I hope he doesn’t take a snap until the offensive line is pro caliber unlike the sub-par personnel the team has put out there this season. If that means watching Ryan Fitzpatrick get the crap beat out of him for the first three quarters of next season until the younger players are ready to succeed, I’ll endure it, but playing a rookie behind anything like Buffalo has marched out there on the line this year would be a poor decision in my opinion.
This might ramble on a bit, but I felt tying here was best...
If the right QB comes into their scope this offseason, regardless of the condition of the line, they should grab him. I’d hate it if they let one go who was high on their board but passed over for a LT.
This might sound crazy but you can’t pass up the chance at the ever-elusive franchise QB. 1st-round LT ability is there every year.
So right, some might say, why risk a flop at QB when that LT is ripe for the picking? Well, because if everyone approached it that way, you’d never have a HOF wing for most of the NFL’s QBs.
I think ANY 1st round pick is a gamble, so why not go for the gold.
Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.
by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 23, 2009 1:38 PM EST up reply actions
QB
I agree. I hope they gamble on a QB in the first round too. I just don’t want that kid actually playing until the line is at least decent. If that’s early next season, mid next season, or 2011, so be it. But anything resembling the 2009 line and I’d play Fitzpatrick or Brohm next year.
But, to me…the only gamble i’d take is on Locker, if taking one early.
Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.
by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 23, 2009 2:23 PM EST up reply actions
Why not go for gold...two words...Ryan Leaf
"I want Winners. ... Cannot win with them. Cannot coach with them. Can't do it. I want winners. I want people that want to win. ..." - Mike Singletary
Rec'd
What would the the point of adding a franchise QB with the top 5 pick the Bills might be headed for? I don’t believe that tying that much money at a position that you won’t get any value for in the near term is the not the right strategy given the other deficiencies.
As I continually state: the Bills have no business destroying another young QB’s career.
However, if a dream QB does fall to the team in the draft, I can see them biting…especially with a new coach. If the coach has a history of putting together a competent offensive line, then a rookie QB wouldn’t necessarily be a bad thing…if as you state…that line is given time to develop first.
"They're Killin' Me Whitey. They're Killin' Me" -- Lou Saban
Draft Tebow and Trade for/sign-in-FA Donovan McNabb so we can let Tebow sit on the bench. If we can manage to get Tebow in the 2nd or trade back into the first that would be the best option — just so we can secure Russell Okung or one of the top Tackles with our first round pick.
If Buffalo were able to trade for McNabb, i’d be the happiest Bills fan this side of the solar wind. There’s no way they let him leave. Andy Reid has tied his career to McNabb.
Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.
by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 23, 2009 2:25 PM EST up reply actions
agreed. They arent parting with McNabb. And if they do it would be stupid.
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
Like “letting Jason Peters go” stupid.
Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.
by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 23, 2009 4:22 PM EST up reply actions
correct.
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
No one could be that stupid, right?
Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.
by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 23, 2009 4:38 PM EST up reply actions
technically there is no side to the solar wind =( the sun is ideally a lambertian emitter.
by quantumuprising on Nov 23, 2009 2:28 PM EST up reply actions
True, but I was only using this to confine the analogy to our planet, rather than those currently opposite our stance, and in placement with our star =)
Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.
by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 23, 2009 4:26 PM EST up reply actions
Oh, so you want the misery to continue for ANOTHER 5 years?
Bills fan? In Colorado? It's more likely than you think.
by UZ on Nov 23, 2009 3:05 PM EST up reply actions
Right Now, Bills pick 5th-10th
……if the season ended right now.
With all this talk about a “franchise QB” and the must-have of building an offensive line – both of which are obviously critical – you’ll pardon me if I hope the Bills keep losing, at this point. We’re going to be totally revamped, coaching-staff-wise and FO, so my hope is to get that franchise QB or some monster on the OL.
By the way, thanks for the update onEric Wood. Our prayers go out to him today.
GIVE BROHM A CHANCE
Guys he was a 2nd round pick not even 2 years ago. The kid obviously has talent or he wouldnt have been taken in the 2nd round. Look at what he did at Louisville. He can throw. Hes got good size. Hes been studying in GB a little over a year then comes here and knows the “NFL game” and will be 2 years ahead of any QB coming out. I think its rediculous that people on here are just writing him off by saying we have to go QB with our first pick. He might not work out, but he might. IMO hes just as good if not better than any QB coming out this year.
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
I don’t think anyone is saying unequivocally that we need a QB in Round 1. We just need a franchise QB, and it’d be pretty ridiculous to assume that Brohm can be that guy. That’s not to say that he can’t, just that it’d be absurd to change draft plans based on the hope.
Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott
by Brian Galliford on Nov 23, 2009 1:59 PM EST up reply actions
So a 2 round QB that should have been a 1st rounder the year before but stayed to try to win a Nat’l Championship is more absurd to be our future QB than:
Bradford – should have been a 1st rounder but stayed to win a championship and now has two shoulder injuries and surgery?
Tebow – Winner. Yes. But throws an ugly ball and his style doesnt translate to the NFL so he would be a wait and see.
anyone else in the draft I dont see being better than Brohm when he came out of college except maybe McCoy but dont believe in him as a NFL QB. But with Bradfords shoulder and Tebow wouldnt be starting next year anyways. Why arent we looking at this as a huge advantage? We gained a 2nd round QB for nothing. Not exactly nothing to sneeze at.
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
Funny how Locker and Clausen just ceased to exist inside your mind.
Bills fan? In Colorado? It's more likely than you think.
by UZ on Nov 23, 2009 3:06 PM EST up reply actions
Nope. They we’re mention. I said “anyone else in the draft”
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
Both Locker and Clausen will be gone in the top 5.
"I want Winners. ... Cannot win with them. Cannot coach with them. Can't do it. I want winners. I want people that want to win. ..." - Mike Singletary
I guess Im just confused on why hes just getting written off. Thats all
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
Because he has looked lousy against NFL competition. They obviously see something in him since they signed him but the guys you are talking about haven’t proven anything. Brohm has proven he can’t do it – yet.
"Play like hell and win." - Perry Fewell
Your daily source for Buffalo Bills information.
by MattRichWarren on Nov 23, 2009 2:13 PM EST up reply actions
When did he look lousy against NFL competition? Pre-season? Cuz if thats the truth then our 2nd round pick Andy Levitre should have been shown the door… But he wasnt because he is young and players need time to develop. Im not saying hes going to take us to the promise land and hes a future HOFer, but he is someone that was projected to be a good prospect and hasnt been given a shot. Why not let it happen in here? Or we could ride the Fitzpatrick express the rest of the year and then hope one of those guys fall to us and that they pan out. Idk to me it seems like we have to give him a chance to be our franchise QB…
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
Well he’s on the team and that’s a start. I’m not ready to hand him the keys to the corvette station wagon yet but I’d be open to it.
"Play like hell and win." - Perry Fewell
Your daily source for Buffalo Bills information.
by MattRichWarren on Nov 23, 2009 8:12 PM EST up reply actions
No one is writing him off! All we’re saying is don’t count on him to be the franchise QB!
Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott
by Brian Galliford on Nov 23, 2009 4:22 PM EST up reply actions
Alright well I guess we’ll just have to agree to disagree on this one.
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
LOL well, we’re not even disagreeing, but sure.
Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott
by Brian Galliford on Nov 23, 2009 5:50 PM EST up reply actions
lol how arent we disagreeing? Im saying give Brohm a shot as our QB of the future because I think he could be and you’re telling me its pretty rediculous to think that. Thats a disagreement….
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
Well then I misunderstood you. I thought you were just calling people out for “writing Brohm off,” as you put it. There’s a difference between that and outright anointing him.
Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott
by Brian Galliford on Nov 23, 2009 9:57 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t think it can be as ridiculous as people thinking Edwards could have been that guy. I would like to see him get in there soon
I say on the road at KC he should get the go. Let him get an idea of our playbook and offense (not that complex haha) and after the Jets game we have 10 days to prepare him. He SHOULD be starting against KC or else us signing him was pointless, which would be dumb.
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
I am sooooo tired of hearing this mess.
The only reason our O-line is not up to par is because of injury….just like every position on Defense. INJURIES RUINED this team. The backup players that were supposed to be developed and learn this year were forced into starting roles they were not supposed to be in. Not there fault!. The only player that sucked beyond measure without being hurt was Trent Edwards! U can’t blame his lack of talent on the O-line…he’s sucked for damn near two whole seasons. He takes 10 seconds or more to throw the ball…not even a super bowl winning O-line could hold off someone for that long.
I’m more than willing to admit that Edwards is not going to cut it. But considering how many outrageous drops his WRs had this year, I don’t believe Edwards’ suckitude was entirely his fault.
2010 Bills' truth in advertising: "Look out Cleveland, this year we score 6!" - bluecollarbuffalo
by thefourwinds on Nov 23, 2009 3:44 PM EST up reply actions
judging by this...
Draft O-Line and LBs
Get a VET QB in here first….all depends on what the draft dictates to the Bills, but Id rather see that
Good Luck With Your Firings Mr. Wilson….Go Bills!
Then if the lines are strong, and the defense has a new, stronger identity, then a vet QB should be able to manage the team… then, you draft his replacement, let him grow into the postion, and then the Bills might be primed for playoffs 2011, 2012… yeesh!
But, hey, it’ll be progress
Good Luck With Your Firings Mr. Wilson….Go Bills!
It’s great if the vets brought in are worth any type of investment. Jason Campbell, sure. He might not be ousted though. Anyone else is just going to bring results similar to what happened with Warner in NY.
Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.
by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 23, 2009 4:29 PM EST up reply actions
McKinney
Seth McKinney, meanwhile, was lost for the season on Sunday as well.
Hmm. I thought McKinney came back in the game after his injury. What happened to him? Even though he is/was not the most dominant player, he seems to be an emotional leader. The young guys seemed to look up to him.
mayhem project!
mb
He did come back. And then he went down again.
"Play like hell and win." - Perry Fewell
Your daily source for Buffalo Bills information.
by MattRichWarren on Nov 23, 2009 2:13 PM EST up reply actions
believe
he went down a second time and that was it.
http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2009/11/4/1113900/fixing-this-team-starts-in-the
I signed up for Second Life about a year ago. Back then my life was so great that I literally wanted a second one. In my Second Life I was also a paper salesman and I was also named Dwight. Absolutely everything was the same. Except I could fly. - Dwight Schrute
Not much
Obviously…or else they wouldn’t be FA’s.
I guess some of the best guards available right now are:
Terrence Metcalf
Chris Naeole
Grey Ruegamer
Matt Lehr
Basically, there’s nothing out there that would really help. I also doubt that any veteran FA really wants to sign here for 6 games.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
Chocolate Cake STAT!
Pass the chocolate cake!
by norcaliangelsfan on Nov 23, 2009 2:53 PM EST up reply actions
pass the cake cali I'm ready to cry lol milk please!
Rrrawrrrr, rrrawrrr like a dungeon dragon-Busta Ryhmes
We need a lot in general.
The uncertainty created due to untimely injuries only complicates matters as to who you can count on from day 1 next season. However, if whomever is in charge of rebuilding this team next year has the opportunity to get a QB that grades out high enough where they pick, you absolutely have to roll the dice on that QB. From everything I’ve seen about this draft class, there’s not a whole lot of top end OT available. It’s mostly going to be the second round where we might be able to find a Phil Loadholdt type (immediate impact at RT).
If we can get a solid RT and move (a hopefully healthy) Butler back into RG, then shift Wood to C to give us Bell-Levitre-Wood-Butler-TBD, that would change the whole makeup of this line. You’re doing pretty well to have Hang as depth rather than depending on him as your starter from day 1. We need to draft and sign a QB. Brohm has sucked it up in the preseason, but still has some upside. It’s a very muddy situation in Buffalo right now.
One thing
TO proved what kind of teammate he can be directly following the Wood injury. He was obviously concerned and was there to help load Wood onto the cart. Even though this season hasn’t gone as he (or the Bills) planned, he obviously has built a decent rapport with some of his teammates.
I really didn’t expect to see TO out there helping Wood like that…..so good on him!
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
I’ll say it until its fate’s been sealed: Owens should be brought back next season. There’s more left in him like what we all saw yesterday. A player showing all the emotions he showed on the field should be something more of these guys need to see.
Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.
by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 23, 2009 4:32 PM EST up reply actions
It's not up to the Bills.
It’s up to the teams that need a WR to put them over the top and if they think he’s worth it.
by twoeightnine on Nov 23, 2009 5:01 PM EST up reply actions
Every game this team plays
Is like 53 guys running into a field of landmines. These injuries are unbelievable.
This space held in honor of Robert Royal known to his friends as "Sweet Cream Style Corn" March 11 2006- February 26, 2009
Could it.....
possibly have something to do with their strength and conditioning training?
by Muscle-Dolphin on Nov 23, 2009 5:12 PM EST up reply actions
Guys. Big. News.
I’m hearing that Buffalo’s injury situation might have something to do with their trainers and their strength and conditioning program.
Thoughts?
Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott
by Brian Galliford on Nov 23, 2009 5:51 PM EST up reply actions
Sarcasm, but i’ll bite. No amount of strength and conditioning would have prevented that leg double fracture.
To the degree that the Bills’ injuries have been more numerous or severe than typical in the nfl (it certainly seems that way over the last three years) and to the extent that the excess is more than a standard deviation or so of extra bad luck (no idea about that one) then I would say it is due to who the players are (more injury prone, out of control or out of position more often or put into bad postions by teammates.) I really doubt that the Bills’ training is that much inferior to regimens in place around the league.
by Sixteenthback on Nov 23, 2009 6:15 PM EST up reply actions
This is the reason we need steroids in sports. Its no fun watch backups in every game. In every sport. But especially football. Let them take things that make their bodies bigger, faster, stronger, heal faster. Who cares… we want to see the best in the world… well we cant when theyre all on the IR. Let them take whatever they want.
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
Sarcasm, too, i hope?
Of course you know that steroids increase injury risk substantially. Couldn’t leave that alone, lest any youngster might get the wrong idea.
by Sixteenthback on Nov 23, 2009 6:21 PM EST up reply actions
its only half sarcasm… I just dont know what to make of all these injuries. Majority of them being the knee injuries I have a big problem with.
So many players go down with the ACL/MCL injuries and are lost for the year. I say while rehabing they should be able to take whatever they can to get their injury back to top shape. It should be under supervision of the team and NFL doctors and they would have to pass drug tests once deemed able to play again. But right now with a knee injury like they have it could be 2-3 years until theyre back to what they were before. And by that time the rest of their bodies have taken a 2-3 year beating.
Idk maybe it doesnt make sense but were paying these guys so much money and I would have to imagne that for all NFL players throughout a season 30-40% miss games due to injury. I want to see the best players on the field as much as possible. Not 60-70% of the best players.
So half sarcasm… if theyres such a thing.
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
All the people asking for longer seasons are kidding themselves.
"Play like hell and win." - Perry Fewell
Your daily source for Buffalo Bills information.
by MattRichWarren on Nov 23, 2009 8:17 PM EST up reply actions
I wonder what the teams would look like if we went to a 18-20 game schedule. We wouldnt be able to recognize half the Bills.
"I don't know how to explain it but we seem to find eachother on the ice and make things happen... Yeah. Pass, shoot, score... Yeah. Pass.. Shoot.. And score."
They would have to increase roster size. Maybe as high as 60 on the active roster and add some to the taxi squad. I don’t think there’s enough football talent out there to support a (7×32) 224-player increase in the NFL without a corresponding decrease in the overall level of play. That could just be me though.
Official ledge-talker-offer of the Buffalo Bills.
Thoughts?
I put up a fan post about this issue a month ago today. I didn’t garner much support with it, but I’m sticking to my guns…
http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2009/10/22/1097254/strength-and-conditioning
Schmucks don't make it to the Pro Bowl... except Jason Peters!
by Run Thurmal Run! on Nov 23, 2009 6:01 PM EST reply actions
Oops... it was a month ago yesterday.
Schmucks don't make it to the Pro Bowl... except Jason Peters!
by Run Thurmal Run! on Nov 23, 2009 6:02 PM EST reply actions
For a team that has a history of choking as much as we do… you can’t just call it dumb luck. It’s definitely an issue… there’s no doubt in my mind.
Schmucks don't make it to the Pro Bowl... except Jason Peters!
by Run Thurmal Run! on Nov 23, 2009 6:10 PM EST reply actions
personally I have a conspiracy theory
If you think about it, the “woes” of the Buffal Bills began when Scott Norwood missed the field goal.
In line with the “goat” , “the Babe trade”, etc. I think someone put a curse on the team just before the 1st Super Bowl, The next 3 super bowls, the revolving coaching door, the losing records, the injuries…it just isn’t natural.
Now, if Ralph starts getting younger, we’ll know somethings up!
Priority? QB vs. Line
In response to an earlier thread [with Brian, Joe P. and Quantumuprising]
Both needs [o-line and franchise QB] must be addressed and as Brian pointed out, they can be addressed a number of ways. Hopefully the new GM or coach will bring in a better judge of free agent talent…a better Guy if you will. I would hate to think that the line will only be addressed via the draft. If that’s the way we go then the Bills might wreck another young QB before his time. Again, if I was forced to choose between a capable offensive line and a rookie QB with sky high potential, I would first go for the former; however, this doesn’t have to be an either or situation.
By the way, I have a new entry for Webster’s and Dictionary.com.
Trentified – [trent-uh-fahyd]
–adjective
1. skittish and timid, usually as a result of repeated blows to the head
2. overcome with fear of of being trampled
3. unable to make confident decisions
4. inability to see objects beyond a distance of 5 yards
5. pertaining to a once promising quarterback blessed with great accuracy, a decent arm and excellent decision making ability who—after a couple of years playing behind a weak offensive line and poor play calling—loses all of the aforementioned skills
See also: David Carr-ified
Origin: 2008-2009, United States, primarily Orchard Park, NY
Synonyms: shell shocked
Let’s not see another trentified young QB wearing a Bills uniform…build those lines Mr. __________ (coach/GM to be named later).
"They're Killin' Me Whitey. They're Killin' Me" -- Lou Saban
by NJBill on Nov 23, 2009 10:21 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
LOL!!!!! rec'd...classic :-)
I think Polian must have put a curse on the Bills when he left. Anyone know where we can get a live Buffalo to sacrifice on the 50 yards line? Or, maybe we should use a Dolphin ??? Preferably, Nick Buoniconti
it is almost unbelievable that so many players on this team have been lost to injuries. i don’t think i’ve ever seen anything like this before.
or the year before….
"Play like hell and win." - Perry Fewell
Your daily source for Buffalo Bills information.
by MattRichWarren on Nov 24, 2009 10:17 AM EST up reply actions
Win in the trenches!
I think we need to evaluate the draft, the depth of both tackles and quarterbacks coming out, then you decide from that point, when you draft a QB or Tackle. A lot also depends upon free agency. Are there any franchise Q.B.’s coming out this year like a Peyton Manning – No! If there was, then I say take the next Peyton Manning. I am not sold on Looker or Claussen. I would like to see the Bills take a defensive lineman, such as Suh from Nebraska or McCoy from Oklahoma. Even Terrence Cody from Alabama is a run stuffer. Bills need to stop the run as well!
i think if this team was able to hold teams to less points
we would have won more games this year..as bad as the offense has been, they are better than last year, but the D has been too injured and lost something from last year
"Hold ya chin up...nuh nuh nuh...gone" -Marshawn Lynch-
by billsoferie on Nov 24, 2009 10:59 AM EST up reply actions
When Manning came out, a lot of people had him and Ryan Leaf neck and neck. Seriously.
"Play like hell and win." - Perry Fewell
Your daily source for Buffalo Bills information.
by MattRichWarren on Nov 24, 2009 2:43 PM EST up reply actions
I sure didn’t (neither did Polian :) )
Never put salt in your eyes
by J2 on Nov 24, 2009 3:15 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, but a lot of people did
“Leaf had a successful college career at Washington State University, where he was a finalist for the Heisman Trophy in his junior year. He was selected as the second overall pick in the 1998 NFL Draft after Peyton Manning of the University of Tennessee, and many scouts predicted he would actually be a better pro than Manning.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Leaf
I think Polian must have put a curse on the Bills when he left. Anyone know where we can get a live Buffalo to sacrifice on the 50 yards line? Or, maybe we should use a Dolphin ??? Preferably, Nick Buoniconti
I remember that for sure – I was sold on Peyton. I remember arguing that Leaf was never going to be better than Manning. It was fun watching that whole thing unfold
Never put salt in your eyes
by J2 on Nov 25, 2009 8:54 AM EST up reply actions
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recent FanPosts
SBNation.com Recent Stories
In Association With
Shutdown Corner - NFL - Yahoo! Sports
- Giants get ahead of themselves with ‘Super Bowl Champions’ home page … on Saturday
- Smarter Stats: Super Bowl Edition — Giants’ offense vs. Patriots’ defense
- Curtis Martin’s mother helped drive him to the Hall of Fame
- Patriots heartlessly release Tiquan Underwood on the eve of Super Bowl XLVI
- Butler, Dawson, Doleman, Kennedy, Martin and Roaf make the 2012 Hall of Fame cut
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
