Please don't mess this up!
So far the search for the Bills next head coach is filled with high profile names - Bill Cowher, Mike Shanahan, Jon Gruden, Tony Dungy and Marty Schotteneheimer. The reason for this is these guys are currently unemployed and the Bills can talk to them now instead of waiting for a teams season to be over before they can talk to currently employed personnel.
The problem I'm having is Buffalo is showing it's hand too soon and just throwing money at the issue - instead of seemingly building the team the right way.
Now, I don't know what the Bills plans are - not many people do i'm sure. However, it seems like right now they are just going to throw money at a HC position. If we could land one of the proven coaches it sure would look good on paper - but would it really work out for the Bills?
These proven coaches had front office personel help build teams for them - who's to say that they are capable by themselves of building a playoff calibre team? Cowher had LeBeau, Shanahan had Elway and rushing, Gruden had Dungy's team, Dungy had Peyton but still seems to get it -but they all had front offices helping them.
I'm not saying that these are bad choices - but i'm not sold that, by themselves, they can do what we want them to do.
I honestly think the best way to build this team is with Brians (and others) method of getting a GM. I think that should be priority number 1.
GM's build you your team - they pick the coaches and players. They have the vision. To me - this is more important than picking a HC - if you have a GM that is good at picking good players and picking coaches you are going to win a lot of football games.
I certainly am not sold on any of the big name coaches ability to do any of these things. I would be more sold on a personel guy that works for a successful franchise (DeCosta, Polian). These guys would have a history of seeing the process from a GM perspective - from a successful perspective. Having your HC/GM make all of your decisions is a very risky proposition if you ask me. Wearing too many hats can dull down the true effects a good HC can have.
I'm nervous that we are just going to throw money at a Shanahan type of HC/GM - have him run the ship - and have that ship sink because he took on too much. The separation of duties allows both parties to focus on their specific tasks - which allows them to focus on their tasks with greater concentration - and hopefully greater results.
Having a high profile named HC sure would sell tickets and help palacate a fanbase - but would it ultimately win games? That's the issue i'm having - because i'm not sure.
I also think we are showing our hand too soon - everyone knows that Ralph is going to spend big money to get a HC.
First - is that going to hinder our ability to sign FA's in the future because of money tied up by the organization?
Second - If the current high profiled coaches know that he is willing to dish out big money - who's to say that they won't wait until after the season when a bidding war can start? This way they can get more money either from us or from another franchise.
I'm happy that they have decided to change this ship - but I don't want them to persue a high profile HC without a plan or vision in place - I think that's misguided. I think having a GM with a vision and plan then a high profile HC to compliment that strategy is more important. I'd even be willing to have that GM bring on an up and coming coordinator as long as the plan is in place.
There is a lot riding on these decisions - namely years worth of fans time, energy and money. The Bills have screwed the pooch too many times in the past for me to be confident they are going to do this the right way. The current way of thinking already has me nervous and i'm already on the fence on the high profile coaches because of what I stated above.
One way or another - I think a great GM should be our plan - then go from there. We need a plan - we need a path - we need a vision. What we don't need is a HC that may or may not pan out while wearing too many hats and collecting his large paychecks.
This FanPost was written by a registered user of Buffalo Rumblings. Its views do not necessarily reflect the views of Rumblings' editorial staff, but are just as valued as our own.
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29 comments
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Revisit our Past.
Was Polian Hired before Levy and Marchibroda. How did Levy get here. Who brought Marchibroda in. Also, Remember Kelly wasn’t excited about Buffalo until those guys were in Place and not only that, I believe Kelly had influence over who his center was and some of his lineman. Kelly had alot a say about a lot of things, that was his character. For those who listen succeeded. Although he didn’t exactly set the world on fire his first two seasons.
Those are the questions I have. What came first the chicken, the egg or the nest?
Excuses are a sign of weakness!!!!!!
by VanScottM on Nov 25, 2009 12:51 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Kelly came in in ‘86 I beleive and Marv was promoted halfway through that season with Kelly already on board making ’87 Marvs first full year. I’m pretty sure ’87 was Marchibrodas first year as well.
Polian was the one that got Kelly to play – drafted Bruce Smith – promoted Marv and hired Marchibroda. The GM did that
Never put salt in your eyes
by J2 on Nov 25, 2009 1:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I get what you’re saying, but I take Mike Shanahan over ANY GM in this league anyday (perhaps with the exception of Bill Parcells and Belichick). This guy build monster teams and sure he had Elway at his disposal, but he knows more about great quarterbacks than most people in the entire league. He will find a great QB for us and then it’s just a matter of time before we enter the promised land again, hopefully with the Vince Lombardi Trophy as the outcome.
by BillsfanfromDenmark on Nov 25, 2009 1:13 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
This guy build monster teams
Then why over his last 10 years did he only have 1 division title? He was hired in ’96 – road the coattails of Elway to 2 super bowls in 97 and 98.
I’m not saying he’s a bad HC – but is he all that great when taking things into consideration?
Think of it this way – look at Gruden in TB – won the SB after Dungy built the team – now who gets credit for the SB? Dungy because he built the team or Gruden because he was the coach? Then Gruden didn’t do much of anything with the team – kind of the same with Shanahan – after the Elway years – he didn’t produce a ton
Never put salt in your eyes
by J2 on Nov 25, 2009 1:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Why is it always Shannahan that was helped by Elway
and not the other way around. How many Super Bowls did Elway win before Shannahan? None, and they will killed in every one with Elway not playing well. The Broncos were the Bills before the Bills were. Shannahan is a good coach and team builder. He turned mid-round picks into 1000 yard rushers. His drafts were decent but he did stuggle towards the end of his tenure there. His teams were still very good and always competitive.
And to be honest I am not all that worried about a Super Bowl right now. We haven’t been to the playoffs in 10 years! I would settle for a playoff game first before getting all crazy about Super Bowls. To compete with Indy, NE, Miami, Baltimore and the like we are going to need intelligence and skill. Shannahan has proven that.
by RabidBuffalo on Nov 25, 2009 1:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
And to be honest I am not all that worried about a Super Bowl right now
thats where we differ – I am – because that’s the goal
Never put salt in your eyes
by J2 on Nov 25, 2009 1:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
One step at a time
And you can’t tell me that some coordinator would be able to help this team compete in our brutal division much less conference. It’s a process, get a good team builder to add solid pieces, coach up the mediocre ones, then you can compete.
I want to be optimistic about the Super Bowl but it’s a long way off.
by RabidBuffalo on Nov 25, 2009 1:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
And you can’t tell me that some coordinator would be able to help this team compete in our brutal division much less conference
then how do HC’s become HC’s? they are coordinators first
Never put salt in your eyes
by J2 on Nov 25, 2009 1:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
sorry I didn’t respond to the whole comment
Why is it always Shannahan that was helped by Elway
well would you say that Caldwell is a great HC at 10-0? or is riding Peytons and/or Dungy’s coattails?
He turned mid-round picks into 1000 yard rushers
that is one thing that I do like about shanahan. remember it’s not his coaching that I have an issue with – it’s the dual role of HC/GM and if he can handle that while being the HC and would he be effective in building a team from the ground up? i’m not sure
Never put salt in your eyes
by J2 on Nov 25, 2009 2:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Would you Sean Payton is Riding Drew Brees coattails at 10-0 now.
I wouldn’t, I’d say he is a great coach.
Levy, Dungy, Caldwell = Riding greatness at QB
Shanahan, Payton = Great Coaches
Apples and Oranges.
There's not a wide receiver who is fast enough, that J.P. Losman can't overthrow him on a fly pattern.
by The Buffalo Kid on Nov 27, 2009 3:10 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He took them into the playoffs at least twice every three or four years and got them an AFC Championship game appearance.
Bills fan? In Colorado? It's more likely than you think.
by UZ on Nov 25, 2009 2:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Head coaches matter a lot
I remain convinced that the team last year would have made the playoffs under a different and proven winner. We would have taken more chances, finished games, and not have collpased. Can you envision a group of men led by Cowher collapsing to 2-8 after 5-1? Nah, me neither.
"you just have to know there's always going to be adversity. None of these games are going to be easy. Nothing will be given to us" - Paul Posluszny
by poz on Nov 25, 2009 1:44 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
good point – remember i’m not saying that I don’t want Shanahan or Cowher – I just don’t want them at the expense of a GM with a plan.
Coaches matter – absolutely – but I don’t have any faith in these guys to build a team because they really haven’t done it. Can they build a team while being the HC? that’s a lot of work
building a team and coaching a team are 2 different things – obviously a good HC makes a difference – but so doesn’t a GM?
Never put salt in your eyes
by J2 on Nov 25, 2009 1:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i think a head coach
who is a proven winner and has developed his own coaching tree – like Holmgren, Shanahan or Cowher – would be a huge step in rebuilding and changing the atmosphere around here because guys with trees tend to bring in their own coordinators and position coaches. Shanahan is already a packaged deal with a DC according to reports. Sure a GM would be awesome, but I don;t have faith in any inexperienced GM candidates to build a winner either. At least with a HC you have taken the first major step to changing the attitude of hte players already here and the schemes we employ. For all I care let Brandon and Modrak keep it up if we bring in Shanny. They haven’t been disastrous in my book – the inner circle system was at fault not the personnel.
"you just have to know there's always going to be adversity. None of these games are going to be easy. Nothing will be given to us" - Paul Posluszny
by poz on Nov 25, 2009 1:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
guys with trees
I’m not talking about Ricky Williams and Marshawn Lynch here, I meant guys with coaching trees!
"you just have to know there's always going to be adversity. None of these games are going to be easy. Nothing will be given to us" - Paul Posluszny
by poz on Nov 25, 2009 1:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
but I don;t have faith in any inexperienced GM candidates to build a winner either.
I get that – same as an inexperienced coordinator – I guess just different plans or methodologies.
Never put salt in your eyes
by J2 on Nov 25, 2009 1:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It seems the stuff that Ricky grew really helped him out. Marshawn…seems he got the street mix.
Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.
by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 25, 2009 3:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHA
nice.
"you just have to know there's always going to be adversity. None of these games are going to be easy. Nothing will be given to us" - Paul Posluszny
by poz on Nov 25, 2009 6:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Your worries are warranted, hopefully we don’t think that throwing tons of cash at a Head Coach will fix everything. It seems silly Ralph is coming out and saying he’ll spend what he needs to on a HC because the problem is so much more than coaching.
But, Brian’s logic/hope or whoever else says that we must hire a GM first and let them hire their “guy” is wrong. Why can’t you hire a Head Coach first and then work with them to get the right GM/personnel guys here that fit their style and who will have a good working relationship?
And for those who think hiring a Coach before the GM/Front Office would never work…. it seemed to work pretty good for our friends in New England. Belichick was hired in 2000 and then personally selected Scott Pioli to be his Director of Player Personnel.
There are examples of successes and failures with both methods…. personally I’m going to reserve comment/judgement until the hiring and firing is done. But I do like Schottenheimer and Haslett…..
by Harris on Nov 25, 2009 2:26 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
rec
get the hc 1and then get the gm you are right on that
by 14fizzpatrick on Nov 25, 2009 5:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I also think we are showing our hand too soon – everyone knows that Ralph is going to spend big money to get a HC.
Actually, people were saying Ralph was to cheap to pay the money needed to get the big name HCs. When Ralph said he would, it was a big surprise to many people.
who’s to say that they won’t wait until after the season when a bidding war can start?
They were going to do that anyway. The Bills are just another hat in the ring.
One way or another – I think a great GM should be our plan – then go from there. We need a plan – we need a path – we need a vision. What we don’t need is a HC that may or may not pan out while wearing too many hats and collecting his large paychecks.
Not to pick on you, but I am getting sick of hearing how only getting a GM first, or only hiring a big name HC will work out. The fact is any number of combinations will work if done right and will fail if done wrong. The key is getting the right people in place at all those positions.
I think Polian must have put a curse on the Bills when he left. Anyone know where we can get a live Buffalo to sacrifice on the 50 yards line? Or, maybe we should use a Dolphin ??? Preferably, Nick Buoniconti
by Joe P. on Nov 26, 2009 10:58 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I agree
it is all a risk no matter how you do it, by hiring a big name coach that has been there and done that you limit the risk to some degree, and that is what they are trying to do. It is a step to finding the right combination.
Also I don’t see the big deal about Ralph “showing his hand too soon” he doesn’t lose anything by announcing his intentions except happier fans.
by guruu on Nov 26, 2009 7:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Joe the track record for GM/HC guys is not good at all. How many have won Super Bowls wearing both hats?
"Play like hell and win." - Perry Fewell
Your daily source for Buffalo Bills information.
by MattRichWarren on Nov 27, 2009 9:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree that a GM/HC is not the best way to go, but
my point was that you can hire a HC that has a lot of say first, then hire a GM that can work with a strong HC. It is possible. Or….. you can hire a GM first, then see if the top HC are willing to work with that guy. Or…….hire a strong GM and let him pick a young up in coming HC. They all can work. They all can fail. The key is not the order the people are hired, but the people themselves.
I think Polian must have put a curse on the Bills when he left. Anyone know where we can get a live Buffalo to sacrifice on the 50 yards line? Or, maybe we should use a Dolphin ??? Preferably, Nick Buoniconti
by Joe P. on Nov 27, 2009 9:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
well said Joe
The key is not the order the people are hired, but the people themselves
Amen, brother.
"you just have to know there's always going to be adversity. None of these games are going to be easy. Nothing will be given to us" - Paul Posluszny
by poz on Nov 28, 2009 9:11 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That’s the case in virtually every job hunt. Having interviewed a bunch of qualified candidates that I didn’t see being successful as teachers despite their great marks in college and qualifications. That’s why I don’t get married to draft prospects or coaching candidates. I have no idea how they come across in an interview.
"Play like hell and win." - Perry Fewell
Your daily source for Buffalo Bills information.
by MattRichWarren on Nov 28, 2009 9:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That’s why I don’t get married to draft prospects
Interviews probably account for a lot of the times we as fans say “what the heck!?!?!” when the Bills draft someone none of us wanted or saw coming. I think the Bills probably use interviews much the same way you do when looking at teaching candidates as opposed to the Bengals who dont seem to put too much stock in character.
"you just have to know there's always going to be adversity. None of these games are going to be easy. Nothing will be given to us" - Paul Posluszny
by poz on Nov 28, 2009 11:28 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If the guy’s not gonna fit in on the team do you want him there? If he’s a goofball do you want him? All these things go into it. We see what those guys bring on the field. They see them 16 hours a day, 5 or 6 days a week.
"Play like hell and win." - Perry Fewell
Your daily source for Buffalo Bills information.
by MattRichWarren on Nov 28, 2009 12:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks poz
I have really liked the steps the Bills have taken since firing Jauron. I think they are trying to let everyone know they are ready to do what it takes to build a winner. Whether they can pull it off remains to be seen, but I think the “will” is there. Why people want to fault them for talking to potential HCs is beyond me.
I think Polian must have put a curse on the Bills when he left. Anyone know where we can get a live Buffalo to sacrifice on the 50 yards line? Or, maybe we should use a Dolphin ??? Preferably, Nick Buoniconti
by Joe P. on Nov 28, 2009 6:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs




























