Examining Trent Edwards' steady decline in Buffalo

by Brian Galliford on Nov 4, 2009 12:15 PM EST in News Comment 114 comments

More photos » by Steven Senne - AP

In case you missed it, here's the short, up-to-date version of the latest on the Buffalo Bills' quarterback "situation" (or lack thereof): Trent Edwards has returned to full practice during the Bills' bye week, and barring an unforeseen setback in his recovery from a Week 6 concussion, he is expected to start in Week 10 against the Tennessee Titans. Ryan Fitzpatrick, who guided the Bills to three abysmal offensive performances and, curiously, a 2-1 record in essentially three full games as the starter, will return to backup duties.

Edwards will very likely, therefore, resume a Bills career that has reached new lows after the team lost four of his first five starts this season. This is a pivotal season for Edwards, not just because of the circumstances with the team, but because it's his third season in the NFL. That's typically when you know what you have in a player. Last I checked, that third season is not yet over for Edwards.

There's very little counter-argument that can be made against this one, singular fact: Edwards has stunk in 2009. His statistical output is at an all-time low, the team has less confidence in him than ever, and most importantly, he's not guiding the Bills to wins. As is the case in the vast majority of football situations, one man can't be fully blamed for a specific issue. But given the way Edwards has gotten to this point, and the events likely to occur should the Bills' season continue the way it has, the odds against Edwards reviving his career in Buffalo are monumentally long.

Was continuity really continuity?
Buffalo's had a lot of bad quarterbacks suit up for them in recent years, and considering the way he's played this season, Edwards has kind of a "best of the worst" feel about him. Considering the fact that the one constant in all of the quarterback shuffling the Bills have done is the Bills themselves, a legitimate argument can be made that Edwards' lack of progress has a great deal to do with his circumstances.

Edwards entered the league in 2007 as a third-round draft pick and saw live game action much sooner than he probably should have when he took over for an injured J.P. Losman in a Week 3 loss to New England. Edwards had a promising - yet highly unspectacular - rookie season under the tutelage of Steve Fairchild, then the offensive coordinator. That's when things began to go downhill.

Fairchild left after the '07 season to coach at Colorado State, but given the poor performance of the offense in his two-year run as coordinator under Dick Jauron, he wasn't likely to be back, anyway. Turk Schonert, quarterbacks coach under Fairchild, was Jauron's choice to replace Fairchild, and the move was made to preserve continuity for the Bills' young starting quarterback. It didn't happen in exactly the same fashion this past September, but when Schonert was relieved of his duties just days prior to the Bills' season opener, Alex Van Pelt once again represented an effort for continuity.

Continuity, however, was not completely achieved. It never can be - just ask Baltimore, whose defense is working through a pretty drastic adjustment period as they transition from Rex Ryan to Greg Mattison in the coordinator role. Mattison worked under Ryan, and so he could preserve his terminology, but no matter how much effort is put into continuity, you're going to run into different ways to call games or approach game plans simply because the person is different. Turk Schonert called games and approached the work week differently than Fairchild did. Alex Van Pelt, too, is different from Schonert. Add in the brief, forced, and ultimately failed no-huddle experiment, and despite the efforts to keep Edwards as comfortable as possible in this offense, continuity was clearly not achieved. Edwards has had three coordinators in three years. That fact alone is the chief reason behind his lack of development on the field.

(On a side note, most of you have labeled me as a "Jauron supporter," and that's not untrue. I like the man, and think the vitriol surrounding him is largely unfounded. One thing I will always say about Jauron, however, is that the man simply can't choose an offensive coordinator to save his life. He's had a lot of bad luck there, and particularly in Buffalo, where he's had three coordinators in four years. No matter which way you slice it, and no matter the intentions behind those changes, those were conscious choices that Jauron made, and they have had a detrimental effect on Edwards' development.)

The steady decrease in quality pass protection
Buffalo had one of the best pass-blocking units in the NFL in 2007. That was the year that Jason Peters established himself as an elite tackle in the game (a fact that is now probably much more debatable). Edwards played roughly 9 full games as a rookie, and despite his overwhelming lack of experience, he was sacked just 12 times.

The pass protection wasn't awful in 2008, either, though it certainly declined. Last season, Edwards played roughly 12 full games around injuries (concussion, groin), and in those games, he was sacked 23 times. For those of you doing the math, that's a half-sack more per game. Not great, but still acceptable.

Then came 2009, and the now-infamous complete overhaul of the offensive line. Despite the individual talent that some of the Bills' current linemen possess, it's painfully clear that they're one of the worst units in the league - if not the worst. Edwards has played a hair over five full games this season, and he's been sacked an alarming 19 times. He's also spent much more time running than usual; he set a career high with 117 rushing yards in 2008, but already has 102 this season. That stat, too, is partially indicative of line play.

I've gone on record as saying that good quarterback play is more important than good line play, but really, that argument is just splitting hairs, and it's tough to have one without the other. Not only has Edwards had a lack of continuity in offensive philosophy, but the Bills' offensive line has also seen a slow and dramatic decline in pass blocking during his three years on the job. Both of those issues, it should be noted, are directly related to some good and bad (obviously mostly bad) coaching decisions. No one should deny that the line needed to be fixed last off-season, but that "fix" isn't working this year, and it's been to Edwards' detriment on the field.

The perfect storm behind Edwards' decline
Coaching quarterbacks is a tricky business, particularly when they're young. Much of the approach taken in coaching up a quarterback has to do with developing mechanics, honing the ability to read an NFL defense, and designing an offense that emphasizes said quarterback's strengths.

Edwards, at the outset of his career, looked like the perfect game manager, with potential to grow beyond that once he gained some confidence and won some ball games. So that's how Buffalo coached him up. Limit your mistakes. Take what the defense gives you. Take shots carefully and in a calculated fashion. Score points and be aggressive when it's warranted, of course, but at least to start your career, keep us in games first and foremost.

For a time, it worked. Even as a rookie, but particularly early in his second season, Edwards put together some clutch performances and won some games. He made big throws in critical situations and, in many cases, put his team in position to win games. He was young and his play was extremely inconsistent, but when you see flashes of clutch play, there is good cause for excitement when talking about your young quarterback.

That's when things stopped clicking for Edwards. There are lots of factors at play - those mentioned, along with stiffer competition and Edwards' own inability to continue to develop - but it is what it is. He's now more inconsistent than ever, and again, the chief reason behind that inconsistency is the inconsistency in philosophy. As Edwards gained experience, he was supposed to mature beyond 'game manager' to 'game winner.' As Edwards dealt with mounting expectations, the offensive philosophies changed around him and his line play deteriorated. Through it all, he was urged to push through it and keep working. It appears that Trent did so by using his original coaching philosophy - game manager - as a crutch. Trent looks like he's playing to control what he can control, and the perfect storm of circumstances have exacerbated those tendencies to the point that Edwards is now one of the most gun-shy quarterbacks in the league. Again, part of that is his own fault - better players push through awkward circumstances and emerge as stars - but clearly, the circumstances didn't help, and aren't currently helping.

What happens from here?
As mentioned at the top, Edwards will resume his starting role after the bye week, and barring another injury or further decline in his play, the idea is for him to close out the season in that role. There is a chance that Edwards will improve over these next eight games, just as there is a chance that the O-Line will gel and Alex Van Pelt will emerge as a better play-caller. If anyone is expecting any or all of those to occur, they're in the distinct minority.

Edwards will also likely be here in 2010, given his small salary and his being a stand-up, intelligent individual who is still in possession of some serious talent. He might not be anything more than a backup, but he'll probably be in Buffalo. If the Bills can't find a way to shock the world and make the playoffs (or go on some crazy end-of-year winning streak), however, it's very likely that he'll be entering his fourth season with a new coaching staff - one that didn't draft him, by the way - and new offensive philosophies and linemen. Why would growth be expected under a new regime if the same problems exist?

A lot has to happen if Edwards is to revive his career in Buffalo. He and the teammates/coaches around him need to improve if he's going to be a productive player over the second half of the season. He'll need to be borderline excellent - again, with similar gains from his teammates and coaches - if he's going to save his coach's job. Only the latter will earn him real continuity entering 2010, and as it stands now, real continuity may not be ideal in every sense of the phrase for Edwards.

I'll never say "never" when it comes to a player potentially emerging as a consistently good football player, and I certainly won't say it in regards to Edwards, who is that rare (probably) failed quarterback experiment in Buffalo who is actually endearing as a person. He's a smart kid that works hard and genuinely wants to be excellent at his profession. Given the way his career has unfolded and the direction the Bills are likely to head after this season, however, it seems like a virtual certainty that if Edwards ever reaches his full potential as an NFL quarterback, it probably won't be as a Buffalo Bill.

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I really think if Edwards is not the starting QB next year he has to not be a Bill – whoever is brought in to replace him will just have the fans ready to jump ship once he has a bad game…
Now I’m not a huge Edwards supporter, but I am not fully convinced on the QB’s coming out of college and wouldn’t mind the Bills concentrating on some other areas for an over haul and leave Edwards there next year – unless there is a complete melt down and he is extrodinarily terrible.

I was born in Buffalo, and NO, it's not a suburb of New York City

by Ghetts on Nov 4, 2009 12:38 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Good read, Brian.

I agree with you for the most part that Edwards’ decline isn’t ultimately and completely a problem with him and him alone.

Clearly, our offensive line needs help in a serious way. My grandmother who has never watched a football game in her life could figure that out.

“Why are those men just letting those other big men hurt their friend so easily?”

And, on the OC point, it’s the understatement of the year to see Edwards’ have been subpar.

Where I disagree is this “vast potential” you bring up in the last sentence. I’m just not sure I see it that way.

Edwards has had some good stretches in Buffalo, but personally I haven’t seen any “Wow!” stretches coming from him.

Can Edwards be a successful quarterback in this league? Yeah, probably. But I think that success is more likely to manifest itself in a Jon Kitna way, not a (Manning is too much) Philip Rivers or Donovan McNabb way.

In short, I don’t think Edwards can make a team that much better.

From what I’ve seen, he’s smart, he works hard, and he says the right things. Those are all great attributes for a starting quarterback.

But it seems to me he needs to be a starting quarterback on a team that doesn’t need him to force or create success. He needs a team with a good defense, a good line, and a good running game.

I’m as sick of the term “game manager” as the next guy, but I think Edwards’ “vast potential” is to be an upper echelon game manager at best, not a superstar.

by nickfeely8 on Nov 4, 2009 12:46 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Agreed on your last point

This franchise needs a face, and more importantly, a playmaker at QB. Enough with the game managers. That’s just a nice way of saying the guy stinks.

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Nov 4, 2009 1:43 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs

I sure wouldn’t mind it if they found a hot-handed gun-slinger of a QB.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 4, 2009 3:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Not true. I’ve heard the term “game manager” applied to all sorts of QBs, including Pennington and Roethlisberger. I would however agree that we need someone who can take the team on their shoulders every once in a while, though.

Official ledge-talker-offer of the Buffalo Bills.

by WhyBillsWhy on Nov 4, 2009 4:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

theres a difference between managing games and being a game manager.

Roethlisberger can manage a game in bad weather and wait for his chance, but he can still make a big play when he needs to.

Game Managers are called such because they lack the ability to make an impact on a game in a positive way. At best, they’re a non-factor.

Jonathan Stupar won the Heisman…while playing in the NFL!

by JPH on Nov 4, 2009 5:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I don’t think that fits my definition of a “game manager”.

In my mind, there are 2 types of QBs. You have the crazy gunslinger type that is unpredictable, at best a Favre and at worst a Losman. Then you have the safe game manager, at best a Montana/Warner and at worst, well, somewhere in the vicinity of what we’ve got right now.

I think, as a game manager QB, the offensive philosophy doesn’t really constantly rely on the QB to have a good game and make the extraordinary play, though it happens sometimes. With a gunslinger QB, the offense lives and dies by the QB’s performance that day. Both philosophies have merit, but a lot of strong defenses pick the safe route on offense (which is the theory behind our system as best I understand).

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by WhyBillsWhy on Nov 5, 2009 9:58 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

counterpoint

Good points all, Brian, many of which I agree with. But, as a counterpoint to nickfeely8, I think IMO I place the most stock in the “circumstances” defense. This guy has had as much turmoil surrounding his development as the collapsing pocket he sees every week. It’s not 100% of the reason, for sure. I think another major piece is that they did not replace AVP when he became coordinator. At the most critical stage in Edward’s development, management chose to leave him on an island. Certainly, AVP with his own onus to produce (and on the job training to boot), doesn’t have time to “coach” as well.

by fansince60 on Nov 4, 2009 12:50 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I dont even know if there is anything to say...........

Brian has pretty much got it all covered.

Pass the chocolate cake!

by norcaliangelsfan on Nov 4, 2009 1:13 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

yup yup- except for…. Trent Edwards clearly has no sack – grow a set and throw the ball downfield. I’d rather him throw picks and lose the game than just bore us and lose anyways.

I am so clever that sometimes I don’t understand a single word of what I am saying
Trent Edwards - Backup QB until furthur notice. Care to prove me wrong Trent?

by J2 on Nov 4, 2009 1:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Hahahhah....great minds :-)

"Are the Bills better than we think, or do they just suck the life out of most teams they play and drag them down to their level? - oompaloompa

by Joe P. on Nov 4, 2009 1:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I've seen this argument many times........but I dont buy it......

Trent starts throwing INT’s all over the place and then people jump on him for that…….there is nothing exciting about a QB throwing it to the other team……

It’s just a different kind of frustration.

Pass the chocolate cake!

by norcaliangelsfan on Nov 4, 2009 1:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

if fitz showed anything, its that the opportunities down the field are there.

unfortunately, rattled brain isn’t going to help in the cojones department.

by oompaloompa on Nov 4, 2009 1:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

also, we’re all assuming that if Trent starts taking shots down field, he is going to throw INTs.

Anyone else see what’s wrong with that thinking? Anyone else wonder, maybe that’s our problem?

The Play Not To Lose mentality has saturated even the fan base.

If you don’t try, you don’t know. Who knows, maybe Trent says, F this, if I’m going down, I’m going down swinging (er, slinging) and he discovers that he’s better than he gave himself credit for.

That’s an unlikely scenario, but, jeez, better than this play not to lose thinking.

by oompaloompa on Nov 4, 2009 3:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

well my argument is based off of everything we’ve seen – we’ve seen him throw check downs and we know he can do that.

why not mix it up and at least start giving those plays a shot?

he clearly is a good check down – game manager type of player – we know this.

I think he should try and develop his other side that would be the playmaking, large chunk type of plays. Only way to develop that is to try – something I rarely see out of him.

I am so clever that sometimes I don’t understand a single word of what I am saying
Trent Edwards - Backup QB until furthur notice. Care to prove me wrong Trent?

by J2 on Nov 4, 2009 2:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

hes a good game manager type?

why does he throw so many interceptions?

Jonathan Stupar won the Heisman…while playing in the NFL!

by JPH on Nov 4, 2009 5:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I both agree and disagree with this comment. Ive said it before that I wish he would take shots and not be affraid to throw picks but I know if he starts gunslinging (haha idk if thats a word or not) the ball all over the field I know Ill be in the stands yellin at him to start checking down.

Its a lose-lose situation for us :-/

ImI know I dont have the answer is to fix this team. But god I hope someone has it.

LETS GO BUFF-A-LO!!

by bflo on Nov 4, 2009 1:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

thank you........

glad Im not the only one who sees that.

Pass the chocolate cake!

by norcaliangelsfan on Nov 4, 2009 1:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Its not bad when you first say it “I dont care at this point just start chucking the ball downfield!!!!”

Its all out of frustration of what we’re seeing now but its still not a solution to fix the W-L column.

Think about it… if he was throwing for tons of yards but throwing picks we would be calling for him to stop going over the middle, deep, double coverage, etc.. and start yelling at him to checkdown.

Its a tough time right now and QB isnt the only problem but its a big one.

LETS GO BUFF-A-LO!!

by bflo on Nov 4, 2009 1:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

god i love/hate this team...

at least this site keeps me halfway sane during work. Thanks guys haha

LETS GO BUFF-A-LO!!

by bflo on Nov 4, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

he does need to throw the ball downfield.

is there really no middle ground between what Trent does and “gunslinging?”

that seems silly.

Jonathan Stupar won the Heisman…while playing in the NFL!

by JPH on Nov 4, 2009 5:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Curious, but JPW was available in Atlanta.

I think he could still be something. Laser-rocket arms are overrated compared to accuracy and intelligence. But I don’t coach teams, so what would I know. Regardless of Trent’s QB-ing, you still need to upgrade alot of your team. Especially the coaching and owning. Sell RALPH. Sell him!!!

Head Weatherman/ Injury Specialist of the Phinsider.

Bender: Who wants dolphin? Leela: Dolphin? But dolphins are intelligent. Bender: Not this one. He blew all his money on instant lottery tickets.

by Farorefox on Nov 4, 2009 1:19 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Who is JPW?

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Nov 4, 2009 1:47 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs

Im guessing John Parker Wilson

former Alabama QB

Pass the chocolate cake!

by norcaliangelsfan on Nov 4, 2009 1:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Ding-ding

Head Weatherman/ Injury Specialist of the Phinsider.

Bender: Who wants dolphin? Leela: Dolphin? But dolphins are intelligent. Bender: Not this one. He blew all his money on instant lottery tickets.

by Farorefox on Nov 4, 2009 2:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

he strikes me as the ultimate "game manager"

but what the heck…….couldnt be any worse than what we have right now.

Pass the chocolate cake!

by norcaliangelsfan on Nov 4, 2009 2:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Pennington managed us into an 11-5 record and the division last year. Cannons run out of ammo.

Head Weatherman/ Injury Specialist of the Phinsider.

Bender: Who wants dolphin? Leela: Dolphin? But dolphins are intelligent. Bender: Not this one. He blew all his money on instant lottery tickets.

by Farorefox on Nov 4, 2009 2:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The one bad thing I see is the 3 name as being synonomous with serial killers!

Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.

by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 4, 2009 3:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

And the JP part!

Sweet home Orchard Park.
jb

by thurman on Nov 5, 2009 1:36 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Edwards is one ball short of being a gelding!!!

If I had a dollar for every excuse made for Edwards, I would be a millionaire. I am sick of it. All it really means is Edwards is not good enough. I could buy some of it, if he was making the most of his chances. He is not even close to doing that. Blame the coaches all you want, but Edwards is the one with the ball in his hands. I would love to see Edwards benched for taking to many chances down field! Does he make the throws when he has the time? No. Simple read ….one on one coverage to Lee or TO means throw it deep…..easy….but it doesn’t happen.

"Are the Bills better than we think, or do they just suck the life out of most teams they play and drag them down to their level? - oompaloompa

by Joe P. on Nov 4, 2009 1:23 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Maybe I should have tried harder to convey this, but I was trying NOT to make excuses for Edwards. I repeated many times that part of the blame – a significant part of it – is his fault. The excuses aren’t being manufactured, they exist, and they’re substantial.

I never said Edwards is good enough, either. All I said is that we may never know, because he hasn’t been developed in the right fashion.

Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott

by Brian Galliford on Nov 4, 2009 1:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Haha, read before you post – just said “part of the blame is his fault.” LOL. Part of the blame is on him. :)

Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott

by Brian Galliford on Nov 4, 2009 1:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Agreed......Edwards has not had a lot of help, but I just don't feel sorry for him

because he hasn’t taken care of his business. Like I said, Edwards is just not good enough. Who do you blame for the Titanic sinking? God, the iceberg, or the captain? I give most of the “credit” to the captain.

"Are the Bills better than we think, or do they just suck the life out of most teams they play and drag them down to their level? - oompaloompa

by Joe P. on Nov 4, 2009 1:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

But Joe, as Brian has pointed out in effect, that’s not a good analogy. The captain of the Titanic was an experinced seaman, not a guy just starting out, and the ship he was given to steer was the best in the business. He failed under the best possible conditions. Trent so far has been failing under very tough conditions.

I think Brian leaves out one big factor — the lack of a running game. All young QB’s need that to take pressure off of them. The first two games of this season when we did have a strong running game Trent was impressive. But when that ended — when opposing defenses figured out how to stop our running attack since it was too simple in conception (see Ron’s latest post on how we never use the B gap) and Marshawn returned to resume his dancing-instead-of-running act, QB play went sharply downhill. We also need to remember that Trent had to deal with a god-awful o-line in college that had him running for his life and frequently injured. No wonder he’s gunshy.

I still believe he could turn into a solid NFL QB under better circumstances, but Brian may be right that that will not hapen in Buffalo. My sympathies are already with the next young signal-caller who is going to come in here and have his career destroyed. There’s a long line of them now. What is there to make anyone think it won’t happen again? (Yes, I know, the rookies on the o-line could grow into studs, but if that happens the Bills under present management will likely refuse to pay them and trade them away, to be replaced by more rookies — that is, unless we do get that football-savvy GM we need so badly.)

by Macktruck on Nov 4, 2009 2:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

But Joe, as Brian has pointed out in effect, that’s not a good analogy. The captain of the Titanic was an experinced seaman, not a guy just starting out, and the ship he was given to steer was the best in the business. He failed under the best possible conditions. Trent so far has been failing under very tough conditions.

The problem here is Trent’s on an iceberg, and it’s melting quickly while it teeters to and fro, flirting with tipping over for good.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 4, 2009 3:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

So what i’ve gleaned from this is that global warming is killing our quarterback.

great. we really can’t win.

by quantumuprising on Nov 4, 2009 3:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

LOL…our OL is global warming and the WRs are all the helpless Polar Bears.

Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.

by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 4, 2009 3:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Granted it was not a perfect anology, but

the captain of the Titanic had no control over the design of the ship like the small rudder is often pointed to as a fatal flaw (The Bills also lack direction and the ability to change it in order to avoid disaster) or the lack of life boats, removed by the company (FO) in order to make the ship look nicer, all the while telling the passengers the boats were unnecessary (Walker cut because of his complete regression) because the ship was unsinkable (inability to accurately evaluate players ) .

Yes our Oline hurts both the passing and running game, but even when Edwards has time he doesn’t seem willing to take the shots down field. Edwards will make a great backup QB or possible a game manager type QB aka Trent Dilfer, but he will never be the kind of QB that the Bills need to win games for them on a regular basis.

"Are the Bills better than we think, or do they just suck the life out of most teams they play and drag them down to their level? - oompaloompa

by Joe P. on Nov 4, 2009 6:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Actually, the fatal flaw on the Titanic was the fact that the hull was too thin in places and the rivets were substandard. So the problem was really the FO.

On Trent, my refrain continues to be that he is not getting the time he needs to get into a rhythm — which is important to all QB’s but seems especially so for him. When he does get the chance to get in rhythm he is pretty good and much more than a game manager (i.e., the first two games of this season). And he has taken shots down the field at various times during his Bills career, so he can do it. Would he do it on a consistent basis if he had decent protection and a solid running game? We won’t really know until he has decent protection and a solid running game for an extended period of time.

by Macktruck on Nov 4, 2009 6:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

dick jauron

“the small rudder” ha, love it.

most of my posts get deleted :(

by dzil on Nov 4, 2009 11:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Which goes to Brian’s point that that’s what he was taught to do – not make big mistakes. Obviously, that’s been to his detriment overall and there’s no telling if he’ll ever snap out of it. He didn’t used to play like this. When a player regresses in that manner despite making a good faith effort, as he apparently has, it’s gotta be put on the coaching. That said, I can’t tell you whether a new regime could get more out of him or he’s a lost cause at this point. I can state with more certainty that this regime isn’t going to help him on that front. Hopefully he realizes he’s auditioning for next year.

Official ledge-talker-offer of the Buffalo Bills.

by WhyBillsWhy on Nov 4, 2009 1:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

If he is indeed intelligent, he needs to realize that it’s now or never. He gets 8 more chances to show his next team that he is not a bed-wetting QB and has the courage to step into his throws and take pokes down-field, anticipating where his receivers will be.

I have nothing left to say, these Bills have sucked me dry of any hope. Loosing to a team that completes 2-17 for 23y with 1 INT, that is beyond pitiful!

by keysh67 on Nov 4, 2009 1:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Sounds like he and Owens need to play the game pretty similarly from here on out.

Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.

by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 4, 2009 3:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Agreed....totally

Some of the issues are obviously legit (OL, pathetic coaches), but Trent looks scared out there. He’s been like that for some time now. He has no ability to anticipate passes or read coverage, and much of that is all him. He can’t rise up and make others better. In fact, he might be making them worse by osmosis.

He could still become a decent NFL QB, but he has to drastically change his mindset and improve his recognition skills. I don’t think he’s good enough to continue as the “future” of the team. He should stay as a seat warmer/solid backup next year without a doubt…

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Nov 4, 2009 2:04 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs

Really, you’d throw a rookie QB in right off the bat next year (assuming that’s what you meant)? I don’t think this team is built to do that. I think Trent will need to be the starter next year too, unless we bring in a veteran. Either way, I think the we’d be better off giving the O-Line another year and transitioning a young QB.

by TJJ on Nov 4, 2009 2:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

No not at all

I’d rather have him start over any vet FA while the rookie gets acclimated. Hence the seat warmer part. But if a rookie is more than capable right away, then I’d hope we go with him and Trent would be a solid backup.

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Nov 4, 2009 3:24 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs

I hope Trent tears it up over the last eight games

for two reasons. 1- I’d like him to starting again next year. I’d rather fix everything else (ok, not everything, but start with the trenches) that’s wrong with the team first and then insert a young QB behind a competent line. Or 2- Can we get anything for him in a trade after the season? With so many other teams out there that supposedly need QB’s is there a possible match?

Oh, and 3- I hope he tears it up for his sake and so we can watch something that remotely resembles football for the next 8 weeks. Draft position be damned.

by k8 on Nov 4, 2009 1:35 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I completely agree. However, I hope it doesn’t destroy our position in the draft. Good losing football, sorta speak..

I have nothing left to say, these Bills have sucked me dry of any hope. Loosing to a team that completes 2-17 for 23y with 1 INT, that is beyond pitiful!

by keysh67 on Nov 4, 2009 1:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I dont think it matters this year..........

the draft is gonna be deep!

Pass the chocolate cake!

by norcaliangelsfan on Nov 4, 2009 1:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

If by deep you mean no sure things, then sure, it’s deep.

Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.

by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 4, 2009 3:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Is there ever a draft class chock-full of “sure things”?

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"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott

by Brian Galliford on Nov 4, 2009 3:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

No, but it doesn’t make my point any less valid, does it?

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 4, 2009 3:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I think it does make your point less valid. No draft class is chock-full of sure things, but every NFL team grades players based on round value. One year, you might have 18 guys in an entire class that get a first-round grade from scouts; another year, you might have 37 players with a round one grade. That’s a deeper draft class. It’s all subjective, but “deep” and “thin” draft classes do exist.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 4, 2009 3:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I see you point. I based my comment on the QB position, thinking that’s where the comment was leading us. I have a REALLY bad feeling about all the QBs available this spring.

Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.

by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 4, 2009 3:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Copy that.

Official ledge-talker-offer of the Buffalo Bills.

by WhyBillsWhy on Nov 4, 2009 5:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I was talking about the draft as a whole...........

not just one position.

Pass the chocolate cake!

by norcaliangelsfan on Nov 4, 2009 5:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Afghan, I share your concern. There may be one or two gems in there at QB, but will they be gone when the Bills pick in their official slots (#8 through #11)?

by Macktruck on Nov 4, 2009 6:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

If the Bills draft a QB to be the long term answer I don’t see Edwards being in Buffalo next year. I could see them trading him to a team (for a 6th-ish pick) to be their backup.

The only way I see him sticking around, and not starting, is if they bring in a solid veteran QB like Pennington.

It’s frustrating because he’s shown flashes of being really good (particularly the Charger game last year). If Edwards was in an ideal situation (good OL, good coaching, good skill players) I still think he’d be at least a middle of the pack starting QB who you could win with.

by Pistol on Nov 4, 2009 2:03 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

No reason to trade Trent next year............

He could stay on and be a cheap and serviceable backup……..if they didnt trade JP, they wouldnt trade Trent either.

Pass the chocolate cake!

by norcaliangelsfan on Nov 4, 2009 2:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I would hope they learned from their mistake with Losman and take whatever picked they could get for him in that situation. Losman fumbled his value away and the team just let him go – no gains from him AT ALL.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 4, 2009 3:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

There will be no gains for a backup QB either. You’re not getting anything for him.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008.
"Matt’s pretty valuable to y’all. Cherish him." - BG

by MattRichWarren on Nov 7, 2009 9:36 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

didn't/couldn't.

Jonathan Stupar won the Heisman…while playing in the NFL!

by JPH on Nov 4, 2009 5:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

very good post Brian

I enjoyed this read. You are right to point out the lack on continuity.

can’t choose an offensive coordinator to save his life. He’s had a lot of bad luck there

Where you see bad luck I see incompetence.

Getting a guy like Billick or Fassel to come in as OC was not beyond the realm of possibilities, for the right price both would have agreed. But when you are affraid of losing your job, you tend to avoid bringing in competition. I highly respect McDaniels for bringing in Nolan as his DC, he is smart enough to know that he needs good help on Defense and Jauron should have done the same.

I have nothing left to say, these Bills have sucked me dry of any hope. Loosing to a team that completes 2-17 for 23y with 1 INT, that is beyond pitiful!

by keysh67 on Nov 4, 2009 2:03 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I agree with your premise

but advocating Billick or Fassel specifically?
1. I don’t think Billick is interested in being an offensive coordinator anywhere just yet. He still sees himself as an head coach, and, as successful as he was, he has no reason not to.
2. I think people underestimate the degree to which Fassel is a complete psycho. The guy took a team to the NFC championship, and he cannot get a job in the NFL. He’s coaching in the darn UFL, after all.

Jonathan Stupar won the Heisman…while playing in the NFL!

by JPH on Nov 4, 2009 5:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Both are still miles better than the crap we’ve had in recent years. But my point was more to point out that Jauron could’ve brought in experienced OC’s and chose unknowns so to say he was unlucky is wrong. For what ever reason he chose rookie OCs and now it’s going to cost him his job. He has nobody else to blame but himself.

I have nothing left to say, these Bills have sucked me dry of any hope. Loosing to a team that completes 2-17 for 23y with 1 INT, that is beyond pitiful!

by keysh67 on Nov 4, 2009 9:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Guy & Modrak

Trance’s demise runs parallel to the Bills last couple of QB’s—-JP and Drew. Guy and Modrak have drafted poorly and signed O-line free agents that haven’t panned out. They’re as much to blame as any player on the Bills!!!

Trance, JP and Drew all have had to play behind below average O-lines, whose fault is it? It’s Guy & Modrak’s job to bring in players and they have failed miserably!! The game is won in the trenches period… Signing the likes of Tuten Reyes, Bennie Anderson, Villariel, Fowler, Dockery, drafting of “Lard Ass” Mike Williams over Mckinnie and not drafting lineman high in the draft have been the true demise of the Bills. This year maybe they finally got it right with Wood and Levitre.

I’m also sick of people blaming the OC’s they keep changing them with the same result. The old saying is you can’t make silk out of a sow’s ears—-well the front office keeps giving the coaches sows ears to work with. No wonder the QB’s get battered and regress instead of progress…

Here’s a list of former Bills OC’s and where their careers have gone.

Joe Pendry—asst head coach Bama

Clements is the QB coach for the Packers

Fairchild—Head coach Colorado State

Gilbride—OC G-men

Mularky—OC Falcons

Henning—-OC Phins

Schonert—-parts unknown

The OC’s that were let go seemed to have landed on their feet!!

"If you don't have good habits you have bad habits there are no in between habits"

by Goose22 on Nov 4, 2009 2:19 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

The problems aren’t with the coordinators, it’s with the change.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 4, 2009 2:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

This post is a damning indictment of the HC

It really highlights some of the conscious decisions made during his tenure that have worked in direct opposition to giving this team a chance to succeed.

by Frank Reich Revolution on Nov 4, 2009 3:12 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

You could put nearly ANY skill player in this post and, while no one else should be looked at as the team’s leader like a QB, it would read the same. Lynch, Evans, Owens, the Bennie Hill Gang at TE.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 4, 2009 3:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The Benny Hill Gang would run in circles around opposing defenses

by Frank Reich Revolution on Nov 4, 2009 3:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

But they always fall down in the end.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 4, 2009 3:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

being fair to Jauron...

I was discussing college basketball with a buddy of mine and particularly one coach i’d always heard had an excellent reputation. My buddy corrected me that he had a reputation as a great Xs and Os coach… a different thing entirely. As a former basketball player the distinction he made was that Coach’s game plan/strategy would allow a bad team to play above its ability but might stifle the performance of more talented rosters.

This is exactly what you see when you look at the Bills progression/regression over the past few seasons. 7-9, 7-9, 7-9. … 7-9? Yes. All of the mitigators Brian pointed out and you all have about the roster are true. But T.O., Lee, Evans, Roscoe Parrish, (Jason Peters), Marshawn… this really should be a good offense. I think this roster is more talented than those of say the Dolphins, who won the division last year. He got us to 7-9 the first year with, what I remember as, an awful roster. On different occasions he’s weathered injuries and roster or coaching turnover to go… but he’s also squandered momentum and excellent players to go 7-9!

What do you all think of my theory? or is it too rosy on the roster?

On an unrelated note. Where the hell is Steve Johnson? Can we at least see what we have in him if we’re destined for another 7-9 season.

by dav630 on Nov 4, 2009 7:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I agree that we have plenty of talent at the WR and RB positions, but our deficiencies at OL and QB are cancelling that out.

As to your point about coaching – yeah there do seem to be those coaches in whatever sport that seem to be able to get the most out of a bad/mediocre team, but never seem to take the next step. Jauron’s record to this point pretty much defines mediocrity. Maybe he simply hasn’t had the players to be successful, but I think Brian’s post really illustrates some specific things Jauron has done that has contributed to his lack of success with the Bills.

Oh and as to Scuba Steve – I think he played a little in the last game, didn’t he? Of course, if we can’t even get Evans or TO involved, I doubt we’ll see much of Johnson.

by Frank Reich Revolution on Nov 4, 2009 10:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Edwards has begun to remind me of a QB who

may end up in another uniform and likely wont be a serious threat to beat the team. Being thrown to the wolves in the manner he was as opposed to say Matt Ryan has most likely stunted his growth in pretty servere ways. (I’d argue he wasn’t their guy from day one, contrary to the love affair we all see.) The coordinator carousel has done nothing for his game smarts either.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 4, 2009 3:13 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Regression

I used to think more highly of Edwards, but in his games this year he’s undercut most of the (limited) praise he’d been getting, giving me the impression he’s regressing.

(1) He does not really have a strong arm. Neither, by the way, did Losman. I don’t know why people kept saying either guy did. They can both rear back and HURL the ball downfield, but with no accuracy. That’s not a strong arm. A strong arm goes deep with velocity and accuracy. Usually when I see Edwards (or when I used to see Losman) go deep it just looks like a Hail Mary.

(2) His intelligence is overrated. Game manager? I keep thinking back to a play in the Cleveland game when it was third down and they were in field goal range. I think it was near the end of the first half, but I’m not sure. Low scoring game. One thought, ONE THOUGHT should be in his head: I MUST NOT TAKE A SACK THAT TAKES US OUT OF FIELD GOAL RANGE! If things look bad, I HAVE to throw it away! What did he do? Took a sack and took us out of field goal range. I was flabbergastered. How did that happen? Smart QBs, game managers, don’t let that happen. That one play could have changed the whole game.

(3) I don’t blame him too much for not going deep because (a) I don’t think he’s got a great arm (see 1 above); and (b) he’s often getting too much pressure for that (though he seems to be running out kind of early on some plays, which takes away the deep ball because he can’t throw on the run). But he is missing open people even when he does have time. Again from the Cleveland game I remember the ANNOUNCERS screaming at him to hit open receivers while the play was in progress, and him not doing it. Something’s just not right there.

Bottom line: I’d love to see him turn things around because I don’t want to draft a QB. But . . . agree with Brian about the steady decline.

by Applsoss on Nov 4, 2009 4:02 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

It’s true about the strong arm thing. Brett Favre – strong arm AT 40. Losman just heaved it, doing his best Flutie BC impression. I don’t know if Edwards can throw it 50 yards in the air. I’d love to see it.

Twitter: helping to make anti-social people anti-socially social.

by TheAfghanTwilight on Nov 4, 2009 4:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

agree

expanding on 3. it’s about his inability to throw the ball 10-20-30 yards downfield, not 60. If he doesn’t want to heave it deep to TO, i dont blame him, but why is it that he won’t throw the mid-range ball. Those are the ones that Fitz showed us were open (now, he couldn’t hit those guys, obviously), and those are the passes he can’t throw.

Jonathan Stupar won the Heisman…while playing in the NFL!

by JPH on Nov 4, 2009 5:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

and

expanding on #2

if he’s such a good game manager and so smart, why does he throw so many INT’s?

Jonathan Stupar won the Heisman…while playing in the NFL!

by JPH on Nov 4, 2009 5:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

moving targets

My concern with Trent does not have to do with his arm strength but his ability to lead receivers and let them catch the ball in stride. He seems to insist that they come to a full stop with no one around them before he will throw. But that may have to do with the fact that he often feels rushed and therefore doesn’t have time to assess the situation.

by Macktruck on Nov 4, 2009 7:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Great article Brian, but I do think you left off a couple of minor points that also resulted in his poor play:
1) injury to Schouman/poor tight end play—this was Trent’s favorite target, and had a great start to the season going….with Nelson’s injuries (I think he missed some time with Trent even before his migraines, but I’m not certain), the TE position has been NON-existent….which really hurts someone like Trent’s whose game is predicated on at least average TE play
2) line mistakes—-Brian mentioned the poor blocking, but let’s also not forget the plethora of penalties that occurred curiously when Trent was in his 3 game funk, but subsided when Fitzy took over…in the Cleveland game, virtually every other drive Trent had to get 15 yards for a 1st instead of 10
3) poor special teams play—the return fumbes in the NE, NO, and CLE game, as well as the mediocre returns cost the Bills the games in 2 of those games (not claiming we would have beaten NO anyway, but it was still a tight game late when Roscoe fumbled….who knows)….if those mistakes didn’t happen, and we won even 2 of those games, Trent would be 3-2 this year (not counting the Jets game) and there would be no discussion at all

I think people forget how brilliantly he played in week 1 and 2 (no turnovers, and stats would have been even better if not for key TO drops), and while he has been below average in the other games, the factors I’ve listed have contributed mightily to those losses…..in the end, it comes down the wins and losses (remember the PTI guys touting him as MVP candidate when Buffalo was 4-0 last year?), and Trent might have had a couple more wins this year, which would make this discussion much more optimistic

by McGee24 on Nov 4, 2009 4:24 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

- Schouman was available last year, and he still stunk. Blame Robert Royal if you want.
- I had planned to mention penalties briefly in this article, but it slipped my mind. I have made many mentions of those before, so good catch.
- True in the sense that it didn’t give the O a chance at key drives, but we’re talking about when he’s been on the field, so I don’t think that’s particularly relevant.
- Trent had an INT against Tampa in Week 2 that I think has slipped your mind.

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by Brian Galliford on Nov 4, 2009 4:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

glad to see you got the numbering thing down :-)

I am so clever that sometimes I don’t understand a single word of what I am saying
Trent Edwards - Backup QB until furthur notice. Care to prove me wrong Trent?

by J2 on Nov 4, 2009 4:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

On a base level, I want to believe that Bill Walsh knew what he was talking about, and looking at, when he rec’d Edwards to Levy. These aren’t two football idiots we’re talking about here. I’d hate to even guess their combined years of experience.
Edwards has certainly not been blessed with a good environment in which to grow and prosper.
That being said, and as Brian has pointed out – he hasn’t taken the bull by the horns himself, either.

I know I’m a broken record, but its the dysfunctional system. Tom Brady was nothing overly special at Michigan. Great pro QB. Chuck Long was incredible in college, but a pro clip board holder. What type of systems did they go into? Brady a good one, Long a horrible one. That is not to insinuate that Chuck Long ever becomes a perenial All Pro – that is on him, like improving is on Edwards. But the idea is sound.

As I weakly tried to point out yesterday, the current Bills coaching staff, for whatever reason, seems unable to assemble a workable, let alone successful offensive philosophy. They can’t come up with one – God forbid actually implement it!

I groan and shake head whenever Edwards throws yet another no yard pass just like the majority. But, the guy has the physical skills. He’s 6’4 230. Bigger than Kelly. Has a decent arm. Not a Kelly cannon, but enough. His problems, in my opinion, are between his ears, and in the never ending line of fubared coaching.

Whomever the hopeful GM will be (Phil Savage?), my first question would be in HC interviews, and rightfully so: what about our current roster? what do you see? Can you bring out the best in these players? Is Edwards ready to take the next step? If not, can him and move on.

by LeClaireBill on Nov 4, 2009 5:11 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I have no doubt

that any good things said about trent via Bill Walsh

were said if he played in a west coast offfense.

We don’t have that.

We have the Steve Fairchild greatest show on turf spread offense with inspiration via Mike Maartz.

There's not a wide receiver who is fast enough, that J.P. Losman can't overthrow him on a fly pattern.

by The Buffalo Kid on Nov 4, 2009 5:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

perhaps you've noticed that steve fairchild hasn't been the O coordinator for two years?

by LeClaireBill on Nov 4, 2009 5:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

yeah i noticed that

but for the most part we still run the same offense.

There's not a wide receiver who is fast enough, that J.P. Losman can't overthrow him on a fly pattern.

by The Buffalo Kid on Nov 4, 2009 6:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

and perhaps you've noticed that the Bills run no version of a spread offense at all?

by LeClaireBill on Nov 4, 2009 5:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

we actually run the spread

with horrific results……….

what have you been watching?

There's not a wide receiver who is fast enough, that J.P. Losman can't overthrow him on a fly pattern.

by The Buffalo Kid on Nov 4, 2009 6:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

We don't run the spread at all

What are you watching?!?!!

Lining up in the shotgun occasionally and very rarely running anything outside the tackles seems to indicate no spread….

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Nov 5, 2009 1:38 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

we havent run it much this year

but we had plenty last year with empty backfields and horrific results

There's not a wide receiver who is fast enough, that J.P. Losman can't overthrow him on a fly pattern.

by The Buffalo Kid on Nov 5, 2009 6:31 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Bill Walsh never recommended Trent Edwards to anyone

He called Levy after the draft to say he liked the pick and the player.

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Nov 5, 2009 1:37 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The problem with Trent

is this coaching staff thinks he is second coming of Tom Brady, when in reality he is much more like Rich Gannon, teach him to throw a few feet in front of the numbers and give him a west coast offense and he will be ok….continue with the spread an watch him get killed.

There's not a wide receiver who is fast enough, that J.P. Losman can't overthrow him on a fly pattern.

by The Buffalo Kid on Nov 4, 2009 5:21 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

They should plan to get Evans open. Put him in motion, run crossing patterns, whatever. Opposing defenses are saying that we don’t put anyone in motion and it makes it easy for them. The play is super easy to read.

Then he should look to Evans first. Then Nelson, then a running back. And maybe that other guy, what’s his name?

by Bill Frank on Nov 4, 2009 5:30 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

you're probably thinking of Jonathan Stupar.

Jonathan Stupar won the Heisman…while playing in the NFL!

by JPH on Nov 4, 2009 5:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

scratch that,

you’re definitely thinking of Jonathan Stupar. He’s the only other weapon they have.

Jonathan Stupar won the Heisman…while playing in the NFL!

by JPH on Nov 4, 2009 5:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Terrell? Terrance? I forget. Anyway, when it’s “easy” for the QB it can also be easy for the defense.

by Bill Frank on Nov 4, 2009 5:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Fantastic article

Brings the Edwards’ situation into clear focus. Something I may disagree with:

Given the way his career has unfolded and the direction the Bills are likely to head after this season, however, it seems like a virtual certainty that if Edwards ever reaches his full potential as an NFL quarterback, it probably won’t be as a Buffalo Bill.

I’m not sure if this will be the case, but it may.

As much as I’ve scouted QB’s this year, I’ve said before and still say that I want to withhold judgment on Edwards until the end of the season. I think he’s got talent- maybe back-up talent and maybe more. But we can’t be sure at this point.

However, I envision Edwards potentially progressing under a new coaching staff, depending on that staff.

A new coaching staff may like Edwards (Jon Gruden wanted Paul Allen to draft him). I’m sure plenty of coaches around the league like Edwards as a player. And the new coaching staff may see Edwards’ regression as a side-effect of new OC’s and the poor OL play.

The new OC will obviously change the scheme. So that won’t change the lack of offensive scheme continuity. Edwards is a smart guy though, and will be fairly seasoned, and should be able to handle it fairly well. The scheme may be a breath of fresh air for Edwards as well.

The big point, IMO, is that the OL should improve. I think keeping Edwards upright is the key to all of this. Against NE in the first game, his decisions and throws were good, and despite the new OC and OL and all the negativity / pressure surrounding the team at the time, Edwards played well. A lot of that had to do with decent OL protection.

With the maturation of the OL (Bell, Wood, Levitre), the return of Butler, and potential additions (Okung, Bulaga?), Edwards could get back on track with Buffalo.

Lots of “what if’s.” I’m not trying to defend Edwards. I just think keeping him upright and limiting pressure to a level of normalcy will do wonders for Edwards’ game.

by Der Jaeger on Nov 4, 2009 5:46 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Gruden would do wonders for Trent

I would prefer Shanahn

but if we stick withTrent……Gruden is the man to get the most out of him

There's not a wide receiver who is fast enough, that J.P. Losman can't overthrow him on a fly pattern.

by The Buffalo Kid on Nov 4, 2009 5:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

really? gruden is a proponent of the “west coast” offense that you mocked above.

by LeClaireBill on Nov 4, 2009 5:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i think the wc offense

is the right one for trent, i surely didn’t mock it

most of the posters here do, so you may have misunderstood my position

There's not a wide receiver who is fast enough, that J.P. Losman can't overthrow him on a fly pattern.

by The Buffalo Kid on Nov 5, 2009 6:26 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

if you look above

i said teach him to throw in front of the numbers and give trent a west coast offense and he will be ok

not sure why you think i mocked the wc offense

There's not a wide receiver who is fast enough, that J.P. Losman can't overthrow him on a fly pattern.

by The Buffalo Kid on Nov 5, 2009 6:28 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I agree

It’s putting a cart before a bunch of horses (getting viable GM, hiring HC that can effect culture change) but Gruden would do the job.

by Der Jaeger on Nov 4, 2009 6:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

My issue with Trent

is that his upside is that he could be a “good game manager”

what that means is that, at best, he’ll be great at not having any impact on the game, positive or negative.

I’ve talked about my problems with that for a while. (that means to be successful he needs to be surrounded by terrific playmakers on all sides of the ball, which seems like a tall task for a front office that’s found roughly 1 or 2 playmakers in the past 10 years), but going further: he’s not a good game manager. He throws interceptions all the time. He was tied with Kerry Collins for the league lead when he got hurt.

So when your upside is you’ll be impact-neutral on the game and you’re bad at that, where does that leave you?

7-9 at best, as far as I can see.

Jonathan Stupar won the Heisman…while playing in the NFL!

by JPH on Nov 4, 2009 5:48 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

The thing I noticed when Fitzpatrick started doing the QB interviews was his positive attitude and belief that the Bills could win. It made me realize that Trent hasn’t sounded like that in a long time. When he was young and hopeful, he did. And I don’t blame the guy for losing faith. This season is turning out the way I’m sure many of us expected when we saw Schonert and Langston fired (are all the injuries at RT going to be the start of a Langston Walker Curse?) and I think it’s pretty clear the firings affected Trent as well. It just seems like it would be really hard to improve when your OC and QBC/HC are telling you completely different things, neither of which you’re particularly comfortable with. And I still see Trent as a 25 year old kid who could have room to grow. It’s just disgusting to see a young talent wasted because a team can’t get an offensive line together.

That said, one of the things that you always read about the good QBs are the time they spend after practice with receivers making sure every route is timed perfectly. You rarely hear that about Trent, and that makes me less sympathetic to him. However, the Bills offense keeps changing, so it must be hard to know which routes he should be practicing.

It would be great if we could have an O-line like the Giants or the Patriots where the same 5 guys play together every game for 5 years. I think the Bills have the start of it right now, but I’m concerned when the new regime is hired they will clean house once again and the O-line will be back to square 1 for the 10th year in a row.

by williamsDT on Nov 4, 2009 7:51 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Edwards is and has failed

Good read Brian, I just have one thing to say, when a man faces adversity he has a choice to eithier “die on his feet or live on his knee” its clear are Quarterback has chosen the latter

Rrrawrrrr, rrrawrrr like a dungeon dragon-Busta Ryhmes

by Moe_frm_B_ on Nov 4, 2009 10:04 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

brian

this is a piece I would almost pay to read! Good stuff my man. You hit the nail on the head on many key issues regarding play callers, Jauron’s inability to hire an OC, and Trent’s crutch of game-manager. The problem with offense in Buffalo is that there is “no plan.” There is no “identity.” It’s just musical chairs with the OL, QB and OC. Never confuse hope with a plan. Never mistake activity for achievement. Those are 2 pieces of advice the Bills and Jauron need to adhere to their offense. I don’t think this 4 year regime under Jauron would have been nearly as inept, had if only he broughten in a OC that could really coach Edwards. Edwards was a good pick, but I don’t think the coaching was ever nearly coherent enough for him to succeed. And now with this season and another concussion, all I can do is feel sorry for Trent Edwards.

MARVelous - "I went from America's team to North America's Team" Terrell Owens

by MARVelous on Nov 5, 2009 1:37 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Never confuse hope with a plan. Never mistake activity for achievement.

Now that is a great choice of words!!!!

"If you don't have good habits you have bad habits there are no in between habits"

by Goose22 on Nov 5, 2009 8:27 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Two words what happened to Edwards and why he might not ever be the same QB or what we hoped him to be...

“Adrian Wilson”

That cheap shot hit last year took all the life out of Edwards and he hasn’t been able to read the defense or pull the trigger the same ever since. He has been in downward spiral ever since and even though he had the entire off-season, pre-season, no more JP over his shoulder, etc. He can’t shake the cobwebs from his brain that are causing a mental block in his agressiveness and fearlessness it takes to be a QB in this league.

He has been playing timid ever since and other teams know this when they game plan him. Double cover over the top and give trent everything underneath because that is a safe option for him… Then in down and distance for obvious pass downs, blitz him hard from the corners and outside.

He’s never snapped out of it from that “hit” and even after this concussion I am afraid that he may never have it more than being a good back-up somewhere.

by dabillsr1 on Nov 5, 2009 11:34 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Post concussion syndrome

Absolutely agree with your analysis of his performance. But what you desctibe isn’t uncommon with people who suffer concussions, similar to declining skills in boxers. I don’t think it’s a reflection on Edwards or the Bills scouting. It’s one of those unfortunate things that happens. The subsequent concussions come easier and easier. I wouldn’t be surprised to find he gets advice to consider retiring.

by Rick A on Nov 5, 2009 11:58 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I live in St. Louis and have seen the same thing with Bulger and Trent Green in the past few years

Both of them played here (Green the second time around) behind bad offensive lines and they were never the same QB they were… sure age and abilities play into it, but it is a serious thing that effects good players.

Let’s watch Brian Westbrook in the coming weeks/months and see how he responds to the concussion he received from London Fletcher’s knee a few weeks ago.

IMO, regarding Trent… 2nd concussion in as many years will make him more downfield shy… especially if our OL can’t give him 4-5 seconds to scan and throw.

by dabillsr1 on Nov 6, 2009 10:21 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Excuses

He couldn’t read a defense that well before that either.

Everybody talks about how awesome he was for the 4 games prior to that. What I saw was a mediocre QB who played well in the 4th Q of some games. He did nothing for much of those four games.

Maybe he just isn’t any good? Maybe he never was, and hasn’t improved all that much? Isn’t that a legit possibility instead of saying he never recovered from some concussion? If that was the case, I doubt he’d be allowed on the field….

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Nov 5, 2009 7:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Those were awful pass defenses too. Here is how those opponents did in the yards allowed per attempt category:

SEA – 28th – 7.7
JAX – 30th – 8.1
OAK – 22nd – 7.2
STL – 31st – 8.3

I signed up for Second Life about a year ago. Back then my life was so great that I literally wanted a second one. In my Second Life I was also a paper salesman and I was also named Dwight. Absolutely everything was the same. Except I could fly. - Dwight Schrute

by kaisertown on Nov 5, 2009 9:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Tebow

Tebow took the same kind of vicious hit in the Kentucky game then the back of his head hit a knee before he hit the ground.

Since that concussion he has not been the same. He looks OK but you can tell he is not picking up his reads as quickly, the whole Gator offense looks a tad out of sync. He looked a lot better in the Georgia game but we shall see.

Trance took that hit from Wilson and I believe he has not fully recovered. The hit he took to get his last concussion didn’t look that bad on replay’s. When first watching it I was more concerned about his knees an neck the way he was twisted. So his concussion seems to fit the criteria of they come easier.

"If you don't have good habits you have bad habits there are no in between habits"

by Goose22 on Nov 5, 2009 12:38 PM EST reply actions 0 recs