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Levi Jones: Thoughts from Cincy Jungle

Some here at Rumblings have been going back and forth on Levi Jones, the former left tackle for the Bengals.  So I went over to the SB Nation Bengals blog, Cincy Jungle, to get their take on the once-formidable tackle.  Here's what they had to say:

indesignkat:

Levi is a LT, and a good one when he’s healthy. The problem is that he’s gone 3 years without being healthy for more than a few games at a stretch. Marvin has very little patience for anyone who doesn’t play, for any reason, unless they’re a superstar talent.

firstpick:

We drafted a LT in the 4th round last year and when Levi went down for good last year, Anthony Collins stepped in and played excellent. So we were not suprised when Levi was cut. Hes a very good LT when healthy. i wouldnt play him at RT. It was time for us to move on.

Would i say sign him? Well i live in Buffalo and i know the Bills. So i would say yes. Your really dont want Langston Walker at LT. but Levi WILL miss a game next year. so plan for it.

smoormandiddy

He’s a good guy and still has the passion (in my opinion) but just can’t physically handle it anymore.

IgnatiusJReilly:

Beyond the injury, Levi had what may or may not have been a legitimate gripe with the coaches and medical staff here- concerning pressuring him to come back from a knee problem(I think) before he was ready. This, of course, made the injury worse, made him lose playing time, eventually kind of drove him out of the starting line-up. What really transpired, I couldn’t say but I wouldn’t be shocked to find a rejuvenated Levi in a different environment. Just food for thought.

Kirkendall, the lead blogger over at Cincy Jungle:

There’s several issues with Jones. Injury is the top concern. However, because of the injuries, he’s slowed down. He’s not as fleet footed, and he’s had problems with speed rushers. In truth, he’s a shell of what he was.

Kat is right though. If Jones is completely healthy, he’s really good. The problem is that Cincinnati had to move on to rebuild the foundation of their offensive line. Keeping Jones meant that he’d start. Otherwise, we’d be paying a guy nearly $5 million a year to sit the bench. It just wasn’t feasible.

*****

My argument all along is that when Jones got hurt, and he will get hurt at some point, our line would be much worse off than if we had Walker there from the start.  You can plan for weaknesses in a player like Langston Walker's game.  You can't plan for when or how long Jones will be out.  At that point you would be stuck with Kirk Chambers or Demetrius Bell with very little practice time at the position.  Even if you move Walker over it's not even the same as now because he will have had a chance to get better in the position during OTAs, camps, and the preseason.  Walker has proven to be durable and while his upside is not as high as Jones would be, his basement is much higher. 

Of course if Walker gets hurt the argument is worthless anyways.  :-)

If you have comments on the situation or for me, leave them here.  If you want to ask the Bengals guys more questions, hop on over to my post at Cincy Jungle.  Many thanks to their guys for the insight.

This FanPost was written by a registered user of Buffalo Rumblings. Its views do not necessarily reflect the views of Rumblings' editorial staff, but are just as valued as our own.

2 recs  |  Comment 21 comments

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Agree/Disagree

MRW, I agree with you that continuity is important. However, I will disagree with you in the fact that continuity for the sake of continuity is not necessarily a good idea.

Walker IS NOT a LT. Yes you can game plan for his weaknesses, but getting blown up by good, especially quick DEs, means you have to either hold a RB,FB, or TE to spy this or force a double team with the LG.

Bad Idea in my opinion. These players could serve better uses, i.e. outlet receivers or double teaming the NG or lead blocking, etc.

You did a very good job with being impartial in this post and to you I give you kudos, and a rec. But I think we need to look at all viable options at LT and evaluate them. I think this team has a possibility in putting it together this year and playing Walker at LT is not positive.

"It's that time of the year where all teams are involved in making some, to a degree, painful decisions." - Marv Levy

by Jason from OH-IO on May 16, 2009 3:24 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

But can you say that Jones won't be beat by the same guys?

Jones knee is slowing him down. The Bengals saw it. They fired him.

You can chip a DE and be an outlet receiver.

I don’t have a vendetta against Levi Jones. That’s not my point with this. But I agree with the Jungle’s assesment that his injuries will hurt him in the long run. We’re not talking about a shoulder injury or a bicep tear. His knee is what made him great. The quickness and power in his legs made him awesome. If that is starting to wear away he’s not great anymore.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.

by MattRichWarren on May 16, 2009 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

All speculation

Until the Bills look at jones and determine his health, I don’t think we can say he has “slowed down” He played the last two seasons hurt. IF healthy this year, maybe he regains his form.

If he is not healthy, he isn’t worth signing. Bring him in for a workout/physical then decide. I think the Bungal fans had some different takes. But one thing they all agree on is he is a LT. We still need a LT.

"It's that time of the year where all teams are involved in making some, to a degree, painful decisions." - Marv Levy

by Jason from OH-IO on May 16, 2009 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Dude it’s not speculation, it’s medical fact! Ever thought that maybe the Bills are passing on him because of what the Bengals’ medical staff has openly said about him at the time of his injuries? His knee is a MAJOR issue, and he will simply never be the same player that he was.

I’ll compare his knee issues with Shaun Alexander’s. Alexander was a FANTASTIC back until he injured his knee. Then his speed and mobility slowed down to the point where they decided to start Maurice Morris ahead of him. He’s play has dropped so much that even the Redskins wont keep him on their roster for the vet minimum! And guess what, Jones has the same injury that is ending Alexander’s career.

I agree with bringing in a quality LT in order to put Walker back at RT, but Levi Jones is no longer a quality LT.

by CanadianBillsFan on May 17, 2009 6:55 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You are a doctor

Canadian – am glad you have reviewed Levi’s x-rays, and run him through a full battery of physical tests and therefore can state medical facts.

Get real, it is all speculation. The only thing we know is that he has been riddled with injuries the past couple of years and we are assuming, probably correctly, that his knees/legs will not regain their pro-bowl form. BUT, let’s at least fairly evaluate this guy as to where he is THIS year.

"It's that time of the year where all teams are involved in making some, to a degree, painful decisions." - Marv Levy

by Jason from OH-IO on May 17, 2009 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ok I see I’m just not going to get through to you. Your to stubborn to see that actual doctors have said that his knee is done, or that his old team said the same thing, or that the injury that he does have mean that his knee will never be the same, or that the surgery that he had on his knee was to remove a ligament that was too damaged to repare, or that because of that surgery Jones will always have pain and swelling in that knee that will cause him to miss half of each season from now out. Dude I’d like a BETTER Lt then Walker too, but Jones is not better.

by CanadianBillsFan on May 17, 2009 6:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sources for any of these alleged career ending injuries?

"It's that time of the year where all teams are involved in making some, to a degree, painful decisions." - Marv Levy

by Jason from OH-IO on May 17, 2009 11:06 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Dude we give you the sources and stories over and over again. What else do you want from us?

You not going to be happy until the Bills medical staff tells you that his knee is sh*t are you?

by CanadianBillsFan on May 18, 2009 3:09 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The thing about this post that really got me thinking was:

firstpick lives in Buffalo and he’s still a Bungles fan???

by thefourwinds on May 16, 2009 6:32 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I thought the same thing. I'll go ask him.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.

by MattRichWarren on May 16, 2009 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

New opinion from Cincy Jungle up there now.

Some guy who looks like he’s Brian Moorman’s daddy. :-)

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.

by MattRichWarren on May 16, 2009 6:40 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I actually think I would pass on Levi Jones. After looking over his injury history, he isn’t injury prone. He’s much, much worse in that he has chronic knee problems that are the result of wear and tear, previous injuries and necessary surgeries that have removed ligament.

So when Jones is on the injury report, it isn’t due to a specific injury. He’s just got pain, swelling and the limited mobility that comes from both of those. It isn’t like he has a history of muscle tears and broken bones where there is a clear recovery time. His injuries are more of the you get back pain as you get older variety. It’s like a catcher who can’t play every day because his knees are shot. He isn’t injured, his knees have just degenerated to the point where they can’t hold up to the abuse that they would be asked to.

by kaisertown on May 16, 2009 8:28 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Bengals fan here

Let me give you some things you may not be able to find about Levi Jones. He was a ProBowl alternate in 2004 and 2005. He went through a stretch on games where he went up against Dwight Freeny, Joey Porter, and Terell Suggs. and Jones did not let up one sack and actually held Porter and Freeney without a tackle. He was on the verge of being a top LT in the league, That was at his prime. When he was fully healthy. He dosnt work out with the team in the offseason. Jones dosnt like to use the team doctors, and instead uses his own doctors. Oh! Jones and Joey Porter absolutley hate each other! they fight on and off the field. Im sure you guys have seen the Video when Porter and his thugs jump Levi in a Casino.So that could be fun to watch. Heres the scouting report on ESPN insider

Comment: Jones has been troubled by injuries quite a bit of late, but when healthy and at full strength, he is an excellent athlete. He has a very good size and athletic ability combination. He has good competitiveness and toughness. He is light on his feet and quick out of his stance in both the run and passing game. Jones can set quickly to handle the top-end speed rushers at this level. He is a natural knee-bender, who can redirect with ease and is a very flexible athlete. While he has ample strength, he isn’t overly powerful, but he does look to finish his blocks. He doesn’t have particularly heavy hands and rarely stuns defensive ends with his punch. Jones has a lot of talent, but gets beaten more than you would expect from someone with his abilities. He needs to play at the same high level snap after snap with more consistency. His technique is generally sound, but can waver, adding to his inconsistency. He also can be overly anxious and needs to do a better job being patient. Still, when he is healthy, few linemen in the league are on par with his combination of size and agility.

Oh and even though i live in WNY i do love the Bengals. Maybe it was everyone else in the house loving the Bills. or maybe it was my mother having a crush on Boomer Esiason. i dont know. But i still root for the Bills unless they play the Bengals. If you see an Orange Monte Carlo driving around the area… thats me. give me a wave. and ill yell Whodey?!

by firstPick on May 16, 2009 9:06 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Thanks for coming over man.

I try to hop over to other blogs when they are looking at or signed one of our former guys. It really helps people get a feeling from someone who knows the guy a little bit better.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.

by MattRichWarren on May 17, 2009 8:48 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Another new comment from IgnatiusJReilly up there now.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.

by MattRichWarren on May 17, 2009 8:52 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

“My argument all along is that when Jones got hurt, and he will get hurt at some point, our line would be much worse off than if we had Walker there from the start. You can plan for weaknesses in a player like Langston Walker’s game. You can’t plan for when or how long Jones will be out.”

Not that I want Jones, but with that argument you’re saying we shouldn’t be starting Trent Edwards. He’s been hurt every year and misses games, should we not start him because there’s a good chance he’ll miss games?

New York City Buffalo Bills Backers
www.nycbbb.com

by BillsNYC on May 18, 2009 9:59 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Yes and no.

Levi Jones may not be significantly better at LT than Walker because of his injuries. Trent Edwards, IMO, is significantly better than Ryan Fitzpatrick. It is something Trent has to prove to the Bills, though. He needs to be able to play in 15 or 16 games this year.

Every QB not named Favre or Manning gets hurt. Walker hasn’t missed a game while a member of the Bills.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.

by MattRichWarren on May 18, 2009 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That’s totally different. The point is that Buffalo needs to have their best guys on the field as often as possible. So having Trent for 12-14 games and a backup play the rest is currently the best way for Buffalo to get good QB play.

So the point about Jones missing time is would you rather have an OL of Walker – Levitre – Hang – Wood – Butler for 16 games OR Jones – Wood – Hang – Butler – Walker for 8 and Chambers – Wood – Hang – Butler – Walker for the other 8. The answer is debatable, but that is the point he’s trying to make.

by kaisertown on May 18, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Good points made by MRW and kaiser, but the most relevant point is that you don’t have change several other positions when the QB goes down.

by thefourwinds on May 18, 2009 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

My initial point was that Chambers would directly replace Jones.

No shuffling because of the timing. Which means we wouldn’t end up having our five best guys out there. It would be the 4 best plus our 6th best (Chambers assuming Levitre is better suited at OG). So the point needs to focus around when the change is taking place.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.

by MattRichWarren on May 18, 2009 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

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