Watched some Bills/Jets replay
I miss football.
I needed some sort of Bills football and fortunately, well unfortunately, this game happened to be on NFL Replay. Thought I'd throw together some thoughts.
-J.P. Losman stinks, but it's still somewhat hard to believe he received no interest on the open market. It's not hard to believe he didn't get signed, but the lack of interest was a bit odd. I guess his head and inability to read a D was too much for any team to bother going after him.
He played like Trent Edwards that day. Lots of dump offs to the running backs because the WR's couldn't get open downfield. Doesn't it seem like our WR's struggle more than most to get open? Losman sure loved to throw the high ball too. Any time he threw it downfield, more than 5 yards, it was high. I'm guessing that didn't help his cause either.
I sure hope our offense this year doesn't revolve around dumpoffs to RB's, TE's and the occasional WR. Trent needs to go downfield and can't just do it when it's absolutely necessary. The WR's need to help him out by actually getting open too.
-Glad we've hung onto Roscoe Parrish. He's pretty darn good returning punts.
-Leo might be even better at returning kicks. BS call on the return TD that got called back....
-Keith Ellison made his only play of the year! It was on the fake punt where he ran for a first down.....
-I love watching Marshawn Lynch run. He's so tough to bring down in the open field. I just wish we'd get him the ball more in that capacity. Fairchild didn't do it, and neither does Schonert too often. Where are the outside pitches to him, the screens, the stretch handoffs??? He's so wiggly and quick with his cuts. What a joy to watch run the ball. Dierdorf couldn't stop slobbering all over him. At one point he said that he hasn't seen a runner refuse to go down like Lynch in a loooooong time.
(Side note: why haven't we heard about his appeal yet? Did he appeal? I forget. His suspension has to get reduced, right? Wife beater Brandon Marshall and his multiple arrests got his reduced to 1 game....why won't Lynch and his gun in the trunk arrest? I guess we won't hear about it until the HOF game is upon us.)
-Derek Fine is a better athlete than we give him credit for. I forget how well he performed at the Combine....3rd most reps for a TE, 2nd best shuttle time, best cone drill time. He's going to be a good player for us this year, and not just as a blocker....
-Fred Jackson is a great backup and that run for the TD he had against the Jets where he refused to go down was a thing of beauty. I love the one-two punch of Marshawn and him. Sprinkling in Dominic Rhodes occasionally and I absolutely love our running backs. I just hope the blocking can hold up and give them enough room to run....
-I absolutely loved the enthusiasm and emotion after his TD by the entire offense. One thing this team didn't do much of last year was quit.
-I hate Brett Favre.
-He was so washed up at the end of last year. Maybe it was the shoulder, but his decision making was just as dinged up.
-Donte Whitner can't cover anyone. I've said that a lot before, and this was a game where he proved that. At various times, the team had him covering Chris Baker, Jerricho Cotchery, David Clowney, Dustin Keller and he got beat by all of them. He's always a step late. Do we continue lining him up on receivers this year? Can we afford to?
-I like Steve Johnson's blocking ability. It's still a work in progress, but he has the attitude and willingness to be very good at it. That's going to be one reason he sees the field this year.
-Wow, Leodis McKelvin sure looked terrible that day, and proved why he still has a LONG ways to go before he's dependable. As bad as Whitner might have been, Leo was much worse. He was getting beat downfield all day by Laveranues Coles. Luckily, he's getting a full offseason to improve and better understand what he needs to do. He's got to shore up that separation he allows the receivers to get.
-Did I forget to mention anything? Oh yeah, my favorite topic....the anemic pass rush. Haha, it wasn't even worth calling it a rush that day. 3 and 4 man rushes just don't work with this defense. We've got to hope Aaron Maybin is a stud right away because we sure need it. Favre had ALL DAY to throw in this one.
-Terrence McGee is so underrated, when he's healthy.
-Why do the Bills always find new ways to lose? Why us!?!?
This FanPost was written by a registered user of Buffalo Rumblings. Its views do not necessarily reflect the views of Rumblings' editorial staff, but are just as valued as our own.
0 recs |
99 comments
Comments
all of this is right
I don;t know who to blame
J.P. for fumbling or Turk for calling that ridiculous play
It's Like Rooting For The Toilet To Flush....
by Toronto? on Jun 22, 2009 1:34 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Can’t we blame both? Turk for calling a bad play AND JP for screwing it up.
by CanadianBillsFan on Jun 22, 2009 2:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And Jason Peters definitely deserves a mention for not blocking anybody and allowing Elam (who stripped the ball out) to hit JP without being touched.
by kaisertown on Jun 22, 2009 8:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just goes to show you, it was a team effort!
by CanadianBillsFan on Jun 22, 2009 8:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ahahahaha
It's Like Rooting For The Toilet To Flush....
by Toronto? on Jun 22, 2009 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
in turks defense
if any other qb is in charge of that play theres going to b a decent gain from that play. grant it we need a qb in there other than jp to run that play but still…
by billsstein on Jun 22, 2009 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Decent gain?
The plan was to throw to a FB who had, what, 2 receptions for 1 yard all year? I said at the time that I didn’t mind the call because the defense was geared to stop the run on that play. Peters deserves the blame—Losman doesn’t have eyes in the back of his head.
by Ron From NM on Jun 23, 2009 12:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If it was there...
JP also has a good set of legs. He could have run for the first down, too.
Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.
by MattRichWarren on Jun 23, 2009 7:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Jets had been geared up to stop the run that whole drive (4th quarter?)
They couldn’t stop the Beast. All we had to do is feed the Beast. With any other QB in the game, I would have been fine with the play. But with JP…… putting the game in his hands is an unnecessary risk.
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 23, 2009 8:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
JP…… putting the game in his hands is an unnecessary risk.
Thus summing up Losman’s entire NFL career.
by CanadianBillsFan on Jun 23, 2009 9:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Might be summing up his entire life. Too harsh?
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 23, 2009 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Probably isn’t too harsh though… man sometimes I just can’t help pitty the guy a bit.
by CanadianBillsFan on Jun 23, 2009 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There were a lot of things I liked about JP
He worked hard, stayed out of trouble, gave back to the community, tried to be a leader, etc. He just process information fast enough for the NFL which lead to his erratic play. Maybe he will get a software upgrade. I wish him the best, but have no interest in watching him play play in some second rate league.
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 23, 2009 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’m just glad that neither of the guys who screwed that play up are still with the team. Without them, we’re at least one win better.
by Dr. Brackish Okun on Jun 24, 2009 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And perhaps more inspired to finish the season on a strong note and may actually have made the playoffs… stupid Losman.
by CanadianBillsFan on Jun 24, 2009 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, you’re right about just every point you make imo, especially concerning Donte Whitner being a mediocre safety. He never makes any plays, he talks the talk but NEVER walks the walk. If he continues to be as pathetic as he has been for the last three seasons, I could seriously see a new coaching staff seriously considering moving him, also now with us having Jairus Byrd that can actually make plays and lots of them.
The one other topic I would have loved for you to mention is Perry Fewell and how he still has a lot of flaws to his game. I think we all agree that Perry has a very bright future in this league, but looking at the tape (Thank God for NFL Game Pass), it’s evident that he lacks a lot still.
An example is with blitzing – he’s not at all creative in that departement. It’s always Poz and Kawika that are blitzing and with the same result every time – no pressure on the QB. Maybe, he could actually consider blitzing Bryan Scott or Donte Whitner as well or use some more stunts for his DT’s, because our pass-rush was unbelievably pathetic.
We’d all better hope and pray that Aaron Schobel being back fully healthy, a new D-line coach in Bob Sanders and Aaron Maybin will make the difference, because we are not going to stand a shot at the playoffs, if we don’t do a much, much better job at getting to the QB than last year.
by BillsfanfromDenmark on Jun 22, 2009 2:03 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Great post
Bob Sanders may make an enormous difference this year. If you want more stunts for your DT’s, you need to look to your d-line coach, not just Fewell.
All in all, a great post by Kurupt. I especially agree on Fred Jackson, McGee and Leo (alas). One small point: the Bills’ pass rush was obviously weak, but it also true that the Jets have done an excellent job of building up their o-line. That’s an important reason why we had such trouble getting to Favre.
by Macktruck on Jun 22, 2009 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I could seriously see a new coaching staff seriously considering moving him, also now with us having Jairus Byrd that can actually make plays and lots of them.
Byrd hasnt played one down in the NFL. chill. Donte has never settled into one position for injury reasons and his ability to move into the slot.
Gabezababe
by Gabezababe on Jun 22, 2009 8:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
he got beat by all of them. He’s always a step late.
concerning Donte Whitner being a mediocre safety
We should probably have been clued in by his Big 10 heritage. With proper pressure from the front 4 and Byrd at free safety, he should do fine in the strong safety role.
Or he was a step late playing free safety in one game last year because of all the jumping around over the last few years and he hasn’t found a comfort zone yet.
I guess we should give him this year before we decide he’s terrible or not, especially if he plays a lot on the free side this year.
by syrbillsfan on Jun 24, 2009 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or he was a step late playing free safety in one game last year because of all the jumping around over the last few years and he hasn’t found a comfort zone yet.
He’s a football player isn’t he? He’s been in the league for 3 years, right? He’s practiced as a free safety, right? Why all the excuses then?
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 25, 2009 1:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because excuses are all he has...
Whitner should be better than he has shown. I have hope he can take the next step but maybe he has plateaued. If he has he is at best an average safety. It’s not ideal but I can live with that.
Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.
by MattRichWarren on Jun 25, 2009 9:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We can live with it because we have to! We should have expected more from a top 10 picks, but that’s more on the team and their poor drafting.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 25, 2009 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly, don’t blame Whitner for being drafted high. I don’t think that he’s plateaued, but I don’t think that there is much improvement left either. I think Whitner is a slightly above average safety with a great work ethic and good leadership skills, and i can live with that.
by CanadianBillsFan on Jun 25, 2009 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
that game summed up the whole season for the BILLS IMO.........
just disheartening
Godspeed Nick - RIP - 1986-2009
by norcaliangelsfan on Jun 22, 2009 2:38 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I agree with a lot of what you say, but I take issue with two things:
1.
I love watching Marshawn Lynch run. He’s so tough to bring down in the open field. I just wish we’d get him the ball more in that capacity. Fairchild didn’t do it, and neither does Schonert too often. Where are the outside pitches to him, the screens, the stretch handoffs??? He’s so wiggly and quick with his cuts.
Yet above you said:
I sure hope our offense this year doesn’t revolve around dumpoffs to RB’s, TE’s and the occasional WR.
This is how this type of offense gets the RB the ball in space, short passes and checkdowns. That’s not getting the RB the ball in space?? If the defense is fixating on stopping the long ball, this is where the QB goes to pick up the yards.
Now, in one sense I’m with you, I’d like to see a better variety of running plays, and frankly, this coming year, the strength of the Oline may very well be up the middle rather than wide. We’ll see.
2.
Derek Fine is a better athlete than we give him credit for.
No, Dereke Fine is a better athlete than you give him credit for. Many of us have known all along what a good athlete Fine is. Last year he was injured for a significant portion of the offseason and the beginning third of the season. When he came back, he came back strong and impressive. If he stays healthy, he’ll be even more impressive this year.
"I know I'm a true receiver..." Roscoe Parrish, Buffalo Bills - May 2009
"In my heart, I know I'm funny." Lt Steven Hauk, Good Morning Vietnam - 1987
by thefourwinds on Jun 22, 2009 8:41 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
This is how this type of offense gets the RB the ball in space, short passes and checkdowns.
I’m talking about designed plays, not about a last resort dumpoff to the RB when he has little room to run. If the QB is routinely dumping it off to the backs and TE’s, the offense isn’t going to be a whole lot different than last year. I don’t think we can be successful if that’s how plays designed to get the ball downfield play out.
Why can’t there be more plays designed to get Lynch and Jackson the ball on the edge? Pitches, screens, deep handoffs, etc, are all plays that we don’t seem to run enough to take advantage of our backs’ strengths.
No, Dereke Fine is a better athlete than you give him credit for. Many of us have known all along what a good athlete Fine is.
I’ve considered him a good athlete before, but I was hoping to point out to the people that believe Nelson’s athleticism should immediately get him on the field and ahead of Fine.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 22, 2009 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
that we need to stop the last ditch effort dumping off to the running back. We seem to dump on the plays that we need 7 or 8 yrs on third down and are starting off behind the line of scrimmage, usually leads to 3 and outs.
I know that we have exhausted pretty much all topics but this just goes in to the predictability of our offensive play calling. We need some pitches maybe even (successfully) pull a guard or a tackle and bounce the ball outside. We have the extra backs to do this if one gets tired from a play that he ran outside, change it up! The predictability of our running plays is pitiful, if the defense sees the qb hand the ball off they know where the rb is going every time.
Maybe we should have picked up a fullback with actual talent that could run outside and block, who knows?
Good point about Whitner. Drank myself into oblivion on draft day after the Byrd pick, but, i feel a lot better about it now.
by Buffalove83 on Jun 22, 2009 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good point on the FB. In order to run more pitches, it would help to have a FB that is at least competent. McIntyre is pretty awful, so that’ll do us no favors.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 22, 2009 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah...
I don’t see a two-back toss play where Freddy is lead blocking…
I could see a play where the backs cross in the backfield to mess with the MLB but then they are without a lead blocker.
Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.
by MattRichWarren on Jun 22, 2009 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t see a two-back toss play where Freddy is lead blocking…
Well he did steamroll someone in the Chargers game on Marshawn’s TD run, so he can do it on occasion….
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 22, 2009 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe...
I just don’t want to see him trying to lay the wood on linebackers all day…
Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.
by MattRichWarren on Jun 22, 2009 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It worked for me in Madden last year!!
by krytime on Jun 22, 2009 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This article has me excited for this year…based on how we should improve and the possible fixes we’ve implemented
The Bills CAN win any game
by killascript on Jun 22, 2009 9:30 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Why us? Because we are Bills fans :-)
I sure hope our offense this year doesn’t revolve around dumpoffs to RB’s, TE’s and the occasional WR. Trent needs to go downfield and can’t just do it when it’s absolutely necessary. The WR’s need to help him out by actually getting open too.
Better get used to it. We will not be a stretch the field vertically type team…..we are not built for it and the coaches don’t like it. I am not saying we will never throw the deep ball, and with a suspect O-line, it might take awhile before Trent has that kind of time. The good news is YAC, which is where I suspect the majority of our big plays will come from. Expect to see more balls delivered in time and in stride. It is this type of offense where Trent should excel.
(Side note: why haven’t we heard about his appeal yet? Did he appeal? I forget. His suspension has to get reduced, right?
I think we are waiting for Roger to make a decision. This is actually something I have thought about writing a fan post about, but have been to busy. Did the Stallworth situation make it less likely Lynch will get his sentence reduced? How close was Lynch to being in the same positon (or worse) than Stallworth? 1 sec? Would Lynch still have fled and how much worse would that have made the suspension? Who else would have been dragged into the situation? If I remember right, “Scuba Steve” was rumored to have been in the car. As it is, Stallworth is looking at at least a year suspension.
I don’t get the Brett Farve hate thing. The Packers screwed him and he wants to make them pay. I hope he gets the chance. Brett isn’t forcing anyone to play him. I think the man has earned the right to do whatever he wants.
I agree with the rest of what you wrote:-)
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 22, 2009 10:38 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
You’re seemingly confusing last summer’s “hit and run” with his arrest this offseason, which was the loaded gun in the trunk charge. Why should the 3-game suspension depend on what could have happened last summer and what did happen with Stallworth?
The Packers screwed him and he wants to make them pay. I hope he gets the chance. Brett isn’t forcing anyone to play him.
Wait, how did the Packers screw him? He’s the one that kept hinting are retirement every year only to come back. Then he decided to call it quits after the 2007 season, so the team prepared itself to roll with Rodgers. Favre decided to unretire in the summer, but the team had grown sick of his retirement antics and had already given the team over to Rodgers. How is that the team screwing Favre when he’s the one that kept stringing them along? Plus, he did it again this year to the Jets, and they moved on. Instead of just not retiring every offseason, he makes it more about him than the teams in question because he keeps placing them in bad positions. If he had never retired and just kept playing, I would have such a problem with him, but he’s done nothing but put the Packers in a bad position and then forced his way out.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 22, 2009 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
About Favre….
I don’t know K – I’m with Joe on this one. I’ve know a lot of people that have been working for 25+ years that are just as wishy washy with retirement. They say i’m done by the end of the year – then its end of next year. Its a tough thing to do – especially with football players – because once he quits for a year or two – he more than likely just cannot do it. Unless we’re in his position I don’t think we know what he’s going through in that regard.
As far as being selfish – maybe you get that impression and the media certainly gives that impression – but I certaintly do not.
Everyone has a photographic memory… some just don’t have film
by J2 on Jun 22, 2009 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But his retirement is different. Millions of dollars are involved. When he retired, the Packers turned to Rodgers and he was the guy who spent the offseason in GB working with the offense and building something with his teammates. When Favre wanted to unretire in July, the Packers were reluctant because they had been using the offseason to design plays for Rodgers, get him ready to play and psychologically break from the Favre years. That’s putting the team in a bad position, which was totally unfair to them.
It’s different from a people who retire from a normal job. They can be wishy washy all they want, but they are still there getting their work done. If they retire, like Favre did, their position would be filled by someone new. They can’t just decide 4 months later to unretire and force the company to send the new guy packing just to give that person their job back. Well they can, but it’s doubtful they would. If you don’t want to retire, then don’t retire.
I think that Favre was selfish about the whole situation. When he blamed the Packers for it and forced them to trade him, I consider that selfish. He retired, the team went about replacing him and moving on, then he decides to come back and the Packers were the ones to take the brunt of the blame? I don’t think that was right.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 22, 2009 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn’t see the Packers taking any blame from my POV thats for damn sure. Maybe media types – but I listen to about 1% of what most say – I take the “grain of salt” approach.
I also see Favre coming back as options for the Packers – they could either trade, cut or play him. Thats some options there. So they did and they got some compensation for him. They could have held a competition – but they wanted to go with the younger kid – so they did and they traded him off to the Jets. They got something for what they thought was going to be nothing – they should be happy about that. The rest is just politics and heresay – he said she said crap that I never listen to anyways. I guess I just look at it differently – but nothing he said or did made me ever think he was selfish. Just a guy that was/is getting old – wasn’t sure if he could play at the level he wanted to – and when he finally felt good enough and thought he could recover and still play – he came back and said so. Jordan did the same thing – although it wasn’t a yearly event.
if he wants to play let him play – I just htink there’s too much over analzying the Favre thing – its a good topic for sports reporters so they blow it out of proportion and its on every news network and paper this side of venus.
Everyone has a photographic memory… some just don’t have film
by J2 on Jun 22, 2009 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They could have held a competition
I don’t think that was an option. Public opinion would have handed Favre the job, whether that was right or not. Plus, Favre wasn’t going to come back to be in some competition for the starting job.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 22, 2009 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Public opinion would have handed Favre the job
who cares? Decisions such as your starting QB in the NFL shouldn’t be based off of public opinion – best man wins the job.
Everyone has a photographic memory… some just don’t have film
by J2 on Jun 22, 2009 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree….but that doesn’t mean it wouldn’t have occurred in that situation. You really think Packers fans wouldn’t be all up in arms if Favre wasn’t declared the starter after a competition w/Rodgers if he was at least competent in the preseason? It’s not like there would have been a competition anyways, so it’s a moot point…..
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 22, 2009 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it is a moot point – but I think of Bledsoe/Brady – different situations obviously but they did what was better for the team.
GB did the same thing – they obviously didn’t feel that he had enough to give at that point to take another run at a championship so they let him go and took the younger kid. nothing wrong with that – its a football move that they thought would make their team better than with Favre at the helm.
I happen to agree and see both sides. I agree with Favre for wanting to play and I agree with GB for wanting to go with the kid that was groomed for that role. I took it as a win/win…not any other way
Everyone has a photographic memory… some just don’t have film
by J2 on Jun 22, 2009 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The real reason they couldn’t have a competition was money. Green Bay wasn’t going to pay Favre however many millions to be the backup.
by kaisertown on Jun 22, 2009 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Green Bay wasn’t going to pay Favre however many millions to be the backup.
They did offer him a $20+ mil like that to stay home last summer.
by syrbillsfan on Jun 24, 2009 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Was that 20 mil going to count against the salary cap? And that 20 mil was to be paid over 10 years and the organization was going to recoup a large percentage of that. They were have had 10 years of selling Favre merchandise without him getting a significant percentage of the profits and could have put him in commercials and done a variety of other things over the next decade. That’s pretty different from giving him 12 mil to hold the clipboard for one season.
by kaisertown on Jun 25, 2009 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, the difference is that Favre literally retired. He had the press conference and filed the paperwork. He was officially off the Packers payroll and roster and then decided to come back. A normal person wouldn’t have that job waiting for him and Favre didn’t either. I don’t see how anyone could say that GB screwed Favre, especially when you consider that Rogers was the better player last year.
by kaisertown on Jun 22, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Farve all but said he was "forced" to retire by the Packers
You can debate if he should or shouldn’t have retired and come back all you want, but one fact remains. No NFL team is forced to sign him. If there is a team that wants to, who the hell are you guys (not directed at kaisertown alone) to tell them and Farve that he should remain retired?
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 22, 2009 6:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If Favre wants to play, then of course he should play. I just don’t buy that the Packers screwed Favre over in any way. Favre wasn’t the best QB on his team anymore and while going through the thrid straight offseason of should I or shouldn’t I retire, GB choose to move on and I thought it was a fair decision.
by kaisertown on Jun 24, 2009 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Then why didn't they release him and let him go to the Vikes where he wanted to play?
If he wasn’t that good anymore, they should have had no fear of playing against him.
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 24, 2009 6:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well they did eventually trade him, so it wasn’t like they were completely unwilling to let him continue his career elsewhere. GB had him under contract and had every right to try and keep him out of the division.
by kaisertown on Jun 24, 2009 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am not arguing that the Packers had the right to do what they did
I am saying that everyone knew that Farve wanted to play for the Vikes. If they really though Aaron F&%$*#@ Rogers was a better QB than Farve then they shouldn’t have been afraid of letting him go to the Vikes. The Pats owned Bledsoe after he left….why couldn’t the Packers do the same with Farve? Farve was the face of that team and carried it for years. He won SBs and is a first ballot HOFer. After being in the NFC championship game that same year, the Packers basically told him, we think you should go away now…. to please retire quietly . Why? Not because his skills had diminished. Farve threw that bad pick at the end of the game and it pissed the Packers off. They figured Rogers could give them the production without the dumb INTs. They were afraid if Rogers bombed and the Vikes went to the SB, they would look like a bunch of horses’ asses. They underestimated what Farve brought to that team.
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 25, 2009 12:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How does going with Rodgers mean the Packers should help out a divisional opponent? Why would they want to release him so he can go play in Minny when they could just face scrubs like Tarvaris Jackson and Gus Frerotte and whoever else the Vikings had last year?
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 25, 2009 1:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because if they really thought Rogers was better, then Farve would be in nearly the same category
as Jackson. After all Farve did for the Packers, IMO, the honorable thing to do would have been to release him and let him go wherever he wanted. The smart thing to do would have been to make Rogers beat out Farve and actually “win” the job. If he couldn’t do it then, either Farve was still the better QB or the coaching staff were a bunch of cowards and didn’t want to deal with the issue. The “easy” solution was to tell Brett it was time to retire.
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 25, 2009 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Aaron Rodgers had a fantastic season last year. How does Favre being worse than Rodgers put him on the same level as Tavaris Jackson?
And considering how well Rodgers played last year, can we really say that GB didn’t do what was best for him? How could a competition have benefited the team? If Rodgers won, then you’ve got an angry (and at this point untradable) Favre and a large portion of the fanbase whose mad at the team for benching the legend. At least when GB decided to move on it was during the offseason and it gave fans time to come around on the move. Look at how defensive some of the Bills fans are about their offseason moves. Fans get behind their teams during the offseason much more than they do when they can turn on the TV and watch the guys play.
by kaisertown on Jun 25, 2009 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Totally agree kaiser
There’s absolutely no way the Packers could have had a QB competition last year, and no way Favre would have unretired to be apart of one.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 25, 2009 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And there’s also the Lawyer Milloy factor. Favre knows the way that GB does things. He knew strengths and weaknesses and tendencies. You don’t just let a guy like Favre walk right over to a divisional opponent when you have other options.
by kaisertown on Jun 25, 2009 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It happens every year
granted not with a HOF QB, but come on…signals are changed etc. Do you really think the coaches can’t see what they did last season by studying game tape?
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 25, 2009 7:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, it’s not just signals. It’s weaknesses and tendencies too. Favre probably knows the best ways to beat Charles Woodson, Al Harris and Nick Collins. And Favre could probably give some good advice on when CBs should try and jump routes and suddel things like that.
by kaisertown on Jun 25, 2009 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm bored.
suddel = subtle
Yeah, it’s a weird spelling. The old “silent b.”
It's just a game.
by jj24 on Jun 26, 2009 7:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fantastic????
That might be an overstatement. Why did the Packers go from 13-3 to missing the playoffs. I am not saying it was all on Rogers, but I do think they missed Farve as a leader.
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 25, 2009 7:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The defense. They had a Bills-esque 27 sacks and gave up 24 points per game. They had a pretty tough schedule too.
by kaisertown on Jun 25, 2009 7:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Did they lose some key players on Defense from the previous 13-3 season?
A team in the NFC Championship game the season before should be able to handle a tough schedule, don’t you think?
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 25, 2009 10:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They lost 16 sacks between KGB (who fell apart and was cut) and Corey Jenkins. The DL was a mess. Former first round pick Justin Harrell was hurt all year. The player with the second most sacks on the team was Charles Woodson with 3. Green Bay also had the 7th worst run defense in both yards per game and yards per carry. They didn’t switch over to the 3-4 for no reason.
by kaisertown on Jun 25, 2009 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And now their DC is our DL coach...
Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.
by MattRichWarren on Jun 26, 2009 9:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fantastic is right
4000+ yards, 28 TD’s, only 13 INT’s, another 4 rushing TD’s, 64% completions, 94 QB rating. That is pretty fantastic if you ask me, especially for someone getting their first real game action.
Why does it always have to be the QB’s fault about a team missing the playoffs?
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 25, 2009 8:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I believe I said it was not all his fault
And, yes his stats were very good. But, all that matters is the W, right? I believe I said they missed Farve as a team leader.
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 25, 2009 10:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well you brought up Rodgers as the only potential evidence, so I was going with that!
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 25, 2009 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is all a side note to the main point
The “hating” on Farve for wanting to unretire again and play is crap. The man has the right to play if there is a team that wants him.
How can you excuse T.O.’s past behavior and condemn Farve?
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 25, 2009 11:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’m not condemning Favre for wanting to play, but rather causing all this melodrama with his “will he or won’t he” retire crap every offseason. He finally retired, but probably knew he’d want to come back, therefore causing a ridiculous situation. I just think he has become one of the biggest spotlight hounds in the league. He portrays the “aww shucks, I’m just a simple caveman” image, but sure can’t seem to stay out of the spotlight….
When have I excused TO’s behavior? He has been a real prick of a teammate for the majority of his career. I wouldn’t argue that.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 26, 2009 12:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am not sure why you can't just take him at his word
When he was with the Packers, he waited a bit longer than was ideal to decide if he was coming back. Who made that a big deal, Farve or ESPN? Either way, he was honest about the reasons he was taking so long. It wasn’t about money or some other crap. He wanted to be sure he was physically and mentally able to give what it takes to play. I accept that and find no reason to assume otherwise. When he retired from the Packers, I think he made that decision to soon for whatever reason. I don’t think he faked the emotion we saw at the press conference. I believe he intended to be the good soldier the Packers wanted him to be, but he couldn’t do it, IMO, partly because he still had the desire to play and partly because the more he thought about how the Packers treated him the more it pissed him off. He thought he could force the Packers to release him so he could play for the Vikes, but that backfired and he ended up going to the Jets and a HC who really didn’t want him. He retired again because he was hurt and didn’t want to have surgery, didn’t want to go through the rebuilding process associated with a new HC and learn another new system, and he didn’t think the Jets would release him so he could play for the Vikes. Can you really blame him? Things are falling into place where everything that had to happen actually has happened, so he is thinking about coming back again to play only for the Vikes if his arm heals. Now, isn’t my explanation of why things happened sound more reasonable than Farve is a media whore?
I seem to remember you saying in your interview that you had come around on the T.O. signing. I still think it is 50/50 that this blows up in the Bills face. Either way, I don’t see how you can “hate” Farve and be OK with T.O.
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 26, 2009 2:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
A caoch that didn't want him...
but named his kid after the guy…. Anyone wanna help me out on this one?
Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.
by MattRichWarren on Jun 26, 2009 9:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, Mangini also named (middle name) a kid after Bill Belichick
and we know how much they like each other.
quote from Teddy Atlas, friend of Mangini
Atlas also had this to say about whether Mangini even wanted Favre in the first place.
"He had no choice in the matter," Atlas told the Post. "How you going to argue with a Hall of Fame guy coming in and the business part of it? [Mangini] did the best he could to adjust to it."
Apparently, Mangini still feels compelled to convince people that Mangini felt otherwise.
http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/03/25/mangini-invites-favre-to-help-out-at-camp/
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 26, 2009 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If Rogers won an open competition
they fans would have seen that too. Fans will get behind whoever gives the team the best chance to win. Can’t you remember fans wanting to run Kelly out of town at the end of his career?
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 25, 2009 7:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I remember some of the fans thinking that way. And that happened over a long period of time not a training camp that very few of the fans would watch and 4 preseason games. QB competitions split the fanbase and it’s never a good thing. QB competitions are for teams with no QBs, not for teams with two QBs.
by kaisertown on Jun 25, 2009 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But Rogers was not a proven starter at that time
To do that this season would split the fan base. If Rogers could have won the job in the preseason or taken the job if Farve started to stink it up, the fans would have come around very quickly to Rogers.
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 25, 2009 9:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
For coaches, yeah. But how were Green Bay fans with Brett Favre jerseys supposed to think that Rodgers was the better QB after 4 preseason games?
And why would Favre suddenly stink it up? This isn’t about one guy being clearly better than the other. The problem is that both QBs are still very good. GB just thought that Rodgers was a little better and when you add in that he was much younger and cheaper, they just couldn’t stick with Favre and his retirement wavering anymore.
by kaisertown on Jun 25, 2009 11:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry Joe, you aren’t making sense to me.
Because if they really thought Rogers was better, then Farve would be in nearly the same category as Jackson
How so? Tarvaris Jackson is one of the worst QB’s in the league. Favre wasn’t at that level just because the Packers might have thought Rodgers is better than him.
After all Favre did for the Packers? Well, at some point, doesn’t it go beyond it being about one guy? Favre retired, the Packers moved on. Then he wanted to come back and wanted a starting role. Fine. But why would the Packers potentially help out a divisional rival just to do the honorable thing? And why is that so honorable?
The Packers had spent their entire offseason working with Rodgers and preparing him for the starting role, and probably tailoring the playbook to his skills. As evident by his play last year, I think they were quite confident going into the season with him. You seem to think Rodgers stinks, why?
The "easy" solution was to tell Brett it was time to retire.
Or to quit making it always about him and stay retired like he had planned.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 25, 2009 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your argument is based on the fact that Farve retired because he wanted to
He didn’t. He wanted to play another season but was strongly encouraged by the Packers to retire.
Again, if the Packers opinion of Farve was so bad, they should not be worried about playing him. They know his weakness too.
Most people were expecting T-Jax to have a better year, not a worse one. Potentially, Farve could have been a worse choice for the Vikes and hurt them at the end of the season as he did the Jets. It is easy to look back and see how bad Jackson was.
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 25, 2009 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Says who? The Packers forced him to retire? I don’t believe it. He could have just told them to shove it then and asked for his release/trade instead of filing all the paperwork and going through the retirement crap.
Nobody is saying the Packers opinion of Favre was so bad, so I’m not sure where that’s coming from. Just because they may or may not have been ready to turn it over to Rodgers doesn’t mean they thought Favre stunk.
I really don’t remember hearing anybody thinking Tarvaris Jackson was going to be a good QB for them last year. Even the Vikes didn’t have confidence in him, throwing him on the bench after just two games.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 25, 2009 8:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Says his Mom
Favre’s mother, interviewed by WITI-TV in Milwaukee on Wednesday, said her son felt a vibe coming from GM Thompson that indicated the Packers were eager to move on without the future Hall of Famer.
“He’s felt like that for the last couple of years, that the Packers didn’t really want him back,” Bonita Favre told WITI. “But nothing’s been said. You know it’s just been bits and pieces throughout the last couple of years, things that would come up, and it just didn’t seem like they went out of their way to keep him. It was kind of like, ’You’re done.’”
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3471189
As far as Jackson goes, maybe breakout was a strong word, but he wasn’t expected to suck as bad as he did.
Mitchell (Fargo, ND)
How much progress are you expecting from tavaris jackson this year and how far do you feel he can lead the vikings?
Kevin Seifert
Glad you asked, Mitchell. Most people will tell you that a quarterback’s biggest jump comes between his first and second year as a starter. If that’s true, Jackson should make a pretty big leap this year. From what I saw in spring OTAs, Jackson is a lot further along than he was last year. I know that’s not saying much given how shaky he was early in 2007, but I think he has a chance to be competent this season, which is all the Vikings need. With their running game and defense, I think they can win a game or two in the playoffs with Jackson as their starter.
http://espn.go.com/sportsnation/chat/_/id/21369
Jackson Is the Man and Other Musings
http://www.dailynorseman.com/2007/12/31/221113/32
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 25, 2009 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He felt a vibe? haha. I wouldn’t say that’s the Pack pushing him out the door and throwing his belongings at him. He’s an aging vet that had a young QB backing him up. Of course he was always going to look over his shoulder.
I think people WANTED and hoped to call Jackson a good QB before he could become one. Vikes fans needed it because of the rest of the talent on the team.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 26, 2009 12:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes and No
You’re seemingly confusing last summer’s "hit and run" with his arrest this offseason, which was the loaded gun in the trunk charge. Why should the 3-game suspension depend on what could have happened last summer and what did happen with Stallworth?
I am not confusing them, but I am lumping them together because it seems like Goodell looks at prior incidences when making his decisions. I can’t help but wonder if the Stallworth situation reminded Goodell of Lynch’s incident. It is possible he will take that into account when deciding whether or not to reduce the suspension for the gun charge.
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 22, 2009 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I love Brett Favre.
Founding member of the Dick Jauron Fan Club.
by taskersd on Jun 22, 2009 10:41 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Where are the outside pitches to him, the screens, the stretch handoffs???
I totally agree, except for the screens. Schonert ran some last year and Marshawn had some really bad drops. I hope we give Jackson some chances on screens this year, but Marshawn is one more dropped screen pass away from me never wanting to run him on a screen again. Lynch dropped a ridiculous 8 passes last year and I’d bet that 3 or 4 came on screens. I have no clue why we don’t run outside more though. The lack of playaction is also confusing.
J.P. Losman stinks, but it’s still somewhat hard to believe he received no interest on the open market.
I was convinced that a vertical offense would give him a decent contract to be the backup based on his success in 2006. I still think a solid UFL season will land him a role somewhere next year.
Donte Whitner can’t cover anyone.
I actually think Whitner is pretty good in zone coverage. Since the Bills run a cover 2, I’m assuming that Whitner spends a decent amount of time in deep zones, and I don’t remember him getting beat over the top at all. And after I went through the Bills play by plays to see where Whitner made his tackles, I noticed that he made a lot of tackles near the line of scrimmage on passes to RBs. I do think he is pretty terrible in man coverage though. When he is lined up over a TE, he gets beat consistently.
Wow, Leodis McKelvin sure looked terrible that day
I didn’t think McKelvin looked particularly good at any point last season (other than kick returns). I thought he got beat up pretty bad against Miami and was just OK in some of the other games.
by kaisertown on Jun 22, 2009 1:14 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I remember big plays in KC and St Louis.
I just can’t remember if he was consistent in either game.
Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.
by MattRichWarren on Jun 22, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Schonert ran some last year and Marshawn had some really bad drops.
That is true, but there’s no reason Freddie couldn’t have gotten more. Plus, even with a few drops, you can’t just throw it out of the playbook for Lynch. Remember, he had a couple of big screen passes at the end of the 2007 season.
I actually think Whitner is pretty good in zone coverage.
That he probably is, but the team had him covering some of the Jets’ receivers man to man that day. It’s tough to see on TV whether he’s holding his own in zone coverage, but much easier to see him beat in man, which happens nearly every time he lines up in it. I don’t remember the team getting beat too often deep with whoever is in at safety. Might be the scheme more than the players there. One thing though, in the middle of the field, Whitner always looks a step slow to the receiver in the deep zones. It wasn’t only him though either, Scott, Ko, whoever all have struggled there. If we’re going to run so much zone back there, it’d be nice if our safeties weren’t always a day late and a dollar short. They’ve gotta be able to get to the receiver and break up passes or, gasp!, sneak an INT or two in.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 22, 2009 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
With the very nature of the safety position, doesn’t it make sense that he is good at zone but not at man to man? The whole point of the free safety is to cover the deep zone in the event the CB’s lose their man.
by syrbillsfan on Jun 24, 2009 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We’ve heard the garbage before about Whitner being able to cover receivers in the slot and play CB if necessary. Well, I don’t agree with that because he flat out can’t cover anyone. It wasn’t just this one Jets game either. I really can’t remember a time when he actually did have good coverage and broke up a pass while playing man.
I kind of question why the coaches have him covering receivers in man like that instead of putting a CB on them….
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 25, 2009 1:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn’t think McKelvin looked particularly good at any point last season (other than kick returns). I thought he got beat up pretty bad against Miami and was just OK in some of the other games.
Yah, agree there. I had forgotten how lost and how poor he was in coverage many times last season. His kick return ability may have clouded my memory of his defensive growing pains. Other than the KC game, he was pretty late to the ball more often than not. Many fans seem to think he’s a playmaker at CB, but he isn’t, at least not yet. His college career saw few INT’s and he wasn’t exactly all over them last year either. Luckily, he’s as athletic as they get, and does seem to have a good feel for the position, so his improvement should become visible this year. Leo really needs to show that improvement this year or he’s going to get picked on a lot since McGee does a solid job on the other side.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 22, 2009 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think Leodis is kind of a dummy – from the interviews i’ve read and heard – I don’t know – maybe its his accent – but not so sure on his intelligence level.
He could get away with it in college but in the NFL smarts goes a long way – hopefully i’m wrong.
on Kaiser’s point on Marshawn – he frustrated the crap out of me with those screen pass drops last year – I remember them clear as day – we had some huge gainers and possibly a win or two if he catches a couple of those. I remember daylight in front of him on a few of those – just didn’t catch the pass
Everyone has a photographic memory… some just don’t have film
by J2 on Jun 22, 2009 1:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So did Darrele Revis as a rookie for the Jets, especially early on. I think because of injuries, the Bills were forced to expose LEodis to more than they wanted to. That should have a side effect of better play from him this year. I wouldn’t look at his performance last year as too much of an indicator of what’s to come. It’s probably similar to the wide receiver adjustment period. Also, he’s no. 2 in the pecking order at the moment, and will get plenty of starter reps in training camp. Let’s wait and see how he pans out. If we get some front 4 pressure, I think we’ll all be pleasantly surprised.
by syrbillsfan on Jun 24, 2009 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think Leodis is going to be good and very possibly great. I just think that people remember those two INTs against KC and assume that he is going to be making play after play this season. I think McKelvin will be very up and down this year. Not bad, just inconsistent.
by kaisertown on Jun 25, 2009 6:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Very inconsistent is right
Those 2 INT’s are leading people to believe he’s a big time playmaker too. He didn’t have another INT all year and only had a handful in college. Expectations of that need to be tempered a bit, IMO….
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Jun 25, 2009 8:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
j2 – the NFL isn’t about book smarts, unless you’re a QB or a center, where you have to transguise a lot of information. What made Deion Sanders the best CB of all time? His ridicolous athleticism, instincs and toughness, and those three components are possessed by Leodis.
He is going to be a fantastic CB for many years to come, mark my words.
by BillsfanfromDenmark on Jun 22, 2009 4:55 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
the NFL isn’t about book smarts
i’ll take any smarts
Everyone has a photographic memory… some just don’t have film
by J2 on Jun 22, 2009 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’ll take ability over smarts any day
by BillsfanfromDenmark on Jun 24, 2009 10:48 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
ask Jim Leonard – or any aging player that lost a step
I am so clever that sometimes I don’t understand a single word of what I am saying
by J2 on Jun 24, 2009 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Me too, because
“You can’t fix Stupid”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0gxKStPXyn8
The Prayer of Pass Rush - Hail Maybin, blessed with a quick first step, Bruce is with thee; most reverenced art thou among DEs in the AFC, and blessed be the fruit of thy pass rush. Holy Lord, Father of the swim move, we pray for our QB hurries to be numerous and our sacks to be plentiful. Be with us in Victory and at the hour of our Defeat. Amen.
by Joe P. on Jun 24, 2009 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

by 






















