A few things Bills fans might be surprised to learn

by kaisertown on Sep 3, 2009 5:51 PM EDT Comment 15 comments

In a kaisertown first, I might actually be posting a short fanpost .... and I just refered to myself in the third person. I've had a couple posts in which I essentially argue against myself on whether or not Copeland Bryan is any good. I still don't have an answer, but the fact that Bryan is already 26 years old and is now in his 4th NFL season (if you count PS time) had me looking at the ages of other Bills. I feel like I was a fairly pessimistic poster during the offseason, but now that the tone of the blog is starting to head south, the optimist in me feels obligated to balance things out with an upper of a post. Looking for players who could surprise this year, I think ideal candidates are players with very little experience in the league, but are older in life experince. Younger veterans are also primed for a breakout. Here are some breakout candidates based on age:

The most obvious one has to be Donte Whitner. Whitner just turned 24 in July. He does deserve some of the criticism that has been thrown his way, but for anybody who has given up on Donte, consider this: Whitner is 5 weeks older than Leodis McKelvin who just had his 24th birthday a couple of days ago on Sep. 1st (since some Buffalo Bills apparently read the blog, happy B-Day Leo). Shawn Nelson is barely two months younger than Whitner is. The potential is there for a breakout season.

Another player who I've often been critical of is Reggie Corner and part of the reason I have never liked the draft pick is because of how old he is. 24 year old players don't pose much upside in the draft, but they do tend to come as fairly polished athletes. Corner, who turns 26 this season, could be ahead of the curve compared to other 2nd year players. I've never been a believer in him, but I understand why so many of you are. Corner is only a couple weeks younger than Ko Simpson and just a couple months younger than Brad Butler.

And my final candidate to surprise is one who might be a shocker. I've never been a fan of his, but I don't think anybody is going to see these age differences coming. Derek Schouman. There, I said it. I'll get straight to the point, Schouman is almost a year younger than Demetrius Bell. He's six months younger than preseason legend Jonathon Stupar and almost 20 months younger than Derek Fine. Shawn Nelson, in all of his infinite potential is only 7 months younger than the 3rd year player from Boise St. Schouman turns 25 in March. Also, the younger and more experienced of the Dereks is from Eagle, Idaho. That has to count for something. USA!, USA!, USA!

This FanPost was written by a registered user of Buffalo Rumblings. Its views do not necessarily reflect the views of Rumblings' editorial staff, but are just as valued as our own.

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USA!, USA!, USA!

Nice.

I like the content. Rec’d.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.

by MattRichWarren on Sep 3, 2009 6:04 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I’d like to believe Whitner will have a breakout season, but there just haven’t been any signs that that will occur. He is what he is, a very mediocre player. I’ll be pretty shocked if he puts up a monster season statistically. I just don’t see it…..

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Sep 3, 2009 9:12 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Maybe breakout wasn’t the right word. And I’m skeptical of Whitner too, but I think the potential is there for a nice spike in his numbers. I think he could be a little better against the pass, make a few less mistakes in the run game and could finally provide a couple big plays. It’s about time that an INT fell into his lap. I just get the feeling that he will make a huge play at some point this year. I wouldn’t expect more than a couple INTs and a couple forced or recovered fumbles, but I think this could be the year he puts things together. Just five weeks older than McKelvin. There wasn’t a single safety in the league last year who recorded multiple INTs and is younger than Whitner. Even a couple turnovers and all-around solid play would be a nice uptick in his stats.

by kaisertown on Sep 4, 2009 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Maturity is a funny thing

Great points.

I think, as fans, we want instant success for players that we draft. It’s just not that way. I won’t even try to delve into the invariables that feed into maturity. But the fact that Whitner and Schouman entered the league so young enhances their chances.

In reposnse to K, again, how can you really grade a defensive back on this team when they get no rush from the front seven? How many interceptions did Brian Dawkins make because he was great, versus the number he made because the QB made a bad throw because he was facing the rush?

by Der Jaeger on Sep 3, 2009 9:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I don’t think Whitner would have much more success with a better pass rush. I’ve seen him unable to cover TE’s, slow to diagnose and read plays and generally he’s no where near the ball on passes. He’s solid enough against the run, but I just don’t think he has the playmaker gene in his body.

Blaming the pass rush would make more sense to me if there weren’t other safeties out there in similar D’s (Tampa, Chicago, etc) that made plays despite having mediocre pass rushes. If Whitner was going to develop into a playmaker, he’d have made some plays by now. I just don’t see the signs pointing towards being a playmaker for him, pass rush or not.

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Sep 3, 2009 9:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

To Whitner's credit....

generally he’s no where near the ball on passes.

When I was watching him in camp he was playing centerfield 25 yards off the ball at times. You know Trent never throws that far! LOL I kid, I kid.

Playing Realistic Optimist at Buffalo Rumblings since 2008. Fear can hold you prisoner. Hope can set you free.

by MattRichWarren on Sep 4, 2009 8:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Interesting...

I’d be interested to know this:

Like most fans, have you seen Whitner out of place a few times, unable to cover TE’s a few times, and slow to diagnose a few times…. and equate that to overall incompetance?

Did you really break down the game film and determine that he can’t do all of this most of the time?

It’s kind of similar to how I’ve interpreted your take on Chris Kelsay. We both don’t like Kelsay as a starter; I think he’d be a great rotational DE playing 10-15 snaps a game. WhyBillsWhy’s breakdown of Kelsay’s play versus the Steeler’s supports this (again, that watching whole game films comes up). You’d pay for Kelsay’s ticket out of town.

It comes down to what you can support by fact. My fact: the sack total for the team last year indicates that the DB’s had to cover for more time than other team’s DB’s.

Unless you watch the game film and break it down like WhyBillsWhy, I don’t think you can make those statements about Whitner.

by Der Jaeger on Sep 4, 2009 9:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

OK…

I never said he couldn’t do any of those things at all. Isn’t it obvious that I’m not talking about every play? If he couldn’t cover a TE on every play or diagnose any plays, I don’t think he’d be on the field. The fact that he has struggled covering TE’s in the past and has been slow to react has been apparent multiple times.

I’m talking about the signs that he will become a playmaker, which I just don’t see. I’m sorry I don’t back that up with game film and statistics from every game he’s played for us, but that’s my opinion developed from watching the games every week.

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Sep 4, 2009 10:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I can accept that.

You don’t think he can be a playmaker.

I think you can’t judge any of our DB’s because our pass rush stinks.

Agreed.

by Der Jaeger on Sep 4, 2009 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I apologize

I didn’t intend it at all, but my reply sounded very rude. My b.

I see in guys like Leo and Corner even that they could debelop into consistent playmakers. I just don’t see it with Whitner…

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Sep 4, 2009 6:52 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs

No worries. I've got thick skin.

I didn’t think it was rude at all. I was thinking that we were at the point that each of us had opinions, and they differed. I’m OK with that.

And I’m sure the more I post, the more times I’ll be wrong about things. : )

by Der Jaeger on Sep 4, 2009 11:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Very unkaiserlike post but i like it

more of these short and to the points to come i hope Kaiser?

First, yes. I agree on Whitner. I know I’m in the minority but I’ve always believed its just a matter of time before Donte goes from solid safety to playmaking safety and a big part of that is because of how young he is. I know people want to put him down but its important to remember how young he is. I think its great to have a solid player with experience and potential like him on the roster.

Reggie has come up big but I’m still waiting on Youboty to come through, I’m not yet ready to invest in another corner.

Schouman? Come on kaiser, age can’t be the only factor here! We have seen very little promise here.

That has to count for something. USA!, USA!, USA!

USA! USA! USA! always counts for something! I love it! USA ! USA ! USA !

Jonathan Stupar played Russian Roulette with a fully loaded gun and won.

by poz on Sep 4, 2009 1:38 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

but I’ve always believed its just a matter of time before Donte goes from solid safety to playmaking safety and a big part of that is because of how young he is

What makes you believe he can become a playmaker? Because he’s young? What has he done on the field to make you a believer???

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Sep 4, 2009 1:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

i was waiting for this...haha

I believe we had an almost exact exchange a few months back. Donte is always around the ball carrier and I know thats not saying much for a safety on what has been an average defense but yes he is young, and should learn how plays develop with more time and be able to make more plays on the ball.

Jonathan Stupar played Russian Roulette with a fully loaded gun and won.

by poz on Sep 4, 2009 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

It’s not my typical posting style, but I was really, really surprised to see some of the age differences.

Eagle, Idaho has to be one of the most patriotic towns in America.

I don’t know if Whitner will ever be a big time playmaker, but I believe this is the year that things start happening for him.

I don’t think Schouman will break out in a big way. But I’d bet he holds onto the starting role and is a solid dump down option for our QB who loves to check it down. If Reed is going to be on the field less, then I could see Schouman catching 40-45 passes (only 19 TEs caught 40 last year). I think he’d be little more than a reliable check down guy. The concept here is that maybe something like youth has been holding a guy like Schouman back. He started his Boise St. Career as a LB. He had one of the couple best (maybe the best) combine of any of the TEs when he was drafted (and did it at 240+ pounds) and has been through a couple offensive systems. He was drafted as an H-Back, then played at like 225 pounds last year. He was only 23 years old last year and maybe we havn’t seen what he is capable of yet.

At the same time, you could make the age argument for Derek Fine. He’s a full year older than every TE on the roster and almost two years older than Shouman. He’s the biggest, strongest TE on the roster. Maybe his physical abilities lead to him growing into a full-time role at TE and being a big time blocker and part of the solution in the red zone.

by kaisertown on Sep 4, 2009 8:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs