Buffalo's Possible Draft Day Trading Partners
It's a long time between now and the 2010 NFL Draft. During that time, any number of stories and FanPosts will appear on this blog in which the authors propose one trade or another. It seemed to be a good idea to take a look at the current draft day trade possibilities, and then make judgments as to which are realistic and which are not. Compensatory picks can't be traded, but do have an impact on the pick values. Because the compensatory picks begin at the end of the third round, the effect should be minimal. Also, this looks at the draft day trade options within the first four rounds primarily because the late round picks don't have much trade value; the first 13 picks in the fifth round combine to equal the value of the last pick in the first round.
The hope is that this article - and, more importantly, accompanying comments - will give us common ground when discussing draft day trade scenarios. This might keep us from engaging in repetitive discussions about what is or isn't possible. Buffalo has picks 9, 41, 73 and 109 in the first four rounds.
Totally Screwed On Draft Day: probably paralyzed on draft day
Jets: The Jets traded away their third and fourth round picks, leaving them with only 29 and 61 through the first four rounds. They are a candidate to drop back from the first or second round in order to add a pick or two, but given that they believe they are a piece or two away from winning it all, they will likely stay put.
Bears: Chicago traded away their first and second round picks. Yikes. With only 75 and 110 to work with, Chicago can only move around the board if they decide to give Dan Snyder a run for his money by mortgaging yet another (2011) draft.
Weakened Position On Draft Day: more likely to trade down than up
Jaguars: The Jags traded away their second round pick, which should put a stake in the heart of any Jack Del Rio impulse to move up unless he adds players to the mix. They have 11, 76 and 111.
Titans: The Titans, like the Jags, traded away their second round pick. They have 17, 79, 100c, 114.
Falcons: The Falcons traded their second rounder to KC. They have 19, 84, 119, 133c.
Redskins: What's that you say? The Redskins aren't totally screwed? Yep, they only blew their third rounder on a supplemental pick, leaving them with 4, 37 and 105. The 4 is probably already earmarked for Sam Bradford.
Panthers: The Panthers traded away their first round pick, leaving them with 47, 78, and 113.
The Standard Package: capable of moving up or down
Rams: The Rams have the top overall pick and, for now, seem a lock to take Ndamukong Suh. They have picks 1, 33, 65, and 101.
Broncos: Even after the Jay Cutler trade, the Broncos have only the 10, 45, 81 and 116 picks.
Dolphins: The Dolphins have 12, 43, 74, 112. Miami has Tyler Thigpen to dangle in front of Buffalo to grease the wheels of any deal.
Giants: The Giants have 15, 46, 77, 117.
Texans: The Texans have 20, 51, 82, 120.
Bengals: Cincy has 21, 53, 85, 121. The Bengals may be interested in moving up for the right offensive weapon, though 9 seems a bit high.
Packers: The Packers have 23, 55, 87, 123. They may be interested in moving up if the right defender is available at 9.
Cardinals: The Cards have 26, 58, 90 and 126. Arizona could be looking to move up to take a QB if they want an upgrade over Matt Leinart.
Chargers: San Diego has 28, 60, 92 and 128.
Vikings: Minny has 30, 62, 94, 130 and not a whole lot in terms of needs if Brett Favre returns.
Colts: Indy has 31, 63, 95, 131 and a GM who is way too smart to overpay to move up the board.
Saints: The Super Bowl champs have 32, 64, 96, 132.
Sitting Pretty: most likely to move up the board in the early rounds due to extra draft picks
Buccaneers: The Bucs figure to get one of the best players in the draft at 3, and also have 35, 44, 67 and 103. They could easily get back into the first round.
Chiefs: You get the feeling that KC hired a pretty good GM. They have 5, 36, 50, 69, 104.
Browns: Everyone knocked the sweetheart deal Cleveland gave the Jets last year, but now they have 7, 38, 72, 93, 107. They could get a king's ransom for 7 and/or get back into the first round.
Raiders: No one ever knows what Al Davis is going to do. He has 8, 39, 70, 86, 108 to squander as he sees fit.
49ers: Mike Singletary has 13, 16, 49, 80, 115. He could easily get to the top 3 if he so wished.
Steelers: The Steelers have 18, 52, 83, 118, 136c.
Patriots: What are the odds? New England has 22, 42, 48, 54 and 122. His history is one of trading out of the first round and stockpiling picks.
Eagles: After being fleeced by the Bills in the Jason Peters trade, the Eagles still have 24, 56, 71, 88, 98c, 134 and 129. Andy Reid has been more than willing to move up the board (remember he wanted to move up to take Brodrick Bunkley when Buffalo chose Donte Whitner) and make deals with Buffalo. With offensive line questions, Reid may be looking to move up.
Ravens: Baltimore has 25, 57, 89, 97c, 125, 134c. Yeah, two of them are compensatory picks that can't be traded but that's still 6 picks in 4 rounds.
Cowboys: Jerry Jones, likewise, has two compensatory picks. He has 27, 59, 91, 99c, 127, 135c to wheel and deal with.
Seahawks: The Seahawks don't have a thrid rounder but they have a pair of picks in the top 14. They have 6, 14, 40, 106. They could make a play for No. 1 overall.
Deeper Look
The Jets and Bears are off the board. They don't have the juice to move up and have needs they can't address if they move down. Please remove them from draft day trade discussions. The Skins are also verboten with 4 being spoken for (Bradford) and no third rounder. The Titans have a pair of third rounders thanks to a comp pick, but no second rounder. They don't have players the Bills would want in trade, so they're probably off the board as well. Ditto for the Falcons, who have no second rounder as well. Carolina would likely love to trade up, but have little with which to do it. The Jags are a possible trading partner with the Bills, mainly because they have a player Buffalo might want (David Garrard) in trade if they want to move from 11 to 9. More likely, the Jags would trade down from 11 to add a second and third rounder, which Buffalo is unlikely to do.
Rams: I don't see any trade with the Rams happening. For example, trading from 41 to 33 would involve giving up 73. With so many holes I can't see the Bills moving up to 33. As for 1, well, forget it.
Lions: See the Rams.
Seattle: The new regime has an excellent opportunity to revamp their roster by standing pat. If the Seahawks want to move up from 14 to 9 it would cost them a third rounder that they don't have. They could ship 40 to the Bills and demand 73 in exchange. That would give Seattle 6, 9, 73 and 106 while Buffalo would have 14, 40, 41 and 109. I'd do it if I were Buffalo but I don't see Seattle passing on a 2nd rounder just to move up to 9.
Denver: There really wouldn't be much point in Denver hopping up to 9 from 10 unless they were convinced that Buffalo was going to take their guy or trade 9 to a team that would take their guy. Buffalo would require Denver to overpay by handing over 81. That's a steep price to pay for 1 draft slot so I don't see it hapening.
Miami: The Dolphins might want to move up but Parcells is too sharp to bleed picks to make the leap. I can see them dealing Thigpen to Buffalo, even though it would probably help the Bills. Miami has won with Pennington before and, shoulder surgery or not, Henne would be the starter. It's pick neutral, other than the drop from 9 to 12.
Giants: It would be a grand swap of picks to let the Giants move up the board from 15 to 9. The Giants would give Buffalo 15, 46 and 117 in exchange for 9 and 73. The Giants end up with 9, 73, and 77 in the first four rounds. Buffalo get 15, 41, 46, 109 and 117. This is very similar to the Seattle deal in terms of picks.
Houston: Houston isn't all that far away from having a playoff caliber team so I don't see them giving up a great deal to move up the board. To move from 20 to 9 they'd have to throw in their 2nd and 4th rounders which would cripple their draft.
Cincy, Packers, Cardinals, Chargers, Vikings, Colts, Saints: See Houston, only they'd have to pay even more. It's not happening absent a team sending a player or two Buffalo's way.
Bucs: The Bucs are like the Bills--holes everywhere. They need both quantity and quality. Should the Bucs really have a guy they badly want at 9, they could ship Buffalo 35, 44 and 67. That would leave Tampa with 3, 9 and 103 while Buffalo would have 35, 41, 44, 67, 73 and 109. Given Tampa's need for quantity I don't see it happening but I'd love to see Buffalo with three second round picks.
Chiefs: The Chiefs are in the same position as the Bucs so I don't see KC trading all the way up to 9. I could see KC calling Buffalo and offering 50 and 104 for 41.
Cleveland: Buffalo has a trade up option with the Browns. The Bills would ship 9 and 41 to Cleveland for 7, 72 and 93. That would allow Buffalo to pick up a highly sought player and have a trio of third rounders...but no second rounder. I can't see that happening.
Raiders: Buffalo could move up with the Raiders but why bother when Al Davis can be expected to do something stupid anyway. The Raiders don't have the juice to move up to the first round but could send 70, 86 and 108 to Buffalo for #41. With Al Davis you can't rule that kind of insanity out.
49ers: San Fran has a pair of first rounders so they have all kinds of options. They could easily ship 16 and 49 to Buffalo for 9 and 109. Buffalo would walk away with 16, 41, 49, and 73. San Fran could also send Buffalo 13 and 80 for 9, giving the Bills 13, 41, 73, 80 and 109. Of course, if San Fran wants to move up they could easily swap 13 and 16 for for 3.
Pittsburgh: The Steelers really only have an extra compensatory pick (no trade allowed) so they're not getting up to 9 without crippling their draft. The Steelers could, however, trade 52 and 83 for 41.
Patriots: Belicheat will deal with anyone. Buffalo could send 41 and 73 to New England for 22. It would get Buffalo a pair of first rounders (again) but pretty well destroy any chance of addressing several critical needs.
Eagles: The Eagles are an intriguing trade option. They have the juice to jump from 24 to 9 or use one of their third rounders (the third is a comp pick) to move up the second. The Eagles could trade 24, 56 and 71 for 9. That would give Buffalo 24, 41, 56, 71, 73 and 109. Alternately, The Eagles could ship 56 and 88 to Buffalo for 41. The Bills would net a 3rd rounder in the deal. That doesn't, of course, take into account any player trades (Please no Vick! Please no Vick!) from the Eagles to the Bills.
Ravens: The Ravens don't have as much juice as the Eagles, mainly due to having only one extra third rounder (what a burden) and because it is a comp pick. I can't see the Ravens moving up to 9 but it's not out of the question for them to trade 57, 89 and 125 for 41. Their comp picks in the third and fourth rounds ease the pain of the move.
Dallas: Jerry Jones loves to deal and he has comp picks in the third and fourth rounds to play with. Again, I don't see Dallas flying up to 9 but he could trade 59, 91 and 127 for 41....just so Jones can be Jones.
Analysis
The Jets, Bears, Skins, Titans, Falcons, and Panthers are non-starters, as are Cincy, Packers, Cardinals, Chargers, Vikings, Colts, Bucs, Browns, Pats, Saints and Texans. The Lions and Rams won't move up and it would cost Buffalo too much to trade up with them. Seattle, the Giants and Denver don't seem like realistic possibilities. The 49ers have better options than Buffalo.
The Jags are only in play if they want to move Gerrard. Miami, like the Jags, only works if they want to trade Thigpen.
The Eagles are a logical trading partner due to both their plethora of picks and history with the Bills. The Chiefs Steelers, Ravens and Cowboys can trade with Buffalo but really only for 41.
You can never rule out anything that Al Davis might do.
So, trading up hurts Buffalo too much to do it. Trading down in the first round requires a partner and only a few teams (Jags, Dolphins, Eagles) are in position to make the deal. There are teams (Chiefs, Ravens, Steelers, Cowboys) who are good candidates to trade down from 41. The bottom line is that Buffalo doesn't appear to have as many potential suitors for the 9 pick than we might have thought, which limits the options considerably.
Hash it out in the comments so we don't spend the next two months constantly arguing over whether (blank) trade is likely to happen.
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good analysis
Bucs are rumored to be interested in trading their #3 pick Josh Johnson and a third round pick for the Ram’s #1 pick. Makes sense and good value for the Rams, who are under a furnace of pressure to take Suh but might want a QB. At #3 that QB is much more palatable.
As for the Bills, I’d like to see them move down if Clausen, Bradford and Okung are off the board and they likely will be. It’s supposed to be a deep draft for Tackle so good value can be gotten much later. I think Jacksonville can’t absolutely be ruled out for trying to make a play for the 41 pick possibly trading away future picks. Jacksonville and Buffalo have dealt alot. Jacksy as we all know need tebow but can’t take him in the first but at the same time are worried he won’t last until the third.
This space held in honor of Robert Royal known to his friends as "Sweet Cream Style Corn" March 11 2006- February 26, 2009
Move down to where? And for what compensation?
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
by Ron From NM on Feb 21, 2010 10:55 AM EST up reply actions
me personally, I’d like to trade with the Bengals. Their #21 and other decent picks for our #9. The best WR might still be on the board at that point so they might be interested.
This space held in honor of Robert Royal known to his friends as "Sweet Cream Style Corn" March 11 2006- February 26, 2009
It would cost Cincy their 2nd and 3rd rounders to move from 21 to 9. I’d love to see Buffalo with 21, 41, 53, 73, 85 and 109 for dropping back 12 slots. I just don’t see Cincy giving up that much. Check their roster and see if they have a player the Bills might covet that perhaps Cincy can survive without. If so, Cincy could make the swap without crippling their entire draft.
And, no, if I was Buffalo I wouldn’t take 21 and 85 this year and a second rounder in 2011. To my way of thinking delayed compensation has to come at a premium.
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
I’m not sure I wouldn’t take the second option if they tacked on a 4th or a 5th round pick with it. For all that’s been said about delayed compensation, that’s what the Patriots have done to great success in recent years. I also don’t think Cincinnati will have as good a year this year as last. You can’t count on Pittsburgh and Baltimore being swept often.
But they have plenty of low-key defensive players who are young and talented I’d be interested in as well.
This space held in honor of Robert Royal known to his friends as "Sweet Cream Style Corn" March 11 2006- February 26, 2009
What's wrong Ron
You don’t like the “Let’s trade Marshawn Lynch, Donte Whitner, and our 3rd rounder for Peyton Manning” posts?
New York City Buffalo Bills Backers
www.nycbbb.com
It’s not that so much as hopefully disuading fanposts based on completely implausible scenarios like Buffalo trading back to pick up a team’s second rounder—when that team has no second rounder. Alternately, it’s best to avoid trade suggestions like Buffalo jumping up to, say, 5 for 9, 109 and a bag of Shriner’s onions.
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
by Ron From NM on Feb 21, 2010 10:57 AM EST up reply actions
Good evaluation Ron
But after spending the last few days over at Bleeding Green nation, I’m almost certain that we can also remove the Eagles from the equasion. The vast majority of their fans believe that the Eagles are happy with the picks that they have and that the only player that they would be willing to move up for is Berry. And since there is no chance that Berry makes it out of the top 5, I’m pretty sure that we can eliminate the Eagles as a trading partner too.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 21, 2010 8:53 AM EST reply actions
McClain wouldn’t look good in their 4-3?
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
by Ron From NM on Feb 21, 2010 10:58 AM EST up reply actions
I think he would, but none of them were impressed by him when I braught him up.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 21, 2010 12:04 PM EST up reply actions
Who cares what they think
Eagles fans aren’t the ones making picks. If Reid and their front office want to move up, they will.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
Oh I know that. But we were talking about the usual startegy of their FO’s come draft time, and the general concensus was that it would be very out of character to trade up 15 spots in the first.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 21, 2010 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
To clarify they didn’t say that it was out of the question, just that it would be very, very out of character. They said that if it were to happen it would be a draft day trade for a targeted player, and the only one that they identified was Berry.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 21, 2010 12:14 PM EST up reply actions
Eagles Fans
Yeah I read the thread at green nation. Those guy’s are right to the point… to put it nicely. Reminds me of ’Sunny in Phil. " show on TV.
by buffalobacker on Feb 21, 2010 12:30 PM EST up reply actions
Love that show!
But yeah, they don’t sugar coat anything. It took me a bit of time to get used to it and not feel insulted by every other comment.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 21, 2010 1:32 PM EST up reply actions
Other than Thigpen
The dolphins wouldn’t even be considered. This will all depend on Gailey and the staffs evaluation of the current QB’s on the roster and this years draft class. I don’t see much benefit in dealing with the Jaguars which would leave the Eagles. I can see Nix working something out with the eagles to stock up some additional picks and trading our #9 down to their #24. As far as including player trades, I would be more interested in their offensive lineman more than their QB’s. Our draft selections in rounds 1 – 7 aren’t bad and I wouldn’t want them to alter it to much unless, they were able to gain more than they give.
This is like dumping a new puzzle from it's box. Now let's start putting the peices together. I guess this is what we all asked for.
That column is reserved for teams with only 2 picks in the first 4 rounds.
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
by Ron From NM on Feb 21, 2010 11:00 AM EST up reply actions
Up with down!
a great synopsis of who’s got what, who wants what, who’s not got, who’s not gettin’. And, if Nix is who we think he is, given the chance he’ll go for more picks . After all, that’s his philosophy and most scenarios point in that direction.
I say, up with down, let’s get all we can and – “they(the picks) are who we thought they were”
"In wine there is wisdom, in beer there is strength, in water there is bacteria"
Up with Down
I’m not only in favor of trading #9 for more picks I think we should also trade #41 and Lee Evans too. Evans has been a good soldier for us and deserves to be on a contender. With the new 3-4 we will need a lot of new players to make that scheme happen.
Jags...
Just a thought —If T-Bow is still on the board when Buffalo picks in the 2nd round the Jags might be willing to give up their no#1 next year for the Bills no#2 this year.
'To get something you never had,
you have to do something you never did.'
I think that that would be very likely if he was still there in the second. Now the likelyness of Tebow actually being there in the second is a whole other matter.
And I wouldn’t want to give away a pick this year without getting anything back this year either.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 21, 2010 12:08 PM EST up reply actions
A no#2
Chances are the Bills will be drafting in the top 10 again next year, if the give up a no#2 this for a no#1 next year that would be a good deal. The Bills will be looking at a top 10 pick and the Jags will probably have a pick in the top 25. If some how they can get a extra pick this year 5th or 6th round that would be gravy….
'To get something you never had,
you have to do something you never did.'
Giants
The only team that I disagree wtih you on is the Giants. I agree with everything else.
The question is why would the Giants make such a move?
Unlike most of the teams that are drafting around 15th overall, the Giants are legit Super Bowl contenders next year. The offense is near set, with some OL depth needed. They have the best DL in football. They have decent LB’s in Sintim and Boley, and have needs in their secondary. The Giants could sit at 15 and draft Earl Thomas. Or they could trade up to get McClain, who would replace Pierce at MLB and complete their front seven.
Phily trading up for Derrick Morgan is very possible, as a SDE is a big need for Phily, and one of their few needs.
Rec’d.
I agree. I could see the Giants wanting to move up from 15 to 9 to get McClain, and I could see Buddy Nix happily moving down to 15 in order to gain an extra pick in the middle of the second round — especially if we have already added another third-rounder through a trade (Kyle Williams, Donte Whitner?).
They’re not out of the question, though it would leave them only 3 picks in the first four rounds. Philly has picks to burn making them a likely candidate to move up the board—whether with Buffalo or someone else is a different question entirely.
McClain really is the x-factor in the equation. He, at this point, seems likely to be on the board at 9. Several teams—Jacksonville, Giants, Eagles—could be interested in moving up to get him. With any luck Buffalo could get someone to overpay…..but I didn’t include any overpayment in my analysis. If someone does overpay it would likely be in the form of 2011 draft picks anyway. (After all, why not trade away picks in a year in which there might be limited or no football?)
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
by Ron From NM on Feb 21, 2010 11:06 AM EST up reply actions
You don't think
a team like the Giants would trade up for a McClain even if they only end up with 3 picks in the first four rounds? That team doesn’t have very many holes, so filling the biggest one could be their biggest goal of the draft.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
Oh, I’m not saying that it’s out of the question that the Giants could trade up to 9. If they really want McClain they’ll have to trade into the top 10 and 9 seems about right for McClain. I’d love it if Buffalo got that deal out of the Giants—or from the Seahawks for that matter.
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
by Ron From NM on Feb 21, 2010 11:21 AM EST up reply actions
The key with the Giants is that they are a legit contender that had a bad year
I don’t think the Giants are in the same mindset as we are, which is that we need to have as many picks as we can get. NY can get away with quantity of quality. I think NY would take the above mentioned deal in a heartbeat for McClain. The other bug Giant need, DB, could be filled in UFA or later in the draft. The rest of the picks are developmental and/or depth.
Phily is in the same situation, where quality of the picks is more important than quantity. We saw the Jets do it last year and it worked fairly well for them. Only a certain number of teams each year can go this route. The Giants and Phily can, Dallas probably can, Minnesota and NO can, and Indy and the Jets can.
Very good analysis overall.
The one thing I disagree with is assuming Washington is taking Sam Bradford with the 4th pick. It’s still February. The combine hasn’t even happened yet. Lots of time still before the draft. I don’t think we can just assume that Washington, at pick #4, is going to pick one specific player. I think that is premature.
Other than that, good stuff.
Fair enough…..but we are talking about Shanahan.
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
by Ron From NM on Feb 21, 2010 11:06 AM EST up reply actions
According to rescent report Shanahan had a very long sitdown with Jason Campbell and Campbell came out of it with the impression that he will be the starter next year. But that doesn’t mean that they wont draft Bradford anyways.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 21, 2010 12:16 PM EST up reply actions
If some team wants to trade
They can. Just because they lack a 2nd or 3rd round pick, doesn’t mean they can’t move up. If Tennessee or Atlanta want to move up, I wouldn’t exactly count them out. They could always offer their 2011 1st rounder. In fact, if certain owners are convinced their will be a lockout in 2011, maybe trading away picks from that draft aren’t such a bad idea….
I don’t know where you got your info, but compensatory picks haven’t been announced yet. We’re still a month away from hearing who gets some. Including those here isn’t correct.
I totally disagree that the Giants aren’t realistic. They are one of the teams that make a ton of sense to move up to #9, with their need for a MLB or secondary help. I think McClain might do more for them than say a Brian Price and a 3rd round pick by staying put.
The Eagles seem like a good option, too, but would really need to pay up. Moving down 15 spots would require a healthy number of picks. The 24, 56, and 71 makes sense, but even that might be a little light.
Players being involved in draft day trades, or to get picks prior to the draft, will have a big impact on any teams moving up. Let’s say Carolina trade DeAngelo Williams to San Diego for their 1st rounder. That gives them a pair of firsts and more ability to move up. With the final 8 teams of the playoffs handcuffed by the CBA free agent rules this year, look for them to attempt making trades for vets more than usual.
Again, where are you getting this compensatory pick info??
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
I picked up the comp picks info on several of the seven round mocks. I had operated under the assumption that those picks had been announced. It could be that the mock sites have guesstimated the comp picks based on last year’s free agency. The comp picks really don’t have a huge impact for our purposes here as they don’t start until the end of the 3rd round….but they are picks which can help teams rationalize trading their normal picks away.
You may well be right about the Giants, particularly if they think one guy is the key to their 2011 season. Hence the reason for post in general—let’s get what we all think is at least reasonable hashed out now instead of rehashing it for the next two months.
A late first, two seconds and two thirds (Eagles trade) would let the Bills address 5 needs in the first 3 rounds for dropping back 15 slots.
I kept this tied to 2010, though teams generally throw in picks for future years (Peters deal) to minimize the pain of a trade. You can’t rule out people like Dan Snyder trading 37 (leaving them only with 9 and 105 this year), plus their 2011 first and third rounders for 9…..you also can’t predict it either.
I can’t remember many draft day player trades in deals to move up in the first round over the past few years. I’m thinking that might have something to do with players needing to sign off of the deal and having contracts at least outlined in a short window of time. With new draft format maybe that will pick up?
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
by Ron From NM on Feb 21, 2010 11:32 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah
The comps haven’t been announced, and it’s actually pretty hard to predict who might get some and what those picks might be. I know they won’t really have a huge impact, but you kept mentioning them, so I was wondering where you were getting the info.
I really think the Giants would be wise to try to get McClain. They need a guy like that in the middle of their defense and with fewer needs on offense, they could really try to make this happen. I forgot to mention they could want a guy like CJ Spiller too, so that is also a possibility for a trade up for them.
I think moving down 15 spots isn’t a bad thing, I just don’t want the Bills to lose value. Taking a potentially elite top ten pick (say Davis or Clausen or McClain or whoever) and moving down to 24 and ending up with a Bruce Campbell or Sergio Kindle or Brandon Graham or Jared Odrick or whoever seems like it could be a pretty significant decrease in value. To me, they might have to include something more than a late 2nd and mid 3rd, but I understand the desire and need to acquire more picks to help build. I totally agree with that part, but I just don’t want the Bills giving away value simply to get more picks.
Well you can’t predict throwing in future picks, just like you can’t predict who will make a trade this year! It’s all guesstimating what teams will do. I think we can assume a team like Washington would be more prone to making a trade like that than a team like New England would. And I think you can’t count any team out from moving up simply because they lack extra picks this year because of the ability to trade future picks.
Yeah, there aren’t too many draft day player trades, but they do happen….Randy Moss, Drew Bledsoe, Javon Walker, the guys in the Sanchez trade last year off the top of my head. Those obviously won’t be a big part of draft day, but players being traded before the draft for picks will be. That’s mostly where I was going with that comment. I really believe we’ll see more player trades this offseason due to the CBA issues.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
I agree with K totally
If you look at why some of the teams are in their current position, that’s because they traded some of their current picks in previous years. More often than not, teams are willing to trade future picks. It’s sort of like using a credit card — leveraging the future for your current needs. If there is someone you want, I think it is a totally reasonable mortgage future picks.
Especially with a potential lockout in 2011, teams who are close to making it to the big dance should pull out all the stops to try to win in 2010. This includes trading away 2011 picks to get there.
But in relation to the Bills, would Chix agree to take future picks as part of the package? If they are not willing to entertain the future, then it would reduce the number of options the Bills have. But if they can be more open-minded, there are ample of opportunities to make a trade up or down the board — more so than what you have made it out to be here.
Bills fan half way around the world
Exactly
Especially with a potential lockout in 2011, teams who are close to making it to the big dance should pull out all the stops to try to win in 2010. This includes trading away 2011 picks to get there.
That’s a point I think everyone is overlooking. If teams are convinced of a lockout, you never know how they’ll operate. Some teams might believe there won’t be a lockout, and thus more likely to accept future picks, and vice versa.
The CBA’s impact on the final 8 teams of the playoffs being limited in their free agent pursuits this year will also increase the likelihood of draft picks for vets trades.
If the Bills aren’t willing to take future picks, they’d be nuts. The only reason I wouldn’t accept 2011 picks is if I was convinced there was going to be a lockout. But if a team is willing to overpay, it is worth the risk. Plus, if there is a lockout, how will the draft be impacted? If the worst thing possible happened, and a lockout goes into effect after the 2010 season, will there be a draft? Will there be a 2011 season (AGHHHHHH!)??
Back to the Bills, this is more than a one off-season rebuild. If a team like, say, Baltimore (?) is willing to trade their first this year, a 3rd and next year’s 1st to move all the way up to 9, the Bills would have to do that, right? Not only will that give them another high pick next year, but it will increase their ability to be flexible next draft, as well. Again, assuming there is a draft….
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
If a team like, say, Baltimore (?) is willing to trade their first this year, a 3rd and next year’s 1st to move all the way up to 9, the Bills would have to do that, right?
I would be very tempted to do that if I was Buffalo—particularly if I had some of the less ballyhooed OTs, NTs and LBs high on my board. Buffalo might then have the option of using the Raven’s 2011 first rounder (perhaps with the Bills’ 41) to pick up a first rounder in the mid-late teens….if Buffalo had a player they had pegged in the teens and another in the mid 20s.
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
by Ron From NM on Feb 21, 2010 12:57 PM EST up reply actions
If the first trade happens
You can bet the 2nd one won’t. What’s the point of trading out of #9 and not netting any extra picks? I don’t think that’s a good use of a top 10 pick.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
No second trade: 25, 41, 73, 89, 109 (2011 1st rounder from Ravens)
w/ second trade: 18ish, 25, 73, 89, 109 (no 2011 1st rounder from Ravens)
The only way Buffalo does it is if they’ve got a guy in the teens and a guy in the mid 20s that they just have to have. There’ s no doubt that just doing the initial trade is the better value for Buffalo.
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
Hey man, anu scenario that ends up with us getting a shot at both Bulaga and Dan Williams is a win to me!
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 21, 2010 1:33 PM EST up reply actions
That’s the other side of the coin. Buffalo, in that scenario, would have to choose between better value (having 2011 first rounder from Ravens to add to Buffalo’s own 2011….in 2011) and taking two players high on the boards during the draft.
Someone used the word credit card earlier—buy now or have more money later?
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
At the point where we are at, and considering the fact that we know which players are available next year, I’d buy now.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 21, 2010 1:39 PM EST up reply actions
*we know which players are available this year and not the ones that will be available next year…
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 21, 2010 1:40 PM EST up reply actions
If the worst thing possible happened, and a lockout goes into effect after the 2010 season, will there be a draft? Will there be a 2011 season (AGHHHHHH!)??
There will be a draft, supposedly. Even without a 2011 season.
YES WE CHAN!
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by MattRichWarren on Feb 22, 2010 2:14 PM EST up reply actions
One would hope. If not, what would happen to all those traded picks? You just lose them? That would hardly seem fair.
Official ledge-talker-offer of the Buffalo Bills.
There would still be a college football season and teams would still be operating, it would be the pro players who would be locked out.
YES WE CHAN!
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by MattRichWarren on Feb 22, 2010 4:44 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah. That’s what I figured. Draft but no season. We finally win at something!
That’d make it really tough to be a rookie. Getting essentially no experience in your first year. Hell of a deal for the young QB that needs time to work on mechanics and basics, but pretty rough all-around.
Official ledge-talker-offer of the Buffalo Bills.
It will finally happen. The Bills will have an undefeated season in 2011!
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 22, 2010 10:14 PM EST up reply actions
I bet the CFL would be pretty exciting that year!
We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are. ~Anais Nin
And 2011 is supose to be when Ottawa (my home town and where i live) gets its team back. I’m already saving up for my season tickets.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 23, 2010 12:58 AM EST up reply actions
Have they picked a name yet? If not, how about the Rough-rene Rider-gades? Has a certain pig-latin-ish ring to it… Will the be playing at Lansdowne again?
We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are. ~Anais Nin
They are making the plans to totally renevate Lansdown right now. 150M reconstruction into full oval for about 38 000 fans. They haven’t decided on the name yet, but rumour has it that the new ownership group (all local boys to so they wont run away this time) are trying to acquire the naming rights to call them the Rough Riders again.
Personally I wont care what they’re called, I’m just happy to have football back in ttawa. And 450$ for a nine game season ticket pack is pretty damn good too.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 23, 2010 3:29 AM EST up reply actions
Rough Riders is only proper. Maybe they can rekindle spirits from 1976, the last year they won the Grey Cup… A woozy (concussed?) Tom Clements (yes, that Tom Clements) passes to Tony Gabriel who galloped down the sidelines for the winning touchdown! The Bills could use a guy like Tony G. In his 11 seasons, he caught 614 passes for 9,832 yards and 69 touchdowns – not bad for a TE…
We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are. ~Anais Nin
Well technically Tony G. was a slotback, but it`s the basic CFL equivilant of a TE.
And yes Rough Riders is only proper. It would continue over 120 years of tradition in Ottawa, so I`m really hoping that they can aquire the nameing rights.
As for the QB, I’d love for them to be able to find the next Russ Jackson, that would be fantastic.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 23, 2010 5:33 PM EST up reply actions
Actually, Tony G. played Split-End while at Syracuse and (other than maybe his first year in the CFL when he might have played some Slot/SE) played TE for most of his professional career. From his CFL reference page (http://www.cfl.ca/page/his_legends_gabriel):
"Today Tony Gabriel is fondly remembered as one of the last “throw-back” tight ends in CFL history, lined up alongside either tackle, and fully responsible for blocking linebackers and on certain plays, even defensive linemen. But more significantly he is remembered for being the last Canadian to win the Schenley for most valuable player in the CFL. And of course, he is remembered for “The Catch.” I think that makes his receiving numbers even more impressive.
For anyone interested, here is a link to “The Catch” (apparently his ‘galloping down the sidelines’ was a different play):
http://archives.cbc.ca/sports/football/topics/381-2201/
Also, Russ Jackson was and is a very classy man besides being a CFL legend. I’ve got an autographed book from him, somewhere. I thought it might have been his biography, but a Google search doesn’t confirm that…
We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are. ~Anais Nin
The question is:
If there is a lockout of the 2011 season, what will be the draft order for the subsequent draft? Same as the previous year? Or all by lottery?
Bills fan half way around the world
I'd imagine if there is no 2011 season
That the 2012 NFL draft will have the same order as the 2011 draft. That makes the most sense. The teams that stunk heading in the 2011 draft, are going to be the teams that still stink heading into the 2012 draft….
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
I’d actually put mymoney on them taking the NHL post lockout route with a random lotery to determine the draft order.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 23, 2010 5:34 PM EST up reply actions
I’m sick of Philadelphia getting our stuff.
I think we should do what we have to to get Tampa’s pick and go for a QB. We have not had a good one in 13 years. OL can wait.
Buffalo would have to trade 9 and probably the 2011 first rounder to move up to 3….and maybe more. I can’t see CHIX doing that.
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
by Ron From NM on Feb 21, 2010 11:33 AM EST up reply actions
I wouldn’t do it. I doubt the Bucs would either. 9+41 would leave Buffalo about a mid second round pick short of 3. I don’t think that Whitner is worth a mid second rounder to anyone.
If you’re really looking for a QB I would start looking around pick 6. On the chart it would cost Buffalo 73 to move from 9 to 6….but that’s only if Seattle doesn’t demand a premium. Given that Seattle has a couple of picks in the first round they might not demand a king’s ransom. But then Buffalo has only 6, 41 and 109 in the first four rounds, meaning that several positions (like OT or NT) will get only a lick and a promise.
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
Now that Brad Butler has retired, Bills will not be trading up or down. They will have to stand pat and draft the best OT available.
Before Butler left, I was in the camp that they should draft B.P.A at every spot instead of need. But that opinion has since changed.
"It took twenty five years to get there, and they did it in championship style" - Van Miller 1/20/91.
You raise a good point. However, remember that the Bills got Levitre at the end of the 2nd round in the 2009 draft….and got Mike Williams at #4 overall once upon a time. If the Bills can drop back in the first round and still get an OT they have rated very highly (netting extra picks in the process) I’m all for it.
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
by Ron From NM on Feb 21, 2010 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
Personally, I don't think Butler's retirement has a huge impact on #9
We aren’t drafting a RT there, so I’m not sure that pick will be affected all that much. His retirement doesn’t raise the need for a LT, because it was a big need before.
If anything, I think his retirement might force the Bills to go after a veteran RT, while drafting a potential replacement in the mid/later rounds….
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Feb 21, 2010 11:54 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It might depend on Saffold
The Bills might be more inclined to move down IF (and it’s a very big IF) they believe that Rodger Saffold is their guy at OT. They could then swap picks with the Giants and take Dan Williams or Sergio Kindle at #15 and get Saffold (or some equivalent OT that they have their eye on but who we don’t have the foresight to detect yet) with one of their second-rounders, using the other second-rounder for an NT, OLB or possibly a TE (depending on what they do at #15). Assuming Saffold is a good choice, that would make a nice haul on draft day and move them a lot closer to where they need to be in terms of rebuilding the roster.
I’m also assuming that they would sign a veteran RT in FA and that they have some faith in Bell and Meredith as future OT prospects once those two have more time to develop.
The real life isnt Madden folks...........
Im a big fan of staying put where you are……unless is there a Blue Chip cant miss guy you can get your hands on…….and in this draft…….thats Suh……..and thats it…….and we arent getting him.
-Buffalo Rumblings resident Chan Gailey basher-
by norcaliangelsfan on Feb 21, 2010 12:12 PM EST reply actions
Tell that to Cleveland. They traded down, what, 3 times last year?
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
by Ron From NM on Feb 21, 2010 12:58 PM EST up reply actions
trading down is okay..........
if you can find someone to trade with………..but that doesnt happen very often.
-Buffalo Rumblings resident Chan Gailey basher-
by norcaliangelsfan on Feb 21, 2010 1:09 PM EST up reply actions
9 of the 32 picks in the first round of 2009 were traded, either on draft day or before (some at the previous draft) which is 28%. 3 picks have already been traded and my guess is that about half a dozen more trades will be made between now and the end of draft day.
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
I guess I should have said trades down with the Bills.........
the Bills trade up alot…….I dont remember too many times seeing them trade down lately.
-Buffalo Rumblings resident Chan Gailey basher-
by norcaliangelsfan on Feb 21, 2010 1:53 PM EST up reply actions
Ah, but the Jauronian Era has joined the Soviet Union in the dustbin of history. All bets are off now.
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
solid point
-Buffalo Rumblings resident Chan Gailey basher-
by norcaliangelsfan on Feb 21, 2010 3:46 PM EST up reply actions
I think that overstates how likely the Bills are to move down though. There was only one trade in the top 15 picks last year and that was the Jets moving up for Sanchez. There were three trades involving players that happened before the draft (Peters, Cutler and Roy Williams) and that pick that Philly gave Buffalo for Peters was from the year before when Carolina traded it to move up and grab Jeff Otah.
The other trades were Cleveland moving down two spots to pick up a 6th rounder, which they did twice. Baltimore gave up a 5th rounder to move up three spots from 26 to 23. Green Bay gave up a 2nd and two 3rds for that 26th pick and a 5th rounder in order to draft Clay Matthews.
So, it really wasn’t all that much movement. Other than the trades involving players, there were two substantial trades in the first round last year. The Jets moving up for Sanchez and the Packers moving up for Matthews.
I signed up for Second Life about a year ago. Back then my life was so great that I literally wanted a second one. In my Second Life I was also a paper salesman and I was also named Dwight. Absolutely everything was the same. Except I could fly. - Dwight Schrute
Needs
We have alot of needs, any deals that give us more viable picks I’m all for. More picks, higher likely hood of some sucessful players. Very informative Ron thank-you….
Great post Ron. Hopefully we can trade down with the Eagles.
by Hassanali181 on Feb 21, 2010 2:39 PM EST reply actions
MRWs links
One of the links suggests that Buffalo trade Lee Evans to the Ravens for 25 and 89. The point of the article is that Evans will be in his 30s and due for a new contract by the time the Bills are ready to contend. If Buffalo made the trade the Bills would have 9, 25, 41, 73, 89 and 109 in the first four rounds. It would also create another hole at WR.
Thoughts?
It can always get worse. Let me tell you how.
If the Ravens are willing to offer that, why not? Pick up Dez Bryant at #9, Dan Williams at 25, and the best available OT at 41. Then try to stock up the D in the 3rd round.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 21, 2010 5:05 PM EST up reply actions
I'd do that
"Fan ?" You want to talk about being a fan of the Bills ? Try getting up at 3 AM every Monday to watch their games knowing they'll likely lose. Do this for 18 years and then call yourself a "fan"
me too
in a heart beat.
Buffalo, that's where it's at baby. - Adam 'Pacman' Jones
by silverstreak3k on Feb 21, 2010 7:10 PM EST up reply actions
I like the trade of Evans to the Ravens scenario...
…but I think I’d still look at traded down from #9. By trading L.Evans, D.Bryant bocomes a very strong possibility for Buffalo and might scare teams like Denver or, less likely, Miami into over paying (picks #81 or #74, respectively) to move up a couple of slots to get their receiver. Trading down with the Seahawks or Giants would still leave the Bills with 14 or 15 and 25!
I’m also not sure that D.Williams would make it past Miami and Pittsburg – I’ve seen mocks where he goes to both. Woth Ferguson and Hampton not being long term options, either team make take Williams if they have him rated high enough on their board.
So making more than a couple of assumptions, I wouldn’t replace Evans with Bryant at #9, but I would look at Williams at #15 after trading with NYG, take Gresham at #25 and the best available OTs at #41 and #46 (or at #41 and #109 with a LB or DE at #46). For receivers, they’d end up with Hardy or Johnson on one side and a UFA like Walters or Osgood (again, making some assumptions, including Reed and TO not returning) on the other, with Nelson and Gresham in the middle. If nothing else, the short-to-mid pasing game could be pretty impressive – and that’s not such a bad thing playing in a conference full of 3-4 defenses.
We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are. ~Anais Nin
Osgood isn't a WR
He’s a soon-to-be 30 year old with five receptions in the past five years. He’s strictly a special teamer.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
Now that Detroit is shopping their #2...
and assuming they do find a trading partner (who are not the Bills), they’ll likely miss out on both N.Suh and G.McCoy. Maybe that new first pick is a LT to protect their million-dollar-man’s blind-side? If so, perhaps they’d be interested in K.Williams and C.Kelsey and R.Parrish for #34?
What if the Bills trade Evans to the Ravens, trade down picks with the Giants and trade Williams, et al to the Lions? They could end up with #15, #25, #34, #41, #46, #106 and #117! How plausible is that?
We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are. ~Anais Nin
Not plausible at all
There is absolutely no chance Detroit would give up #34 for Williams and a couple of scrubs. Williams might command a 3rd rounder somewhere, but not a a borderline first round pick, especially when the package is hindered by the other two involved.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
Okay then...
Instead of Parrish, include Whitner. That would be two new probable starters (Williams and Whitner) and a probable platoon player (Kelsey) for Detroit for one high 2nd round pick. Any better?
Alternatively, IFF Detroit was able to trade their pick they’d get something pretty decent in return. So what if, instead of #34, Bills netted a late 2nd round pick from Detroit for Williams and Kelsey (and maybe Parrish)?
We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are. ~Anais Nin
2011
I think it’s a bit early to say who might and might not trade – the simple fact is we don’t know. However one thing that needs to be remembered is that # 41 pick – there are always teams offering next years 1st rounder for a pick in that range (ALA SF / Carolina last year) Happens almost every year !
Since we are a couple of years away anyway I personally would not object to our 2nd rounder going to a team for their 1st next year – even make them throw in a 4th or so this year if we are worried about the qty of our picks.
This scenario is especially appealing if we manage to trade down with Philly or NYG. We’d still have a mid / late 1st rounder – some extra picks gathered and 2 × 1sts next year which gives the ammo to go and get any QB we fall in love with.
And no, this is not a madden scenario – just something that tends to happen in the NFL every year !
"Fan ?" You want to talk about being a fan of the Bills ? Try getting up at 3 AM every Monday to watch their games knowing they'll likely lose. Do this for 18 years and then call yourself a "fan"
you are correct...........
its not a madden scenerio……because I believe (and please someone correct me if I am wrong) you cant trade draft picks of future seasons on Madden……you can only trade pics of that current season.
-Buffalo Rumblings resident Chan Gailey basher-
by norcaliangelsfan on Feb 21, 2010 6:49 PM EST up reply actions
yay
Nice to get something right.
I always look at those teams who trade their 2nd rounder (33-45 range) for someones 1st the next year and think – “you lucky S.O.B’s” Would be nice if it was us and we thought ahead with the knowledge it will take us 2-3 years to put all the pieces together on OL, front 7 on D, QB, WR etc. Who am I kidding though – this years 41 for a 2011 pick that might be in the 15 – 20 range – makes too much sense for the Bills to try it.
"Fan ?" You want to talk about being a fan of the Bills ? Try getting up at 3 AM every Monday to watch their games knowing they'll likely lose. Do this for 18 years and then call yourself a "fan"
by Will G on Feb 21, 2010 10:59 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
sorry couldn't resist
USA! USA! USA!
Ryan Miller is the man!
"you just have to know there's always going to be adversity. None of these games are going to be easy. Nothing will be given to us" - Paul Posluszny
42 saves is a good day out !
Good win for your boys !
"Fan ?" You want to talk about being a fan of the Bills ? Try getting up at 3 AM every Monday to watch their games knowing they'll likely lose. Do this for 18 years and then call yourself a "fan"
it was a heck of a game
both sides played all out, fun to watch.
When are you guys gonna field a team?
"you just have to know there's always going to be adversity. None of these games are going to be easy. Nothing will be given to us" - Paul Posluszny
Australia ?
Huh, we’d get belted – the league over here is not very strong at all. Best player I saw was an ex NHL guy who was about 38 years old at the time – and he still looked a cut above the others. We also have a few Canadian college team guys come out and play when they are taking a years holiday – thats about the best we get.
"Fan ?" You want to talk about being a fan of the Bills ? Try getting up at 3 AM every Monday to watch their games knowing they'll likely lose. Do this for 18 years and then call yourself a "fan"
Hey won that game all by himself, We outplayed you in everything else!
Our biggest mistake was playing Brodeur instead of Luango. I knew that Brodeur’s overwillingness to go after the puck would hurt us.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 21, 2010 11:27 PM EST up reply actions
Hey won that game all by himself, We outplayed you in everything else!
You Canadians still can’t accept that after all the smack talk we dumped five goals on you, can you my friend? I love you bro, but Miller didnt put that puck in the back of your net 5 times.
"you just have to know there's always going to be adversity. None of these games are going to be easy. Nothing will be given to us" - Paul Posluszny
Whooooaaaaaahhhhh......Sieve Sieve Sieve :-)
If we end up with Vick, T.O., Richie I., and Porter….that is really pushing the dbag density limit for one team.
hahahhaah
I have to admit, hearing every Canadian I know tell me for a week how badly they were going to pound us today made the win very sweet.
That said, its just one game and both teams still got a lot of hockey left to play to prove anything.
"you just have to know there's always going to be adversity. None of these games are going to be easy. Nothing will be given to us" - Paul Posluszny
and for the record
CBF was definitely not one of them. As usual CBF, you were classy the whole way.
"you just have to know there's always going to be adversity. None of these games are going to be easy. Nothing will be given to us" - Paul Posluszny
Thanks. Actually I was humble because I honestly thought that you guys had a chance to beat us. Not that i thought you would, but that you had a chance. Sometimes I hate being right.
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 21, 2010 11:52 PM EST up reply actions
Well I’m glad you gave us a chance. You guys are clearly the more refined and talented team but I like this USA team. They may be young but they are very skilled and I think youth may be an advantage on a team that isnt a favorite.
Sometimes I hate being right.
I bet you thought that after every Bills season the last five years, haha.
"you just have to know there's always going to be adversity. None of these games are going to be easy. Nothing will be given to us" - Paul Posluszny
Spoken like a true Bills fan
We outplayed you in everything else!
You forgot the most important part…..the score :-)
If we end up with Vick, T.O., Richie I., and Porter….that is really pushing the dbag density limit for one team.
Yeah yeah yeah. See you guys in the final!
The more I see, the les I know.
by CanadianBillsFan on Feb 21, 2010 11:50 PM EST up reply actions
Except the Bills never outplay anyone in everything else
It’s always, “Well our special teams played better than yours!”
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
Finland
watch out for finland they are playing great hockey
by RaleighforBills on Feb 22, 2010 12:04 AM EST reply actions






























