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State of the Bills Roster: Defensive End

The Buffalo Bills are currently in the second week of voluntary Organized Team Activities, a critical time period for new Bills defensive coordinator George Edwards and his new-look 3-4 defense. Buffalo's defenders are currently busy learning new techniques and installing defensive looks in preparation for training camp and, ultimately, the regular season.

Switching to the 3-4 scheme, there aren't many players on Buffalo's roster that will be making bigger technical changes to their game than the team's holdover personnel at defensive tackle. The likes of Marcus Stroud, Kyle Williams, Spencer Johnson, John McCargo and Rashaad Duncan will all be switching from one-gap responsibilities in the team's previous 4-3 defense to the two-gap, five-technique responsibilities of 3-4 defensive end. The jury remains very much out on just how quickly and effectively those players can make that transition; it's not a radical one, but it's just significant enough to count.

After the jump, we'll take a look at one of the most veteran-laden positions on Buffalo's defensive unit. The Bills still have a lot of question marks defensively, but if players transition smoothly, this unit should, at the very least, be highly effective against the run in 2010.

Star-divide

Positional Responsibilities
Buffalo's defensive ends, playing the five-technique, will be two-gap players. They'll spend a great deal of time playing directly against offensive tackles, where their job will be to control two gaps in the run game and free up the team's outside linebackers to take on backs and tight ends against the pass. This is a very technical position - critical to the success of a defense, but not a position that will put up huge numbers. If the Bills are successful against the run and the team's linebackers put up big numbers, Buffalo's defensive ends will have done their job, regardless of what their own statistical production looks like.

Personnel Breakdown
Don't read anything into the order in which players appear below - they appear based purely on level of NFL game experience, and nothing more.

99 - Marcus Stroud. Having never played in a 3-4 scheme before, Stroud has spent the off-season preparing to learn an entirely new position, as he's currently penciled in as a starter at end. Despite that lack of exposure to the 3-4, Stroud's 6'6", 310-pound frame (and there are reports that he's dropped a few pounds to try to get quicker) and length make him an excellent fit at five-technique. Teaming up with the next player on this list, Stroud and Dwan Edwards give the Bills a potentially elite duo of run-stopping five-technique defensive ends with lots of experience. Stroud has worn down a bit and been banged up over the past couple of seasons, so it's imperative that the team find viable rotational depth to keep Stroud fresh and healthy for a full sixteen games. If that happens, Stroud could be in for an outstanding season.

98 - Dwan Edwards. Signed to a four-year, $18 million deal this past March, Edwards was Buffalo's biggest-name, and most critical, free agent addition. Edwards has toiled in relative anonymity through his first six NFL seasons, all spent in Baltimore, where he accumulated 120 tackles, two sacks, an interception, a fumble recovery and a defensive touchdown as a rotational player and part-time starter. Edwards isn't a big-time stat producer, but very few good defensive ends are; make no mistake, Edwards is in Buffalo to help shore up one of the league's worst run defenses. Defending the run is Edwards' bread and butter, but he can put up a few pursuit sacks as well. He's an instant starter on a Bills defense that is desperate for leaders familiar with the 3-4 scheme.

91 - Spencer Johnson. Though he hasn't quite lived up to the solid free agent money he was given in 2008 (five years, $17.5 million), Johnson has been a useful reserve player for the Bills in his two years with the club. Now he's making a scheme switch with the rest of the team's holdover talent, and is kind of in no-man's land as far as a true position goes. Johnson will still be useful as a reserve, but there's a chance that he gets more time in sub-package looks than he does as a traditional five-technique end.

97 - John McCargo. I covered McCargo's current situation extensively here, so I won't re-hash to save a little space. The bottom line regarding McCargo: he needs a change of scenery badly. He'll have a tough time making this team.

72 - Rashaad Duncan. A second-year player that spent the 2009 season on Buffalo's practice squad, the 6'2", 315-pound Duncan is a much better fit for the 4-3. He's young enough with enough athleticism to merit a look this pre-season, but he's sitting behind some veterans and a highly-drafted rookie, making his chances at landing on the roster bleak. Has some practice squad potential if the Bills' pure DT rotational players (Kyle Williams, Johnson) get injured.

92 - Alex Carrington. Drafted in the third round out of Arkansas State, the 6'5", 284-pound Carrington has excellent natural strength, solid athleticism and prototypical size for the five-technique position. The soon-to-be 23-year-old put together an excellent career, racking up 94 tackles, 33.5 tackles for loss and 19.5 sacks over his final two collegiate seasons. He's very rough around the edges, so it's tough to expect a lot out of him as a rookie, particularly given the talent jump and the position he plays. Carrington is a down-the-line prospect, but his upside is fairly significant.

79 - Will Croner. A little-known commodity out of Howard, the 6'2", 279-pound Croner has an uphill climb to make even the practice squad. Not knowing much about the undrafted rookie free agent, I'm interested to see how he plays this pre-season, as he might end up being a more natural fit for the five-technique than some of Buffalo's holdover talent.

Contract Situations
Stroud has three years remaining on a four-year, $28 million extension he signed in April of 2009. Edwards agreed to a four-year, $18 million deal this past March. Johnson has three years and $9 million remaining on the five-year free agent deal he signed in 2008. McCargo is in a contract year; he'll make $685K this year. Carrington is likely to get a four-year rookie deal as a third-round pick, while contract details on both Duncan and Croner are unknown.

2010 Forecast
Stroud and Edwards are locked in as the opening-day starters; the two vets are both stout against the run and active in pursuit, and should be in line for excellent seasons. Carrington is the most natural fit at end in reserve, and he'll get rotational snaps, particularly on passing downs. Johnson should see snaps at end, too, but he's a far more useful player as an end/tackle in sub-package looks that utilize four defensive linemen.

My Prediction
I view Stroud, Edwards, Carrington and Johnson as locks to make the final roster. Four defensive ends is plenty, particularly considering nose tackle Kyle Williams will swing out to end on occasion as well. Duncan or Croner could wind up on the practice squad, but I don't view that as overly likely given the nice mix of veteran and youth at the position. If there's any position on Buffalo's roster that appears set for the long-term, and has a nice succession plan, it's defensive end.

Previous Installments: QB, RB, WR, TE, LT, RT, NT, OLB, ILB, FS, SS

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Nice. One of my favorite positions.

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by MattRichWarren on Jun 2, 2010 10:55 AM EDT reply actions  

Too easy.

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by TheAfghanTwilight on Jun 2, 2010 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

haha. Dang it was up there for a while too… Cant believe no one caught that one.

"Ok, its Gudda hoe, all about my Bills like Buffalo."

by bflo on Jun 2, 2010 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

I have no idea what you guys are talking about.

Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott

by Brian Galliford on Jun 2, 2010 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

TWSS was so obvious

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Jun 2, 2010 12:11 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

No lie, that’s one of the lamer TWSSs I’ve read. :)

Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott

by Brian Galliford on Jun 2, 2010 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

They’re always fun to read though.

Buffalo Rumblings Premiere League 2009 Champion
Song recommendation of the week: Tool - Right in Two

by TheAfghanTwilight on Jun 2, 2010 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

It was on the weakre side, but the thing sat there on a tee for us haha.

"Ok, its Gudda hoe, all about my Bills like Buffalo."

by bflo on Jun 2, 2010 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

MRW talking about his favorite positions. lol

"Ok, its Gudda hoe, all about my Bills like Buffalo."

by bflo on Jun 2, 2010 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

Dwan Edwards

Edwards signing has brought much hope into my life and this web site. He is the only player on the Bills roster that K has not referenced the words mediocre or average. Since then I have been able to sleep much sounder at night.

My hope on Edwards is that he brings a level of leadership to the defense. We are all aware of Baltimore’s defense in recent years. They were loaded with play-makers and leaders. This will be a welcome addition to our front seven if he provides that leadership tie to the younger and first timer players at new positions. The front seven on defense needs to be strung together like a fishing net blocking a school of fish.

YOU ARE OUT of you kuku fufu mine craker laker Flaber baber FUNKI chunki brain. WE want to winn every year -- abayarde

by VanScottM on Jun 2, 2010 10:56 AM EDT reply actions  

Could not agree more. Dwan was the guy I wanted from the start of FA and there was no way in hell I thought we’d never land him. This was the best FA signing since Takeo and our run d is indintantly better cause of him.

by eze on Jun 2, 2010 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

This was the best FA signing since Takeo

I’m with you, eze.

I drive a 2010 WhAGON BLASTER w/"Baby on Board!" Bumper Sticker
Wan'na ride?

by Undee on Jun 2, 2010 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Unfortunately, its not really saying much...

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Jun 2, 2010 4:38 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

ironic...

You showed me this…

I drive a 2010 WhAGON BLASTER w/"Baby on Board!" Bumper Sticker
Wan'na ride?

by Undee on Jun 2, 2010 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hey Van - I like that!!
The front seven on defense needs to be strung together like a fishing net blocking a school of fish

Love those Bills but we're tired of losing......

by coolness1 on Jun 2, 2010 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hey now

I’d say there’s a handful of players who exceed mediocre/average. Edwards, Poz, Kyle Williams, Schobel, McGee, Florence, Wilson, Byrd, Evans, Wood, Levitre, Jackson, and maybe Lynch are all solid or good players. There are also a number players who are below mediocre, too…

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Jun 2, 2010 12:19 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Exactly my thoughts on Stroud

A lot of people have written him off but I think Marcus is in line for a monster season. The guy has the perfect blend of athletecism and size for the 5 tech. He’s at 300 pounds now and is in some of the best shape of his life. If he plays as I expect him to, him and Dwan will be one of the best 3-4 d end duo in the league.

by eze on Jun 2, 2010 11:00 AM EDT reply actions  

I don’t know if I’d describe his fit as “perfect.” He’s not a particularly quick player. He’s strong at the point of attack and busts his ass on every play. He’s a good run defender. But he’s pretty one-dimensional in that he won’t be creating a lot of pressure. He’ll do his job well, but he won’t have huge stats.

Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott

by Brian Galliford on Jun 2, 2010 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

Ya, I guess perfect isn’t the right word. He’s just a good fit but I also think his ability to knock down passes is a quality that’s going to be huge.

by eze on Jun 2, 2010 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions  

I like our starters and depth here at D End.

I think that this might be the best group of ends we’ve had here in a long time. Obivously its different now we’re in a 3-4. But overall as the DE position, we’ve got talent, depth and potential. Cant ask for much more than that. Just depends on how Stroud can handle the switch, but losing weight and getting healthy is an awesome start by the big man.

"Ok, its Gudda hoe, all about my Bills like Buffalo."

by bflo on Jun 2, 2010 11:22 AM EDT reply actions  

Paul Hamilton recently reported that Stroud has lost 20 lbs or so. I’m rather excited to see how he does this season.

Buffalo Rumblings Premiere League 2009 Champion
Song recommendation of the week: Tool - Right in Two

by TheAfghanTwilight on Jun 2, 2010 11:33 AM EDT reply actions  

This an RB are probably our strongest positions on the team

I think with his weight loss, Stroud is going to have a very strong year. I like the fact that we can rotate 4 solid players to keep them all fresh. I truely think that are D-line this year is going to be much more of a streng then in years past.

by The Irishman on Jun 2, 2010 12:12 PM EDT reply actions  

Agree

And if the D line becomes a strength, that means out LB’s will be making plays. Combine that with out already solid defensive backfield, this defense could really be enjoyable to watch.

by arbon78 on Jun 2, 2010 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

I do not think they will start out storng

But I do forsee a strong finish for this unit. I think that Stroud 20 lbs lighter and splitting time a little more with keep him stronger throughout the game.

by The Irishman on Jun 2, 2010 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

Throw in the defensive backfield as well.

and you have more strengths then I thought this team would have after last season. On the flip side, the weaknesses are big.

"They're Killin' Me Whitey. They're Killin' Me" -- Lou Saban

by NJBill on Jun 2, 2010 4:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Just to play devil's advocate, if I may

I wouldn’t go crowning this unit a very good one just yet. Dwan Edwards is the only one with any experience playing in this type of defense. Marcus Stroud is on his last legs, IMO. He’ll be a guy to occupy blockers, but beyond that I don’t see how expectations can be very high. I still think he looked pretty awful last and unable to move very well at all. Maybe his weight loss can help; let’s hope so.

Spencer Johnson hasn’t played this position before, but should be a decent rotational guy. I’m not sure if he can provide any sort of pass rush or penetration, but he’ll have some uses.

Carrington shouldn’t be expected to do much this year. Going forward, he should be a big part of the front 7.

None of these guys are going to give us anything in terms of the pass rush, so that is a concern. The transition might not be that smooth for Stroud, Johnson and Carrington. I’m not ready to proclaim this a very good unit until we see how they play in the new D. I will say this position could be very good by season’s end, depending on how the vets perform and whether Carrington progresses. They have a lot to prove.

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Jun 2, 2010 1:01 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

dont forget

that Dwan Edwards also failed some physicals with other teams

In the end I think this will be a good unit, I think Stroud will get more of a pass rush than we expect, he can penetrate early in games and then there is the help we get from Kyle Williams when he gets in the game at either NT or DE.

"I may be drunk, Miss, but in the morning I will be sober and you will still be ugly"

by poz on Jun 2, 2010 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

None of these guys are going to give us anything in terms of the pass rush, so that is a concern.

No it’s not, because they’re not really supposed to.

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"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott

by Brian Galliford on Jun 2, 2010 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

thats true

but I think it becomes a bigger concern for us when we have no definitive idea of where our pass rush will actually come from. If Schobel retires we are banking entirely on Maybin and Kelsay to be our biggest pass rushers and thats not very comforting.

"I may be drunk, Miss, but in the morning I will be sober and you will still be ugly"

by poz on Jun 2, 2010 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well, of course it’s not, but that’d be like asking our OLBs to become dominant pass rushers a year ago. It just wasn’t going to happen. Maybe that’s concerning to some, but I’d rather call it false expectations.

Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott

by Brian Galliford on Jun 2, 2010 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

for sure

but werent we hoping for Kawika Mitchell to be a good blitzing presence because of the weakness of our DEs? I would be nice to get some pass rush support from our DEs on passing downs because we can probably expect a weak pass rush from the OLBs.

"I may be drunk, Miss, but in the morning I will be sober and you will still be ugly"

by poz on Jun 2, 2010 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wasn’t he? He had four sacks one season, and then only played in five games. That’s a support role, and it’s even a slightly different situation, as we’re now comparing five-technique ends to 4-3 outside linebackers.

Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott

by Brian Galliford on Jun 2, 2010 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

So its ok to have 2 guys that have no pass rush ability on the field at the same time??

In addition to having very little pass rush from the OLB’s…

I’m not asking thse guys to put up double digit sacks, or even 5. But having a pair of players that won’t be giving the D any pass rush at all should be a concern. Not a big one because its not their main job, but still something that could hurt this D a bit. Let’s hope Carrington can be that guy….

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Jun 2, 2010 1:23 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

exactly

but I have more faith in Stroud to do these things in the beginning of games than you do. We just have to keep him fresh.

"I may be drunk, Miss, but in the morning I will be sober and you will still be ugly"

by poz on Jun 2, 2010 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Why poz?

Stroud has only made a handful of plays like this since joining the Bills. Why should we expect more than a couple this year? I never thought Stroud’s freshness was a major issue. I think his overall declining ability and weakened ankles are the problem.

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Jun 2, 2010 1:36 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

from watching him play DT for us Stroud has always struck me as a guy who could penetrate a few times a game. With a move outside I’d have to imagine that on passing downs he might be adjusting his technique and goals to result in more of a pressuring presence from Big Marcus. With a position change comes a new attitude.

"I may be drunk, Miss, but in the morning I will be sober and you will still be ugly"

by poz on Jun 2, 2010 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well, now you’re talking. They’ll absolutely chip in sacks here and there. I’m curious to see how Edwards does here, as he’s the closest thing to an every-down end on the roster by far. Stroud’s good for a couple sacks, as is Johnson. If Williams slides outside, he’ll add a couple as well.

You just sounded like you wanted these guys to become the crux of the pass rush because of what’s happening at OLB, and that rubbed me the wrong way. :)

Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott

by Brian Galliford on Jun 2, 2010 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well

With the OLB’s we have, they might have to be the crux of the pass rush!!!! I just don’t like having multiple non-rushers on the field at this position. Don’t most 3-4 teams have at least onbe DE who is pretty good at rushing the passer? I don’t see anyone close to that here, unfortunately.

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Jun 2, 2010 1:51 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

A lot of 3-4 teams use four down linemen in passing situations, and let one of their OLBs be that fourth guy. Jason Taylor is a good example, and Maybin can certainly do that for you (provided he flashes pass-rushing abilities this season, obviously).

I don’t think it’s mandatory that you have a 3-4 end that can rush, because a lot of times, you’re only using that type of player in specialized situations, and you’re playing different techniques along the line anyway.

Buffalo Rumblings. On Twitter.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. --Wayne Grezky" --Michael Scott

by Brian Galliford on Jun 2, 2010 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

If we go into the season hoping that the DE’s will be pass rushing like mad, there is disappointment in the future.

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THIS IS BUFFALO NATION GODZILLA HAS AWAKEN - abayarde

by UZ on Jun 2, 2010 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Who's expecting that?

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Jun 2, 2010 2:55 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

oh no no, I would never expect them to be the crux of our pass rush. But we do need them to step up as a pressuring presence considering the state of our OLBs. I also dont think a couple of sacks from Marcus is good enough. I’d like to see around 4 sacks from him in his new role.

"I may be drunk, Miss, but in the morning I will be sober and you will still be ugly"

by poz on Jun 2, 2010 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think people need to realize that more.

And I am not taking a shot at you Kkurupt, I respect your opinion quitre a bit. I have seen quite a few comments around here that Dwan Edwards doesn’t have great #‘s. The DE positon in the 3-4 is not a big stat position. There job is to be strong against the run, eat up OT’s and guards, and get a push on the pocket during passing plays. The flashier position is the OLB. THey are the ones who get more TFL and sacks. We have good Length at the DE position now. I expect to see passes batted downs go up this year.

by The Irishman on Jun 2, 2010 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

we're aware of this I-Man

absolutely, we know what the 3-4 end is all about. No one is expecting big numbers or sacks. What we’re saying is that there should be some concern that our group of guys can not penetrate on passing plays. We dont want the stats, we want the ability to disrupt. Outside of Stroud, I’m worried we lack that.

"I may be drunk, Miss, but in the morning I will be sober and you will still be ugly"

by poz on Jun 2, 2010 3:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

K, you of all people should be bullish about the Bills DE squad. With Kelsay penciled at OLB, how doesn’t this position improve dramatically?

"They're Killin' Me Whitey. They're Killin' Me" -- Lou Saban

by NJBill on Jun 2, 2010 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

who says

why is it that you peaple can read a few words and then decide these guys can penetrate or cant do this or that . unbelievable.I am not comparing them to BRUCE, but 3/4 de can do a lot more than stand there and eat up space. lets just see how they jell and develop. I dont think you can look entirely at how they did last year. they were coming from different more crowded areas and always on the fiekld too long.

by topguns on Jun 2, 2010 5:30 PM EDT reply actions  

Because they're still the same players....

Marcus Stroud isn’t going to magically become a penetrating type now that he plays 3-4 DE….

We know their strengths and weaknesses, which are unlikely to change all that much, despite a schematic switch….

~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."

by Kurupt on Jun 2, 2010 5:53 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Finally this year.........

Goodbye McBusto!!! Cut this dude yesterday.

"A failure becomes just one time at bat if you refuse to let it defeat you." Marv Levy.

by SERGEANT MAJOR THOR on Jun 2, 2010 6:26 PM EDT reply actions  

WE STAND AND KICK A@#^%r%

THIS DEFENCE IS GOING TO CRUSH , SMASH , PAN CAKE , BLAST , SQUASH , DESMANTALE , AND SNIPE DOWN ALL OF DOES WHO TRY TO RUNN OVER US ITS TIME WE SHOW THE WORLD WHO THE BUFFALO BILLS ARE MADE OF, WE STAND AND WE KICK A@$#%&$^*$%$ BUYAAA

by abayarde on Jun 2, 2010 7:20 PM EDT reply actions  

If I remember right, you live in Miami, right? Would you tell us how you became the most positive thinking Bills fan on the planet? I think I’m not the only one who wonders. If you don’t feel like it, I understand. GO BILLS!

I drive a 2010 WhAGON BLASTER w/"Baby on Board!" Bumper Sticker
Wan'na ride?

by Undee on Jun 2, 2010 7:29 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

While I wouldn't dare speak for...

the Great Abayarde, I once lived in Miami as well, back in my college days… And for a diehard Bills fan, living in the hated aquarium of the Phish, I can say it builds your Bills fandom tremendously!!!

The draft dawns a new year for Buffalo Bills fans, so let optimism reign supreme!!! After all, we are now, UNDEFEATED!!!!

by Cinga on Jun 2, 2010 8:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

The same phenomenon happened to my cousin who grew up as a huge fish fan…in Buffalo.

a.k.a the Uncommon Denominator

by Undee on Jun 3, 2010 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

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