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My random thoughts this week

After this weeks game and a little bit of scouting here are a few things I learnt.

1. After this sunday's game, I am more optimistic about the future at 5-6 than I was at 5-2. The reason is,

In midst of the defeaning buzz surrounding this team after 5-2, I wrote a post questioning if the Bills have proven anything so far. I pointed out in the post that Fitz averages 44% or so completion against Rex Ryan defense (both baltimore and jets) and has never topped 49%. A lot of you said that he has improved and this year is totally different. He promptly went ahead and delivered another horrible performance and followed it up with 2 more blowouts.

But this loss to jets was the first time that he completed 66.7% of his passes against Rex. And not just dump offs but good intermediate passes. His average was 6.8 yds/att and he had 3 TDs and 0 INT. He took chances as always. But this game proves that even against the best defenses and a lack of talent, Gailey has in him to come up with a workable game plan and Fitz has in him to execute it. Imagine if we had better talent. It is unrealistic to expect Fitz and Gailey to beat the best defenses 100% of the times but this game showed there is a 50% chance.

2. I still think this team will go 7-9 as of now. And as of now, I expect us to draft #15 which is good. There might not be good linebackers if we draft any earlier.

3. There is too much bad talk about Stevie Johnson. Since everyone is talking, I will give my 2 cents. I infact thought the Burress mock was funny. Stevie did not let us down because of his celebration but because of his 2 crucial drops when most required. This is sort of becoming a disturbing trend. But the thing that should actually be talked about is that twice this year he has had the better of Darelle Revis. Not 2 passes but 2 whole games. Most receivers would be lucky to have 2 games in their career let alone in a season. Anyone talking about cutting or not resigning Stevie is nuts.

4. I am already hearing Troup being included in the bust list. While I always wanted the bills to pick Terrance Cody instead of Troup, that doesnt make Troup a bust.

Just to put things in perspective, the Jets drafted Sione Pouha in the 3rd round in 2005. He contributed less than Troup in the 1st year, was out the whole season the 2nd year and was never the starter his 3rd and 4th year. Infact in his contract year, the jets signed Kris Jenkins as nose tackle not giving him any chance. In 2009 Rex came in and instead of letting Pouha go he resigned him. Kris got put on IR and in his 5th year for the first time Pouha was a starter. The last 3 years, the Jets are among the top in run defense in large part due to Pouha.

Troup also appears to be done in his 2nd season. But nothing he has done, effort wise shows he is a bust. He has improved his technique and worked on his strength. If his back issues get resolved, he can be a really good player for us. And him being a 2nd round pick, money is not even an issue. I dont think we should call Troup a bust.

5. Speaking of bust, Fred's injury might have saved the bills another bust. Spiller obviously didnt do much against the jets but something tells me, being the unchallenged starter for 6 games releases some pressure and would probably help slow down the game for him due to the reps.

6. Speaking of another bust, no matter what excuse you give, Maybin's 5 sacks and 3 forced fumbles in 8 games, not even as starter, is admirable. Anyone who says these are just coverage sacks and maybin is a bust is being ignorant, jealous and envious. This should be a clear indication our talent evaluators and coaches are not the best in the league and cannot bring out the best in our players. Maybe that has always been the reason for the high number of busts in this decade instead of the players themselves. We dont draft well and we dont know how to use what we have.

7. One way of feeling better about maybin would be return the favor the jets. Vernon Gholston has been a free agent since the end of august. Unlike maybin, he was productive multiple years in school. Unlike maybin, he is definitely not undersized and everyone knows he had a crazy combine. I am not saying we should sign Gholston now. I am saying we should definitely sign him in the offseason. Maybe a whole season out of football kicks some sense into him. I can find no reason except mental, why he should be a bust.

8. Finally a draft point. If the Bills are looking for a developmental QB, a name to get familiar with should be Chandler Harnish out of Northern Illinois. He is 6'2 221 lbs senior. He is already built to take the brunt in NFL. Infact he is similar to Fitz. But he has really good speed for his size. He has been a dual threat QB all his life which I think Gailey likes. What makes him better is he has a big arm and a really good accuracy. He played in a weak MAC conference but if not, he would go in the 1st round with the production anyway. Ben Roethlisberger came from MAC, btw. He never gets sacked and never throws interceptions. This season his TD:INT was 23 to 4 with 10 more rushing TDs. He is projected to go in the 4th round which would be ideal. He can sit behind Fitz for a couple years and who knows might become the complete QB that we want. Check this scouting report out.

http://www.rantsports.com/blog/2011/11/26/chandler-harnish-scouting-report/

Just another great fan opinion shared on the pages of BuffaloRumblings.com.

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Good points

—I agree about Maybin. I am happy for the kid.

—I’m not as optimistic about the team, but they are more satisfying to watch offensively than the previous era. I am very worried about the defense. Yes, this draft class is showing signs, but this is no different than the past when we had individuals who showed flashes. Overall competence and depth is what is needed. The NFL is about matchups and teams learn to exploit weak links. I’m optimistic about the offense but not the defense.

—Spiller, to me, is bordering on bust territory. RBs unlike most positions, can be impact players very early on. This is his second year in the same offense. Flashes just don’t cut it for a #9 pick RB. RBs in the top 10 need to be immediate impacts in some way. Usually rookie or young RBs struggle in blitz pick up or running routes out of the backfield, but straight on running through gaps, edges, etc they should do that well enough to justify that high a pick. It is not that complicated.

—I don’t know this QB you mention but he sounds good. This may be weird but I’ve watched the kid form BC and like him. Anyway, I’m for going all in with Fitz for the next 3-4 years.

Good post.

by Ono on Nov 29, 2011 10:29 AM EST reply actions  

Good points for the most part. I disagree on Maybin, however. Just because he works in Rex’s system doesn’t indicate anything about our talent evaluators, except maybe they were right when they drafted him. Some players just produce better in other systems, and I think this is particularly true for pass rushers. He sacks have been hustle/coverage sacks, there can’t be any denying that, but because the Jets have a good secondary and a strong blitzing scheme, he works in the system. Do you think that he’d have 5 sacks in our system right now? Do you think he’d have any? I don’t.

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Nov 29, 2011 10:47 AM EST reply actions  

that's my point

either you dont draft him coz he doesnt fit our system… or if you do draft him, make the system work for him…

and it is a stretch to say that maybin is successful only because of revis…. the reason why the jets secondary is good and why maybin is successful both are due to ryan… and that’s why i said our coaches are not good enough to get the best out of the players

by statcruncher on Nov 29, 2011 11:32 AM EST up reply actions  

I didn’t mention Revis once. He’s only part of the secondary which is good because they are good, not only because of Ryan. And yes, having that good of a secondary helps the pass rush. Maybin’s sacks weren’t coming off of beating his man off the snap, they came several seconds after the play had started.

And he had been here for two completely different defensive systems and couldn’t get on the field in either one. I don’t understand at all what drafting has to do with the skill of our coaches. With Maybin it seems pretty simple…he is successful in a different system because it is a different system with different personnel. That indicates absolutely nothing about how much our coaches failed to get the “best” out of our players.

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Nov 29, 2011 12:15 PM EST up reply actions  

yea i agree with stetzwebs

Maybin is 225, he can only play on passing situations, otherwise he is a huge liability against the run. Although we have 0 pass rush, I wouldn’t want him. Next year when OTs know what he is about he will be done. His only move is speed which isnt enough in the NFL.

Fitzmagic

by tomcs on Nov 29, 2011 5:14 PM EST up reply actions  

He also hasn’t really faced anyone good. He has the benefit of having good people around him. Hence, the people that can actually block focus on said good people and not Maybin.

by NordicBillsfan on Nov 29, 2011 5:28 PM EST up reply actions  

A few disagreements

1. “In fact” is two words.

2. Pouha was the 88th pick in the draft and went through two coaching changes, including one after his rookie season. Troup was the 41st pick of this regime. I think it’s fair to say that the expectations are different, even early in their careers. Yes, Troup may eventually turn out to be a player, but he should have produced already.

3. And tying into that, we need to get the young players on the field. Look what happens when Maybin finally plays. I think it was grossly negligent to not play Maybin last year when the team was 0-8, no matter how bad the run defense was. The Jackson injury is fortunate from that perspective, in that we’ll get to see Spiller before it’s too late.

by usuo mojinga on Nov 29, 2011 11:06 AM EST reply actions  

Forgot one

4. Big Ben came from the MAC. So did Dan LeFevour, and he put up crazy numbers there. He hasn’t been heard from since. I don’t think the team needs to look for a developmental quarterback. Take a potential star (one of the top five – Luck, Barkley, Jones, Griffin or Tannehill), or wait until next year.

by usuo mojinga on Nov 29, 2011 11:09 AM EST up reply actions  

wut is your point?

if ben is successful, doesnt mean every qb from MAC will be successful… that does not mean you dont take a chance on a qb from MAC anymore…. how is this even an argument?

and this game showed, fitz has more in him and right now we dont need to draft a qb in the 1st round… i just wanted to see fitz perform once against Rex and he did it… i am good to give him more time now… i only want to draft a developmental qb….

and why are you including tannehill?

by statcruncher on Nov 29, 2011 11:39 AM EST up reply actions  

I was responding to this line: “if not, he would go in the 1st round with the production.” Where you produce matters.

Fitz looked good, and I’m inclined to pass on a QB at this point. But I wouldn’t make a decision on one game. If Griffin is around in the first, I would seriously consider him. If he’s not, then it’s moot.

And I included Tannehill because Kiper and McShay have him in the first round now. I’ve never seen him play myself.

by usuo mojinga on Nov 29, 2011 12:11 PM EST up reply actions  

i dont know why no one is mentioning darron thomas… i think the blaine gabbert this is going to happen with him… if darron thomas declares, he would become an immediate first round prospect… only thing, i think he is better than gabbert and has better pocket presence than robert griffin…

i mentioned griffin last year and i was shot down because he played in baylor… but this year i think he showed he doesnt have the pocket presence yet… i would go for him if he falls to the 3rd round…

by statcruncher on Nov 29, 2011 12:43 PM EST up reply actions  

Are you seeing anything that mentions him as a third-rounder?

by usuo mojinga on Nov 29, 2011 1:47 PM EST up reply actions  

fans can expect whatever they want… fans on average are dumb…

whether you are a 1st round pick or 7th round, it takes time to develop… some develop soon some develop slow…

by statcruncher on Nov 29, 2011 11:35 AM EST up reply actions  

Not sure what you mean by this – how long did it take Von Miller to develop?

by usuo mojinga on Nov 29, 2011 12:08 PM EST up reply actions  

not everyone is von miller

by statcruncher on Nov 29, 2011 12:41 PM EST up reply actions  

every year theres maybe 10(? even thats kinda pushing it) rookies who come into the league and are truly pro-ready. the other several hundred take varied amounts of time- usually in the 2-3 range- to truly get up to speed with the pros

and as stat said above- fans are usually quite dumb. fans by and large live completely in the moment with no grasp of the future (cough, broncos fans).

im not saying troups gonna be a stud. im saying we dont know yet, and that he very well could be in time

by boomsauce on Nov 29, 2011 4:10 PM EST up reply actions  

There’s a chance Troup turns into a player – and I hope he does – but the odds are not great, and even the best-case scenario at this point includes no contribution in his first two seasons.

I know Miller is the exception. I was responding to statcruncher’s statement that “whether you are a 1st round pick or 7th round, it takes time to develop.”

by usuo mojinga on Nov 29, 2011 7:26 PM EST up reply actions  

Rec's

Nice post.

i think there are two things to think there are a few things to think about in terms of Maybin. One is whether the organization was just unwilling to turn a top 15 pick into a niche player. So was there pressure from higher up like Nix or Overdorf or Wilson to basically say cya, you’ve busted here, maybe you can be useful but we aren’t interested in salvaging our top picks as 8 plays a game types.

Second is whether the defensive coaching staff simply didnt know how to make him useful, even in a limited role.

Finally, there is a big question of whether Maybin was willing to do the things here to be effective. He got a lot of flack for not being able to contribute on special teams even. He also cut got by the Jets. So it may well be all that finally woke him up. As annoying as it is (and I think it says a lot about Maybin as a player — i.e. not mentally strong) he might not have been capable of ever filling this role on the Bills.

I have low expectations. But high hopes.

by greysquirrel on Nov 29, 2011 1:21 PM EST reply actions  

Anyone who says these are just coverage sacks and maybin is a bust is being ignorant, jealous and envious.

For all his production he still doesn’t see the field that often. If we had an all-pro CB he might have been useful here. Just looking at his stat line is ignorant.

As for random notes:

Jack Del Rio is unemployed. Maybe he could be useful as a DC or another positional coach.

by NordicBillsfan on Nov 29, 2011 1:49 PM EST reply actions  

I was waiting for someone to put up a post on this
Jack Del Rio is unemployed. Maybe he could be useful as a DC or another positional coach.

If the stash doesn’t want the job, Del Rio might be a good hire. Is he strictly a 4-3 guy?

"Do not repeat the tactics which have gained you one victory, but let your methods be regulated by the infinite variety of circumstances." - Sun Tzu

If you ask a question you don't want an answer to, expect an answer you don't want to hear.

by Joe P. on Nov 29, 2011 6:28 PM EST up reply actions  

I think it took maybin being cut twice to finally get his act together

Good for him sucks because we spent a high pick on him but we shouldn’t dwell on it

2011 author-mod pick'em -poz
I'll knock the bieber out of brady - arthur moats @dabody52
2011 -adopted offensive player roscoe parrish(IR) david nelson
2011-adopted defensive player arthur moats

by Gpluehri on Nov 29, 2011 2:37 PM EST via mobile reply actions  

I watched the game on Rewind and thought Spiller did fine. He is coming along. I am not ready to call him a bust.

Oh, hey, how about McKelvin’s play on ST? He actually looked decent on ST as opposed to CB. Unfortunately, another high draft pick – all for a decent ST player.

Give a monkey a typewriter and infinite time, and he’ll eventually release Maybin. -- stetzwebs
No one circles the waiver wire like the Buffalo Bills!

by thefourwinds on Nov 29, 2011 3:44 PM EST reply actions  

rec’d. very good post.
thank you for saying that about troup. for a couple weeks now ive seen him getting slammed everywhere and i dont understand it. being hurt in his second season does not make him a bust. relax people. him and carrington were always more developmental than ‘pro ready’ type draft picks. still know way to be sure what those guys are made of yet

i dont want a vernon gholston circus. i want a young stud (or two or three) who can actually play. have to consider the idea that besides the impressive physical attributes, that the guy simply stinks at football

by boomsauce on Nov 29, 2011 4:02 PM EST reply actions  

good post

i agree, i am happy they finally went toe to toe with jets….

this game is still SO MENTAL…….

never forget it…………

by simonpure on Nov 29, 2011 4:53 PM EST reply actions  

Excellent Post!

But I still cannot stand Maybin! We gave him enough chances in Buffalo and he never delivered. He robbed the bank at the Ralph and never contributed a dime!
And we could have had a Brian Cushing or Orakpo. I will never defend the busts we drafted, even if he does contribute for another team.

by BuffaloWhiner on Nov 29, 2011 7:04 PM EST reply actions  

Good points Statcrucher.

Especially about Fitz and Spiller.

Fitz was very productive against one of the best defensive backfields in the NFL.

These last few games will give Spiller a lot of confidence and he will come back a new man next year.

"There is not a loser in this room." Marv Levy.

by SERGEANT MAJOR THOR on Nov 29, 2011 7:38 PM EST reply actions  

Good Insight

I like and agree with all of your points and thought they were very insightful. I certainly tend to be “glass half full” when it comes to the Bill’s so I am actually feeling good about them going forward. I feel like they have a coach that can compete X’s and O’s wise with the other coaches and as a matter of fact- can most times out coach them. Ialso realized the Bill’s had at times 5 rookies out there on defense and although there was some coverage errors – those are all correctable. Searcy, Sheppard, Williams, Dareus and Rodgers all seem like they are players. I also thought that the offensive line played decently. They do have some depth there now. They are also building depth at Receiver. Good article.

by buffalobob1568 on Nov 29, 2011 7:53 PM EST reply actions  

Troup

I think you make some really good points.

I’m really worried about Troup’s back. I think he could be really good for us, I think he plays well and has got a fantastic attitude. But lower back problems are horrendous and doctors don’t know anything about them. Fingers crossed he can overcome them because he has a really bright future.

Go Bills!! and Go Toup!!

by UKBillsFan on Nov 30, 2011 8:09 AM EST reply actions  

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