OLB spot. Who's the better option?

by Fernando brazil on Dec 1, 2011 12:38 PM EST

I was thinking about what we could do about the OLB spot in the next off-season. Sure, draft one with our first round pick looks very likely, but maybe we will have a top 10 pick and for now i don't think Upshaw or any of the other options are worth be picked that high. That bring us the free agents options.

I like Mathias Kiwanuka of the Giants, he has the size, the skill set and is very athletic. He could play very well in our hybrid schemes.

Another option i think could be good is Anthony Spencer. He's a former first round pick from the Cowboys and is playing very well this year. He has a very good size to be our OLB too, and is not old. What worries me is the fact that he played his entire career opposite DeMarcus Ware, so, maybe he should have better stats at this time in his career. Maybe just like the Falcons signed Edwards from the Vikings and he's not playing at the level they expected ( played opposite Jared Allen in Minnetsota), that will be the case with Spencer.

We will have the option of give another shot to Merriman too, sure he wasen't the same from San Diego days, but i think he was doing well for us before the injury.

I think i'm missing some good names here, please tell me another options and your thoughts, thanks!

Poll

What OLB you think we need to sign when the FA begins?

Mathias Kiwanuka - Giants

122 votes

Anthony Spencer - Cowboys

24 votes

Keep Merriman

61 votes

Other ( tell me who and why)

12 votes

219 votes | Poll has closed

Just another great fan opinion shared on the pages of BuffaloRumblings.com.

Tweet Comment 56 comments | 1 recs |

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Comments

Stick to the game, rebuild using the draft.

Stick to the game plan building this team, draft the players you need or pick players from practice squads throughout the league, only use free agency to pick up 2nd string or backup players to add depth to this team. So far the Bills and GM Nix are successful using this scheme to rebuild this franchise. This was the way Bill Polian and Marv Levy built the BIlls in the late 80’s and early 90’s. All of these players mentioned to fill the OLB spot are good players that need an opportunity to start in the NFL.

by Anthony7 on Dec 1, 2011 4:26 PM EST reply actions 1 recs

This was the way Bill Polian and Marv Levy built the BIlls in the late 80’s and early 90’s.

True, but additional pieces were needed via free agency like Cornelius Bennett and Bryce Paup.

by snaves1027 on Dec 1, 2011 4:37 PM EST up reply actions

Paup was a FA...

but Biscuit was a trade… a big one in fact.. 3 teams involved, and considered the trade of the decade…

Optimistic??? Of course I am!! I'm a Bills fan, and as of right now, we are undefeated on the regular season!!!
Things are truly looking up!!!

by Cinga on Dec 1, 2011 8:39 PM EST up reply actions

yeah, the majority of players

will be drafted, but like this year, we signed Barnett ( who is very good) and re-signed Florence ( who wasen’t drafted for us). Last year it was Dwan Edwards, who continues to be a starter. I think we will need to sign at least one starter to play OLB because we really need two good ones to have a good pass rush. Kelsey will be serviceable until the rookie can start. I don’t think Merriman can be counted, it’s sad but true.

by Fernando brazil on Dec 1, 2011 5:00 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs

exactly

sign a vet, and draft a good pass-rusher. play em both on passing downs.

by dgrid on Dec 1, 2011 7:14 PM EST up reply actions

Free Agency did not exist as we know it in the Late 80's, so beware of comparisons

by BobDH on Dec 3, 2011 9:45 AM EST up reply actions

there may not be, he’s something special

by dgrid on Dec 1, 2011 7:15 PM EST up reply actions

There definitely isn’t. Miller is going to end the season with the most sacks for a rookie since Dwight Freeney or Jevon Kearse, or maybe even finish with more than either one of them did.

Either way, if there was a Miller in this draft, he’d go 10 picks before the Bills were on the clock.

"You mean @TWHITNER. It’s how he prefers to be referenced." - Jon Harrington

by kaisertown on Dec 1, 2011 7:50 PM EST up reply actions

I realize there is no von miller type LB in this next draft..There isnt a LB in the next draft thats a proven pass rusher...just dont see us improving our pass rush unless we find some free agent....

by touchdownsyndrome on Dec 1, 2011 8:41 PM EST via mobile up reply actions

Some OLB Draft Options

Courtney Upshaw, Alabama
Brandon Jenkins, Florida State
Vinny Curry, Marshall
Frank Alexander, Oklahoma

Though none of them have nearly the hype or upside Von Miller had a year ago, they will all probably be drafter in the first 2 rounds of next years draft.

by l3uddyh011y on Dec 3, 2011 3:23 PM EST up reply actions

the hype will come, it is early

and at this time last year many considered Miller a reach at #3. Miller’s stock rose considerably after the season ended.

"Ability may get you to the top, but it takes character to keep you there." - John Wooden

"Do not repeat the tactics which have gained you one victory, but let your methods be regulated by the infinite variety of circumstances." - Sun Tzu

by Joe P. on Dec 3, 2011 4:37 PM EST up reply actions

Other........

Draft a stud early!

"There is not a loser in this room." Marv Levy.

by SERGEANT MAJOR THOR on Dec 1, 2011 6:41 PM EST reply actions 2 recs

i say sign Mathias Kiwanuka

then we have more flexibility in the draft, by not needing to draft a OLB to start right now, but one outside of the 1st round that might need a year or so.

"Hardwork beats talent when talent fails to work hard" -Norm Nixon
"Our greatest glory is not in never falling, but in rising every time we fall." -Confucius

by ChewyFL on Dec 1, 2011 6:49 PM EST reply actions

If the Giants are dumb enough to let Kiwanuka go (which I don't think they are) then we have to make him a godfather offer.

And I say we keep Merriman around AND draft an OLB in the first. That should fix our rush.

The Buffalo Bills, finding new and exciting ways to lose since January 8th, 2000.

by CanadianBillsFan on Dec 1, 2011 6:51 PM EST reply actions 1 recs

Kiwanuka is under contract with the Giants through 2012.

"You mean @TWHITNER. It’s how he prefers to be referenced." - Jon Harrington

by kaisertown on Dec 1, 2011 6:53 PM EST reply actions

Your right, It's Umenyiura That's a UFA at the end of the season.

And he’ll go ape sh*t if they franchise him.

The Buffalo Bills, finding new and exciting ways to lose since January 8th, 2000.

by CanadianBillsFan on Dec 1, 2011 6:55 PM EST up reply actions

then I hope they franchise him

I love to see people going ape sh*t :-)

"Ability may get you to the top, but it takes character to keep you there." - John Wooden

"Do not repeat the tactics which have gained you one victory, but let your methods be regulated by the infinite variety of circumstances." - Sun Tzu

by Joe P. on Dec 1, 2011 7:37 PM EST up reply actions

I think that they’ll franchise and trade him.

The Buffalo Bills, finding new and exciting ways to lose since January 8th, 2000.

by CanadianBillsFan on Dec 1, 2011 9:25 PM EST up reply actions

You're sure about that?

I really thinks he will be a FA, but maybe i’m wrong, sorry.
How about Osi? Can he fit here? I watched his game against the Eagles and Peters dominated him. ( I miss Peters, he’s a BEAST!)

by Fernando brazil on Dec 2, 2011 7:17 AM EST up reply actions

I don't understand the problem....

according to some posts over the last few weeks, I assumed good pass rushers were sitting by the phone waiting for us to call…

On a serious note.. No, to any of the Giant potential FA ~~linebackers~~ defensive ends…

Optimistic??? Of course I am!! I'm a Bills fan, and as of right now, we are undefeated on the regular season!!!
Things are truly looking up!!!

by Cinga on Dec 1, 2011 8:49 PM EST reply actions

should have added....

a new DC that knows what he/she (to be PC)is doing would help dramatically!!!!

Optimistic??? Of course I am!! I'm a Bills fan, and as of right now, we are undefeated on the regular season!!!
Things are truly looking up!!!

by Cinga on Dec 1, 2011 8:51 PM EST up reply actions

Not a good 3-4 OLB free agent class

Ahmad Brooks of SF looks to me like the only starting caliber OLB available. And I’m not so sure he’s a pass rushing threat needed to play the Jack.

It’s a good question to ask Fernando. Yet with the players out there as they stand, its my belief we do the following,

1/. Continue to build thru the draft. Even though the first round doesn’t show major talent likely for pass rushing starved teams, later rounds could prove differently. Of course, this won’t help next seasons chances at getting after the QB since these guys can take longer to develop. That said, we can do something else to fix that. Which leads me to two…

2/. Keep the hybrid defense in full force next year. The Merriman experiment is hanging by a thread. To generate a rush, while also best utilizing the talent we do have (aka Meatball), the 4-3 looks like a logical conclusion. Even more so if we promote the stash.

If our FO comes to the same conclusion about the talent available at 3-4 OLB in free agency ( or lack thereof), combined w the lack of top end talent at the same position in this years draft, then the answer I have for your post comes in the form of one player

Mario Williams

The Texans 2012 free agent may be willing to move on. He didn’t exactly light it up this year in his new role. And it may be argued that Wade Philips D was even better without him in there. Mario possesses interesting skills for us from the standpoint that he is a pass rushing threat with experience in both defenses. Making him potentially perfectly suited for our hybrid scheme.

What do u think?

by DJ O on Dec 1, 2011 10:40 PM EST reply actions

Williams may not have lit it up, but all reports show that he loves being a Texan. And as he was getting farther into the season, he was improving with every game. If anyone is going to be a Texan for life, It’s Mario Williams.

Plus I don’t see our FO going after him, or Williams being interested in us on the off chance that he does become a FA. Fact is that if he does become a FA he’d be looking for another 4-3 team, like Julius Peppers did. I mean if your theory is correct, and that he wouldn’t want to be part of a 3-4 D, then why on earth would he sign with a team that is moving toward a 3-4? Hybrid or not, this team will be a full 3-4 D within the next 2 seasons. I just don’t see a player of Mario’s caliber wanting to sign with a team that wont be playing the right D for him.

Sorry to burst your bubble dude, but Mario Williams as a Bill is just never going to happen.

The Buffalo Bills, finding new and exciting ways to lose since January 8th, 2000.

by CanadianBillsFan on Dec 1, 2011 11:00 PM EST up reply actions

Fernando made a good post, and im interested in his thoughts. There is no “bubble” to burst here. It’s merely conjecture to fill idle time.

But since u want to talk about “facts” ’ here goes

Fact is, cash is king. And players will go where the money takes them.
Mario is no Julius Peppers.
Wade Philips did more for Houstons D in one yr then Mario ever did in 5
If Wade doesn’t need Mario, Mario won’t be a Texan, no matter what ur crystal ball tells u
Kyle Williams has a long term contract. There’s no guarantee we’re a 3-4 in 2 years. Just ask Marvin Lewis in Cincy.

If any Texan is a Texan for life, my money’s on Arian Fostor.

by DJ O on Dec 1, 2011 11:50 PM EST up reply actions

Fernado Good Post

Agreed, rec him:) I voted Mathias.

Buffalo Bill's are like family to me. dysfunctional mind you, but after some thought, just like my family:) Go Bill's!

by buffalobacker on Dec 2, 2011 12:17 AM EST up reply actions

I actually think Kiwanuka is an excellent pickup

Even if we drafted a single good pass rusher – say a ten sack guy – we would still be lacking depth.

by lord gloom on Dec 2, 2011 2:56 AM EST up reply actions

thanks

yeah i really think he fits very well.

by Fernando brazil on Dec 2, 2011 7:12 AM EST up reply actions

Thanks DJ

So, Mario Williams to me would be a dream come true. Yeah, i see him like the perfect fit to our hybrid. If Chan tried Carrington and now Spencer Johnson at OLB, Mario looks like the ideal OLB for him. And he surely will be a force rushing the passer in nickel and dime packages.
The problem here is, i think he will not want come to a team who is struggling a long time to make the playoffs. He played his entire career in a team who NEVER made the playoffs, and if he hits the FA, a lot of contenders will be interested in him. Mr. Wilson will need to pay a lot of money to make him consider us.
Ahmah Brooks not looks like a upgrade over Kelsay to me. He’s solid. I’d prefer give Merriman another shot. I really hate the fact we let Spikes go, maybe Merriman can ressurect his career like him.
I think another names available will be Brian Thomas and Calvin Pace of the Jets and Joey Porter of the Cardinals, but they’re all veterans who are in his last lags.
A guy who intrigues me is Marcus Bernard of the Browns. He’s a 4-3 DE but has the size and athletic ability to play OLB. He surely can rush the passer, all he’s doing in limited time is getting sacks with the browns. He’s falling they depth chart because they are playing bigger players in they new 4-3. I think he could be cheap and could be a steal for us.
Thoughts?

by Fernando brazil on Dec 2, 2011 7:11 AM EST up reply actions

Sounds like the type of middle tier player Nix likes to bring in to bridge the gap. Bernard that is. I just don’t know enough about him to tell u he’s better than keeping Merriman.

I guess my ideal is to sign a guy, either 4-3 or 3-4, that would replace Merriman. If he can’t, then I’d rather gonwith youth and spend our free agent dollars elsewhere.

by DJ O on Dec 2, 2011 8:43 PM EST up reply actions

you're options aren't right because..

Keeping Merriman does not prevent from drafting as well as signing a FA.

May I remind everyone that we let SPIKES go after his achiles surgery and he came back very strong. In fact we should have never let him go! Let’s not make the same mistake with a 28year pro-bowl caliber guy. We’ve already paid him and we are still paying him in 2012, all we’d save is 1Mil i thin so its definitely worth seeing this thing through to the end.

Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience

by keysh67 on Dec 2, 2011 12:46 AM EST reply actions

I'm not saying that

I only think if we keep merriman, we will not spend money with a starting caliber OLB in FA. I think ww will surely pick one or two OLB in the draft. Despiste that, we will :
A) keep Merriman
B) sign FA OLB and move on from Merriman

by Fernando brazil on Dec 2, 2011 7:15 AM EST up reply actions

you seem to be saying exactly that...

Whether they keep Merriman or not, they can and should spend the proper amount to get a top notch FA

To me it’s simple math, in the case of Merriman most of the money is spent anyway, out of $4MM I think we owe him $3MM no matter what and it’s only the last $1MM that we could save. So no matter what the money is spent so view it as a $1M flyer that the guy can come back strong.

Either way, go get a top tier guy and pay Merriman $1MM to play the other side. You can never have enough good pass rushers. Von Miller makes Dumerville better and Dummerville makes Miller better.

Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience

by keysh67 on Dec 3, 2011 3:22 PM EST up reply actions

that could be good

but i don’t see we signing a good FA, keeping Merriman and Kelsey and drafting another OLB in the 1st round.
If Merriman be back, we can forget about FA OLB, we will have him and Kelsey, and will draft one or two OLB, one eraly and another in mid rounds.

by Fernando brazil on Dec 3, 2011 3:35 PM EST up reply actions

I dont think thats how it would work

I think Buddy Nix knows Merriman is injury prone and Kelsay is not very good. He knows we need a lot more talent at OLB. But I don’t see him signing a 30 year old OLB.

You are now Watching The Throne.

by tomcs on Dec 3, 2011 5:20 PM EST up reply actions

You are entitled to your opinion.
I just don’t share it. After the debacle this year, I would almost guarantee that Nix is going to address the pass rush issue on this team both through the draft and through FA. The Merriman issue is like background noise, its a no brainer – they are keeping him IMO.

Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience

by keysh67 on Dec 3, 2011 11:46 PM EST up reply actions

Unfortunately...

i cant get excited about this upcoming years FA OLB class. theres noone there that is realistically going to not resign with their team that is any good. obviously anything can happen since its a long ways off but the draft is our best bet.

by Air Compressor on Dec 2, 2011 7:43 AM EST reply actions

As much as it sucks

to say this, because we need a pass rush so bad….but, if we end up picking in the Top 12, we might be able to get a Top 2 Corner, which could give us two stud corners…which would be sweet. I think depending where we pick, I am okay with best player available out of WR, OLB, and CB. I doubt a guy like Blackmon falls, but if he does…..I think you have to take him. This OLB class seems like there are more talent and upside guys as opposed to proven monsters.

by fanick82 on Dec 2, 2011 9:33 AM EST reply actions

McKelvin was a top two corner in his draft year. Ouch.

by WhatGoesAround on Dec 2, 2011 11:35 AM EST via mobile up reply actions

On some boards maybe

But that is that year, this is this year. The CB and WR depth this year are said to be pretty good. The OLB….not as much. I just read one mock that had us take M Floyd in 1st, and B Jenkins in 2nd….I would be down for that personally….although that seems a bit late for Jenkins

by fanick82 on Dec 2, 2011 12:11 PM EST up reply actions

no.....

he was, and is, still the top corner from that draft… not sayin’ much, but overall, it appears ‘08 was really, really, bad for CBs…
and no… I still don’t think DRC is better than McKelvin, and has already peaked…. last year.. While Leo can certainly get much better, and has the drive to do so…

let the bashing commence…

Optimistic??? Of course I am!! I'm a Bills fan, and as of right now, we are undefeated on the regular season!!!
Things are truly looking up!!!

by Cinga on Dec 2, 2011 9:55 PM EST up reply actions

Like you say

Both these guys are probably outperforming what they would do here because of the studs lined up around them. I would be fine with adding one of them, I just think we need to be careful since I don’t see being a stud. But we could use help either way.

I have low expectations. But high hopes.

by greysquirrel on Dec 2, 2011 9:40 AM EST reply actions

who knows what system we'll be in..

If Edwards is removed from his office and Wanstedt is moved up to the DC, we may be moving back to an attacking 4-3 defense. In that case, the need for a pass rushing OLB goes way down, and the need for a rushing DE climbs…

by sfg79 on Dec 2, 2011 9:51 AM EST reply actions

Nix made it clear

this is a transition to a 3-4, they will not get back to a 4-3. Also, i think any 3-4 OLB they will target will be a good 4-3 DE too, because we play so much 4 man fronts in passing downs.

by Fernando brazil on Dec 2, 2011 10:11 AM EST up reply actions

so are there any stud 4-3 DE's in this yrs draft?

by dgrid on Dec 2, 2011 11:39 AM EST up reply actions

not too many traditional DE’s i believe. most are OLB type but could prob bulk up and move to DE if given the right coaching…which i dont believe we have with edwards. not sure who our d line coach is but edwards coaches the LB’s and… well… we see how thats turning out…

by Air Compressor on Dec 2, 2011 12:58 PM EST up reply actions

nice link about Upshaw

http://www.mockingthedraft.com/2011/12/2/2605862/film-breakdown-of-courtney-upshaw

by Fernando brazil on Dec 3, 2011 11:17 AM EST reply actions 1 recs

I don't see how keeping Merriman

prevents us from picking up or drafting a good OLB. He is an injury risk of course so it’d be stupid for them to not have some sort of solid backup plan in place. CHIX has stated they like stacking players on top of players and pass rushers are like pitchers in baseball….you can never have enough of them.

"I promise you, ... When I come back, I'm going to be like a mad dog in a meat house." -Takeo Spikes

by panekattack on Dec 3, 2011 12:43 PM EST reply actions

i'm not saying we will not draft one

i’m only thinking maybe we will use the 1st pick in another position, and pick later a project who will not start right away. In that case we will need at least one veteran to start alongside Kelsey.

by Fernando brazil on Dec 3, 2011 1:02 PM EST up reply actions

I'm guessing we keep Merriman

draft a QB in round 1 OLB in round 2 a WR in round 3 and BPA at different positions from there on out. Of course that could change leading up to the draft depending on who declares whose stock rises and falls etc. I think pass rush is a need but this draft class doesn’t seem too strong on pass rushing OLBs compared to other positions (like WR and QB).

"I promise you, ... When I come back, I'm going to be like a mad dog in a meat house." -Takeo Spikes

by panekattack on Dec 3, 2011 6:57 PM EST up reply actions

The idea is that its doubtful our team pays for a marquee pass rusher if you still have Merriman on the books. Drafting a guy to play is obvious, no one is doubting that strategy. Discussion revolves around the lack of top end pass rushing OLB coming out this year, and what our strategy would be if the draft is as thin at the top as some claim (meaning a starter to play the position next yr is unlikely).

So if its considered a given that the Bills won’t have 2 high priced OLB on the roster -both designed to play the Jack, and the draft is thin at the top, whats the strategy?

by DJ O on Dec 3, 2011 1:03 PM EST up reply actions

I think they keep Merriman

and if a franchise QB is there in round 1 they take him. If not they’ll probably go with Upshaw or a big physical WR (Floyd from ND possibly). Of course things change leading up to the draft players stocks rise and fall, some guys declare some don’t etc. It all depends….nobody was talking about Blaine Gabbert at all last year until he decided to declare then BOOM he’s all of a sudden an early 1st round QB. This year’s OLB crop seems weak IMO. My best guess would be we get either Griffin III, Landry Jones, or Barkley in round 1 a pass rusher, CB, or WR in round 2 and the same again in round 3. From there on out it will be BPA at each position of need. Things always change so it’s hard to predict this so early.

"I promise you, ... When I come back, I'm going to be like a mad dog in a meat house." -Takeo Spikes

by panekattack on Dec 3, 2011 7:03 PM EST up reply actions

Agreed

I think the strategy looks very similar. However, I’m not yet sold on Landry or Barkley. For Gailey, something just tells me he won’t want a first round QB unless he’s a mobile. While Landry and Barkley both posses skills to play at the next level, I’m not so sure they are that much more talented then Brandan Wheeden, who you could get possibly in the 4th or later.

Love RG3.

Deep WR class means we can get great talent in either of the next two rounds as well.

by DJ O on Dec 3, 2011 8:44 PM EST up reply actions

Yea i think if RG3 is available (like Cam Newton)

they will take him. However I think Barkley is more “NFL ready” and could play right away and play well. But we dont need that because of Fitz and I think RG3 has a higher ceiling than Barkley.

You are now Watching The Throne.

by tomcs on Dec 3, 2011 9:17 PM EST up reply actions