Merry Christmas! What Buffalo might get for Christmas...
by Der Jaeger on Dec 23, 2011 9:44 AM EST
Email
PrintLate last night, watching the Colts, it occurred to me that Indy might not get the first overall pick. What if the Colts win a very winable game next week vs. Jacksonville, and the Rams lose out? St. Louis would have the first overall pick, and lots of money committed to their franchise QB, Sam Bradford.
Buddy Nix trades three first round picks to St. Louis, and Andrew Luck is on the Bills. The other two teams in competition, the Dolphins and Redskins, won't finish so much higher than Buffalo, if higher at all, in the draft to compel the Rams to trade with them. And Buffalo has be out of the playoffs for a decade, and are a better bet to draft higher in 2013 and 2014.
What do you think?
Just another great fan opinion shared on the pages of BuffaloRumblings.com.
50 comments
|
1 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
My vote
This is a supreme no-brainer. Trade for Luck, if the Colts win and the Rams lose out.
Though I think Luck is better in a smash-mouth offense, where he’s throwing to tight ends, than in a spread formation based offense. I wouldn’t mind seeing Gailey shift gears, draft some tight ends, and go back to his Pittsburgh run-attack days.
Re-starting the official Buffalo "Draft a quarterback in the First Round in 2012" campaign.
by Der Jaeger on Dec 23, 2011 9:53 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
I put up a fan post a while ago stating something similar. Personally i’d mortgage some of the future on him. I’d have no issues if the Bills did this. They could even pay more and it wouldn’t bother me.
by J2 on Dec 23, 2011 9:55 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
J2, Der Jaeger, everyone else behind getting our Franchise QB this year
I can’t even express how much I agree with you. I would be ok with the Bills doing ANYTHING to get a guy like Andrew Luck. Don’t care what the price. If the Bills somehow got Luck, I would instantly be re-energized in my Buffalo Bills fan-dom. I can’t even imagine what a feeling it would be…I’m getting excited just thinking about it.
How can One Bills Drive really not see the crazy need for a new, talented young QB….someone the entire fanbase could rally around, get excited for, be relevant again in the NFL? Do they really not see how, if you take a chance on a first round QB and hit, how your entire Franchise can be rejuvenated? It’s the ultimate silver bullet. Hitting on a Franchise QB is one of the only ways to counteract the effects of a so-so run organization. Not even Ralph Wilson himself could keep a guy like Peyton Manning from making the playoffs every year.
I’m just so ready for something new. Why can’t One Bills Drive see this?
"WHEN THE WAGON BLASTER TAKES OFF dont try to get in. THE SPACESES ARE LIMITED FOR WINNING ATTITUDE GODZILLA IS COMING GET READY" - abayarde
by StroudFanClub on Dec 23, 2011 11:48 AM EST up reply actions
and yet what if his career goes the way of Fran Tarkenton, great QB magic to watch but many of his teams were a joke. Not agreeing or disagreeing with your point just a what if.
Why I'm a optimistic Bills fan:
The road that is built in hope is more pleasant to the traveler than the road built in despair, even though they both lead to the same destination.
- Marion Zimmer Bradley
I fairly sure that Tarkenton played in some Super Bowls
Re-starting the official Buffalo "Draft a quarterback in the First Round in 2012" campaign.
I'd mortgage the ENTIRE near future
Without a franchise QB, what good is the near future? If we don’t take a QB ASAP, I don’t care if we draft more CB’s, LB’s, DT’s and so on, since it won’t matter all that much.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Dec 23, 2011 3:21 PM EST up reply actions 6 recs
Exactly, and rec'd
Re-starting the official Buffalo "Draft a quarterback in the First Round in 2012" campaign.
that’s where i’m at – I really don’t care about getting more anything – get Luck – give up whatever it takes. I’m sick of the crap QBs and junk product OBD puts out consistently.
by J2 on Dec 23, 2011 3:40 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
This, this, and more of this
rec’d
Sure, Fitz aced the Wonderlic test...but he does not pass the Eyeball test...
by MonStarr_716 on Dec 24, 2011 8:53 AM EST up reply actions
although
IF we can build a good defense and give Fitz another good outside WR, we can be a good team. And if Fitz cannot lead this good team into the playoffs, (and deep into the playoffs), then we can draft the QB next year.
You are now Watching The Throne.
Ta Da
The Anti- QB faction. It never fails. Epic.
If you didn't like my last post wait till you read the next! :) Until we draft/acquire franchise QB we'll be setting records for losing soon!
by buffalobacker on Dec 24, 2011 8:23 PM EST up reply actions
no I dont care either way
3 days ago I really wanted RG3 but thats looking very unlikely now. I’m just realistic.
You are now Watching The Throne.
I voted NO, because I don't think CHIX will want to pay that high a price for Luck, especially
with RG3 (a QB that may be more appealing to Chan) and Tannehill (your favorite QB not named Luck) still out there. Why would they pay that high a price for Luck, who like you said, doesn’t really fit the system Chan wants to run. Chan has been trying to run this same basic system since his days in Pittsburgh…..I don’t see him changing now. There is a better chance of trading up with a team like the Vikes for GR3 or Tannehill. That would cost us much less. Finally, all of this assumes the Bills are taking a QB. I wish I could believe that. My guess is a WR or OLB.
"Ability may get you to the top, but it takes character to keep you there." - John Wooden
"Do not repeat the tactics which have gained you one victory, but let your methods be regulated by the infinite variety of circumstances." - Sun Tzu
Would you pass on Luck for RGIII?
If you had a shot at Luck, who’s the most talented QB since Peyton Manning to enter the NFL, would you pass because the price was too steep and there was an alternative?
Gailey has run a power system in the past, and would change if Luck was the QB.
Re-starting the official Buffalo "Draft a quarterback in the First Round in 2012" campaign.
Yes I would .....if I were Nix
what good is Luck if they want RG3 and his skill set? Remember what happened to Maybin? Do we really want Luck to be our QB version of Maybin? Ok….that is a bit of a stretch, but you get the point. If Luck is the only franchise QB in this draft then fine…get him. But I’m not convinced Luck is the only QB in this draft worth taking. In your opinion, what are the chances that each of the top 3 QBs can play in the NFL at a franchise level? For example, I would put Luck at 90%, RG3 at 80%, and Tannehill at I have no freaking clue right now. Is the 10% difference worth 2 first round picks, especially if RG3 is the QB with the skill set that Chan really wants?
"Ability may get you to the top, but it takes character to keep you there." - John Wooden
"Do not repeat the tactics which have gained you one victory, but let your methods be regulated by the infinite variety of circumstances." - Sun Tzu
You're paying for bust factor
Luck, at worst, is Matt Ryan. At best, he’s Manning.
RGIII at best could be unreal, but he’s also got a larger bust factor.
Re-starting the official Buffalo "Draft a quarterback in the First Round in 2012" campaign.
see....I'm not so sure
What makes RG3’s bust factor higher than Luck’s. I agree it is higher, just not sure how much higher and why?
"Ability may get you to the top, but it takes character to keep you there." - John Wooden
"Do not repeat the tactics which have gained you one victory, but let your methods be regulated by the infinite variety of circumstances." - Sun Tzu
Because we've never seen him run a pro style offense and read progressions
That’s hardly saying he can’t do it, we just haven’t seen him do it. We don’t know.
We’ve all seen Luck run Harbaugh’s offense, which he’s using in San Francisco. I’ll change my low end. Luck’s floor is the current version of Alex Smith, who’s doing quite well.
Luck’s the no-brainer. High end, you get Peyton Manning, low end you get the current Alex Smith.
RGIII at high end is a bigger Vick, but at the low end he might not be a viable starter.
Luck’s the safer pick.
Re-starting the official Buffalo "Draft a quarterback in the First Round in 2012" campaign.
I can see that.......so is it better to
risk 3 first round picks on Alex Smith, or risk one first round pick plus whatever it would take to move up to get him…let’s just say a first round swap plus a second round pick for a complete bust? Given how CHIX say they feel about Fitz, I can’t see them going with Luck. The RG3 option seem the more acceptable risk because it won’t hamstring their efforts to rebuild the rest of the team.
"Ability may get you to the top, but it takes character to keep you there." - John Wooden
"Do not repeat the tactics which have gained you one victory, but let your methods be regulated by the infinite variety of circumstances." - Sun Tzu
I don't think OBD can handle another bust QB
The effects might be devestating. If they draft RGIII, and make him the future face of the franchise, and he busts, getting fans to come back to the team might be too hard. That’s part of the reason I think Nix is being deliberate with his QB selection.
Andrew Luck’s floor is Alex Smith. That doesn’t mean that he’ll do that. It just means that if he busts, the team at least gets a functional QB.
And, to throw a monkey wrench in the conversation, I’d take Tannehill over RGIII if both were available. RGIII is electric, but pocket passer win, and that’s what Tannehill is.
Re-starting the official Buffalo "Draft a quarterback in the First Round in 2012" campaign.
The risk with Tannehill is his lack of experience.....
didn’t CHIX say they wanted a 4 year starter, which is why they were high on Ponder?
"Ability may get you to the top, but it takes character to keep you there." - John Wooden
"Do not repeat the tactics which have gained you one victory, but let your methods be regulated by the infinite variety of circumstances." - Sun Tzu
FO
They were high, but on what is a good question. We needed to get franchise QB last yr. Now Ralph shows his love for Fitz, not good sign.
If you didn't like my last post wait till you read the next! :) Until we draft/acquire franchise QB we'll be setting records for losing soon!
by buffalobacker on Dec 24, 2011 8:31 PM EST up reply actions
I've been a huge proponent of putting pieces around Fitz to see if he can
And shoring up the defense by getting some sort of pass rusher which would limit the amount of points the Bills need to score in order to get a win. It is, however, a no-brainer to grab Andrew Luck if at all possible.
I still don’t think this scenario is likely and Chan/Nix seem much more likely to pursue Griffin at a much lower cost if that could be done. The other option is for the front office to make a serious grab for Peyton Maning if (when?) the Colts go to trade him in the event they Luck out.
Where u guys going to be send. You will not need prayers you do not need your soul. You will be in a place not even the. Undead. Walk.
-abayarde
by APhoenixDestiny on Dec 23, 2011 10:19 AM EST up reply actions
should be "can succeed" in the opening line
Where u guys going to be send. You will not need prayers you do not need your soul. You will be in a place not even the. Undead. Walk.
-abayarde
by APhoenixDestiny on Dec 23, 2011 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
Three first round picks for Luck
With the D that we have how many games do you really think Luck can win for us. Not enough to get us to the Super Bowl. He would be going into his fourth year before we had another 1st round pick.
Peyton Manning was winning a ton of games with a 2-14 or 3-13 roster
Tom Brady wins games every year with a bad defense.
Andrew Luck could win with this defense.
Re-starting the official Buffalo "Draft a quarterback in the First Round in 2012" campaign.
by Der Jaeger on Dec 23, 2011 2:21 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If u can trade up for the best player in the draft you do it. Other teams will be looking to do the same thing though, and I think Dan SNyder may be willing to throw in 25% of the Redskins to get Luck if he wants them, So I don’t think it will ever Happen.
We have an elite pass rushing LB who likes to conserve electrcity-Munchausen
by cencalclassics on Dec 23, 2011 10:25 AM EST reply actions
Totally agree.
I think the Redskins are the prime candidate to make this kind of a move.
Where u guys going to be send. You will not need prayers you do not need your soul. You will be in a place not even the. Undead. Walk.
-abayarde
by APhoenixDestiny on Dec 23, 2011 11:41 AM EST up reply actions
without a doubt i could snyder doing this and giving them orakpo, 2 future 1st rounders plus this years and throw in santana moss too while your at it
by Air Compressor on Dec 23, 2011 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
Forgot to mention, the only way I can see this happen is if Nix goes big in free agency to compensate for the loss of picks.
We have an elite pass rushing LB who likes to conserve electrcity-Munchausen
by cencalclassics on Dec 23, 2011 10:27 AM EST reply actions
I’m still a Fitzy supporter, and think with another good WR (Vincent Jackson / Alshon Jeffery / etc) our offense could be good, but I still dream of trading up for Luck or Griffin.
I could get behind 3 first round picks, as long as that was the spending limit. If we trade 3 first round picks, we need our 2nd round picks.
Da'Jon McKnight - WR (Minnesota) - 6'3'' 211Lbs. (5th Round)
Courtney Upshaw - Alabama - the answer at OLB
Vinny Curry - Marshall - the other answer at OLB.
Both can be gotten, whether Vinny Curry falls to the 2nd or we trade up in the last 1/3 of the 1st Round. Snagging one or both will help our defense immensely.
by NordicBillsfan on Dec 23, 2011 10:42 AM EST reply actions
i agree and im sure most people would trade up to get luck. i would like to see fitz with real wr talent though not just stevie. especially a stud TE that buffalo has lacked since dare i say reimersma who wasnt elite by any means. all good offenses have a great TE. chandler is ok but doesnt seem to have the ability to take his game to the next level….hes def an improvement though
by Air Compressor on Dec 23, 2011 11:13 AM EST up reply actions
Jaeg
Any chance you’ll write an in depth article on Ryan Tannehill? I haven’t watched him at all this year, and I know you’ve been plugging for him, so it would be nice to get a perspective from somebody that’s watched his games.
Da'Jon McKnight - WR (Minnesota) - 6'3'' 211Lbs. (5th Round)
Courtney Upshaw - Alabama - the answer at OLB
Vinny Curry - Marshall - the other answer at OLB.
Both can be gotten, whether Vinny Curry falls to the 2nd or we trade up in the last 1/3 of the 1st Round. Snagging one or both will help our defense immensely.
by NordicBillsfan on Dec 23, 2011 10:55 AM EST reply actions
I'll get to that sometime after the holidays
He’s the real deal.
Re-starting the official Buffalo "Draft a quarterback in the First Round in 2012" campaign.
Not a chance
The ransom for Luck will be ridiculas. I think a more realistic situation in your scenario being St Louis trading Bradford, not Luck.
Sam Bradford has regressed this year. Not sure if it’s due to a new coordinator/system, o line injuries, surrounding lack of talent or his own lack of talent. He obviously has potential (Bradford). However, from the limited time I’ve seen him play he seemed like he had poor mechanics with his foot work, locked on to WRs, and was inaccurate. There have been many QBs that once traded or released, went on to have productive careers.
Bradford would cost much less (perhaps 3rd rounder this year, 2nd round next yr). Allowing us to build depth, while having a QB to groom (yes, I think Sam could use a year behind Ryan. The kid looks shell shocked and is closing in on the Carr effect of too many sacks permanently affecting his play). Besides, no one in their right mind would ever trade Luck. The best QB prospect to come out since one John Elway.
Great Xmas day dream DJ. Wish it weren’t so far fetched, trust me. But its never coming true. Sorry to bah humbug.
No chance that St. Louis trades Bradford
He’s the recipient of the last big #1 contract, and therefore, is untradeable. Nobody is going to give St. Louis a bounty to take on his contract, and without getting value, St. Louis is unlikely to trade him.
Re-starting the official Buffalo "Draft a quarterback in the First Round in 2012" campaign.
What if Luck goes to Minnesota, would you trade for Ponder if unable to get Luck?
Why I'm a optimistic Bills fan:
The road that is built in hope is more pleasant to the traveler than the road built in despair, even though they both lead to the same destination.
- Marion Zimmer Bradley
I don't know
I really like Ponder. I’m just not sure he’s got the arm for November and December in RWS.
Re-starting the official Buffalo "Draft a quarterback in the First Round in 2012" campaign.
I’m not a cap guru but I’d be willing to bet there is a way to make it happen, whether that requires a contract restructure on Sam’s part, or cash thrown in by the Rams. It can be done.
OK
If you didn't like my last post wait till you read the next! :) Until we draft/acquire franchise QB we'll be setting records for losing soon!
by buffalobacker on Dec 24, 2011 8:36 PM EST up reply actions
The Price Tag Is Much Higher...
…for Luck. With all the hype, the fact Barkley is staying in school, and Landry Jones is likely to as well, only increases Luck’s value to a team willing to part with the chance of drafting him.
I mean, the Falcons gave up FIVE picks (two #1s) to get the second best receiver in the draft. The Bills would have to pony up at least a half-dozen picks (3 #1s, probably a 2, and 3 and/or 4s) to have the rights to Luck…that’s an enormous price tag to a team that is so dramatically short on athletes and pure talent guys.
I think Luck is a phenomenal prospect, don’t get me wrong. But Luck throwing to Donald Jones and Naaman Roosevelt does not instill fear throughout the league. Even when the Colts got Manning, they already had Harrison, Meadows, and Tarik Glenn and then proceeded to hit on an incredible series of first round picks: Wayne, Freeney, Edge, Dallas Clark…the Bills wouldn’t get that chance, b/c they wouldn’t have a top pick for years.
Although they do seem to draft better in Rounds 5-7 than in the top 2, so perhaps you’re on to something…
Luck throwing to Stevie Johnson, David Nelson, Donald Jones, Scott Chandler & possibly Marcus Easley
Seems not too far from guys that Peyton Manning have turned into legit NFL players, such as Pierre Garcon and Austin Collie. Freaking Pierre Garcon and Austin Collie! (letting that sink in for a bit….)
You really think our WRs are that much less talented than Wayne, Clark, Garcon and Collie? I think the biggest difference is a good/great tight end…Dallas Clark is the main difference, IMO.
I mean, Indy has some bigger names on defense, such as Freeney and Mathis, and at one time, Bob Sanders, but everyone else on that defense is nothing special at all. Seriously. I almost can’t believe they were making the playoffs every year the past years with that kind of roster. Manning’s influence on that team is undeniable, IMO.
"WHEN THE WAGON BLASTER TAKES OFF dont try to get in. THE SPACESES ARE LIMITED FOR WINNING ATTITUDE GODZILLA IS COMING GET READY" - abayarde
by StroudFanClub on Dec 23, 2011 3:34 PM EST up reply actions
Manning’s influence on that team is undeniable
On NFL network they were going back and forth on how Peyton should be an MVP candidate – while ridiculous as it may sound – it’s true.
For years people have said that without Manning that’s a 3 win ball club – well…… proofs now in the pudding
by J2 on Dec 23, 2011 3:41 PM EST up reply actions
Yep, it's incredible.
I always thought people were exaggerating saying they’d say the Colts were a 3 win team without Manning….but it turns out it’s true! It’s just such an eye-opener as to the impact of good QB play. For people to still fight it is just crazy, IMO.
"WHEN THE WAGON BLASTER TAKES OFF dont try to get in. THE SPACESES ARE LIMITED FOR WINNING ATTITUDE GODZILLA IS COMING GET READY" - abayarde
by StroudFanClub on Dec 23, 2011 3:54 PM EST up reply actions
One Point
Yes, I agree that their defense was nothing special. But it was designed to not be something special – they put the bulk of their personnel efforts into offense. So with Freeney – they had some decent LBs too, plus guys that performed above their level like Raheem Brock – Mathis, Sanders, they could definitely get after the QB. They almost dared you to run.
But I completely disagree on the caliber of their WRs. Garcon is having a pretty strong year for a guy playing with a couple of smucks at QB. Wayne and Harrison are both going to go down as all-time greats, although who knows how their numbers were inflated by playing with Manning. Stevie Johnson – and I love ‘em – is going to be one of those guys like a Wesley Walker…20 years from now, you think “Yeah, I remember that guy! He was pretty good!” and then you forget about him again for another 5 years. That might because of his talent level, or the guys around him, but I don’t see him as AJ Green or Calvin Johnson or someone like that. And I think Austin Collie and/or Brandon Stokley compare very favorably to guys like Nelson and Jones. Hell, I don’t think Jones belongs anywhere on the field except special teams…even on this team! Nelson is the kind of guy Manning could get 60 catches and 6-7 TDs, which is great…for a 4th receiver.
Look, I’m not pooh-poohing Luck to BFLO. I’m just saying the comparison to Peyton’s situation, and the outcome, is probably not an apples to apples comparison. The price tag could really leave Luck as a guy who labors for a bad team for a long time. And that’s not factoring in a) if Luck can actually play at a level that Manning/Brees/Rodgers/Brady play at – he might, but we don’t know, and b) if BFLO seems willing to make the move, does he say, “Uh, no thanks. Palo Alto is looking better and better!”
Just think this is way out of the realm of Ralph’s possibility.
I agree
but I do see OBD’s thoughts. If we draft a guy like Alshon Jeffery (WR) in the first, then build the defense in the draft (2 OlBs, and a CB early). Next year the pieces will be in place for a potential playoff team, and if Fitz cant lead us there (or at least come very close), we can always draft a QB next year. Maybe Barkley?
You are now Watching The Throne.
Every year
There seems to be a sentiment that “there’s always next year” when it come to drafting a QB. Eventually, THIS year has to be THE year. This organization has put off selecting a legitimate franchise quarterback for far too long. Theres always some excuse, like the fact that we’ve never really bottomed out (7-9, 7-9, 7-9) and were missing out on elite prospects or they are committed to developing Trent Edwards, and now it seems like the organization has committed to ride out the Fitzpatrick experiment when its become obvious that Fitz will never be more than what he is. Im sick of it, the next true franchise QB for the Bills needs to be selected ASAP. The problem is I dont know how they are going to make that happen, or if they are even legitimately considering it.
STAN UP MY BUFFALO NATION OUR DESTINY AWAITS AND WE WILL GO TO THE END OF THE LAND AND FIGHT FOR ALL THATS BEEN DENIED TO US - abayarde, who else?
by kfisk214 on Dec 23, 2011 6:35 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I know and I don't disagree with you
But really if we build a good defense next year, have some good WRs, and Fitz still does bad then we know to draft a QB. While I cannot stand how inaccurate Fitz is at times, I unfortunately think we might have to wait. Especially with Barkley going out, unless we make a trade up to get Luck or RG3, or draft Tannehill, but none of those options seem likely especially with recent comments made.
You are now Watching The Throne.
I understand what you're saying
At some point, Buffalo has to start developing a future elite franchise starter. The longer they wait, the longer it will be until that QB is playing in Buffalo.
It’s much sounder to get a guy like Luck or Tannehill now, and then pick up receivers for him later. There are impact receivers every year, and they tend to develop quickly.
Re-starting the official Buffalo "Draft a quarterback in the First Round in 2012" campaign.
by Der Jaeger on Dec 23, 2011 10:17 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah
Like said above, this franchise is committed already:) To what is the question or problem.
If you didn't like my last post wait till you read the next! :) Until we draft/acquire franchise QB we'll be setting records for losing soon!
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Buffalo Rumblings
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
SBNation.com Recent Stories
In Association With
Shutdown Corner - NFL - Yahoo! Sports
- Detroit Lions DT Nick Fairley arrested again; now has more NFL arrests than NFL sacks
- Former high-school star Brian Banks does serious time on trumped-up charge, now hopes for an NFL shot
- Former ‘idiot kicker’ Mike Vanderjagt in trouble after accosting junior-high heckler
- Adrian Peterson blows teammates away in footraces; appears to be on the mend
- UPDATE: Charlie Sheen didn’t buy Lawrence Taylor’s Super Bowl ring
