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Why QB in the first round is right move

Most people here agree Ryan Fitzpatrick will never be an elite QB in this league. He isn't going to carry this team deep into the playoffs, yet alone to a Superbowl. I like Fitz- he is a good leader and is capable of playing at a high level. The problem is that when the run game isn't clicking and the defense shuts down the short stuff he falls apart. He hasn't shown the ability to put a team on his back and make things happen like championship caliber QB's do.

Many are calling for the Bills to draft a pass rusher, corner, or receiver. They believe that that, with a better supporting cast, this team can make the big game with Fitz behind center. I think passing on a QB, even if we aren't 100% sold, would be the wrong move.

Teams that make the playoffs consistently and win Superbowl's don't have average QB's. Think about the last 10 seasons- the teams that are always there have elite QB's. Patriots with Brady. Colts with Manning. Saints with Brees. Eagles with McNabb. Packers will continue to be strong as long as Rodgers is there. The list goes on. Yes- there are exceptions. The Ravens seem to make playoffs every year with a dominant defense. The Jets made consecutive championship games with Sanchez. Bears rode Urlacher and company to the big game with Grossman under center. Problem is the season always seems to end because that QB is holding them back when the games matter most.

To win a SB like the Ravens did you don't just need a top 8 defense- you need the best one. The Bills are at the very least 3 players away from having that. We need a guy like Suggs to rush the passer, a top 15 CB, and at least one more impact player at minimum while keeping the rest of the team in tact. This franchise isn't going to make big splashes in FA, so the chances of landing an elite pass rusher outside the draft are minimal.

Let's say we sign Tracey Porter and Robert Meachem like a lot of people want. I think it's unlikely, but for we'll go with it. That's a great start. Then we draft a guy like Aldon Smith. Sure, that would make our defense much better and maybe even good enough to make a playoff spot. But could we stop teams like NO, GB, NE, or SD? Slow them down a little maybe, but there still putting up 30 on us. You trust Fitz to match those numbers? I don't.

Now were stuck in the position were we need to go get a new QB... Good ones don't exactly fall into your lap very often, so then you have to draft one. You think one will be sitting there at the end of the first round that will be a franchise guy? Now your stuck in a spot where you have a solid team everywhere except the most important position.

Now picture the same FA acquisitions, but we draft a QB in the first then an Akeem Ayers type in the second. The team may be good enough for playoffs next season, but probably not. Either way you have another year to add pieces and you have a QB who can be ready to step in when the time comes that the team is ready to make a run.

I know what your worried about- what if the QB is a bust? Yea, it's a 50:50 chance. But it's no riskier than taking the gamble on a pass rusher, and a good QB can do far much for your team. With a run game like ours a QB that can consistently complete passes over 10 yards this offense could be dangerous. It would also help the D out. Our defense ranked very poorly and certainly had their share of poor performances; But how many times during the losing streak did the offense leave them out to dry by not sustaining drives and giving them time to rest? In the Bills 6 wins, we averaged 22 first downs and 30:30 TOP. In the 10 losses, 16 first downs and 26:20 TOP. Not to say the D wasn't playing at a lower level, but the offense certainly wasn't helping them out much.

People also argue that there won't be a QB worthy of taking at #10 on the board. Problem is that if you wait until the 2nd round for a signal caller the chance you draft a bust more than doubles. People reach on QB's- it's the nature of the draft. If the Bills like a guy and don't see any major red flags than they need to go for it. He doesn't need to be Luck or RG3- if Gailey can get productivity out of Fitz imagine what he can do with a guy who has some real talent and a year on the bench. Even if he is a Joe Flacco or Josh Freeman type I think Gailey could get him playing at a higher level than Fitz could consistently achieve. It's worth the risk.

I get the arguments. We need a pass rusher desperately. We need another legitimate talent at WR. We need to improve our secondary. I can't argue with any of that. Problem is, it's what the Bills have been doing for almost a decade with the same result. Since Losman was drafted every year we pass on "risky" QB's and settle for mediocrity despite having talented players. It takes a lot of good drafting to build up a supporting cast. You can't draft a defense in one pick. You can, however, draft a QB that can carry an entire team on his back. I won't pretend I'm a scout, I don't know exactly how good Tannenhill or Jones will be. I can only promise you that this team needs to find a long term solution at QB and until we take our chances on a guy we will always be 2-3 years from being a serious contender.

Just another great fan opinion shared on the pages of BuffaloRumblings.com.

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might be the right or wrong move

It all depends on who is available when they pick and who they have high on their board. Buddy et al have showed last year when they picked dareus and williams that they will not pick a qb of the future if they don’t believe in the qb options available to them. I’m ok with this as I don’t want them picking a qb that don’t rate because they feel obligated to. It has to be the right guy at the right time not any guy right now.

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by Let's Go Buffalo (UK) on Jan 6, 2012 1:41 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

THANK YOU!

Nix has made this point over and over again. People keep saying “roll the dice” and do it “even if it is a 50-50%” chance. This is EXACTLY the sort of thinking Nix has rejected. His point, made over and over again, is that the Bills are a talent thin team and he has to hit on every pick, particularly when those picks are in the top ten. Add to the talent base, “stack players on top of players.” He makes the same points over and over again. Reaching for players, rolling the dice, drafting for perceived need rather than taking quality is exactly what has gotten the team into the hideous mess it was in.

That’s why this is a multi-year rebuild effort. He knows and FINALLY the organization understands that drafting is not a year to year chance to roll the dice but rather is a multi-year project. Maybe I’m one of the few (it certainly seems that way), but I, for one, am very eager to see another draft like the last two. No doubt, I’ll be shaking my head after certain picks, like I was with Spiller in ’10 or Williams in ’11, but looking back on it now, I realize Nix knows a lot more than I do and a lot more than people who work up mock drafts or hand out draft grades in the days following a draft.

by CGoetz on Jan 6, 2012 5:17 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

but I, for one, am very eager to see another draft like the last two

The 2010 draft wasn’t that good. Troup and Carrington haven’t done much. Easly has yet to play a regular season game in 2 years. Moats hasn’t done much except for a big hit on. If CJ hadn’t started looking like an NFL RB this year, the 2010 draft would be a complete bust so far,

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by The Buffalo Kid on Jan 6, 2012 10:40 PM EST up reply actions  

Even if the Bills don’t take a 1st or 2nd round QB, I’d like them to do their homework and bring in a guy who has serious potential. Go find us a diamond in the rough: super accurate, great competitor. You never know.

by JapanJohn on Jan 6, 2012 9:46 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

Disagree

There is usually only one or two guys (QBs) in each draft worthy of that high first round ranking. With all the holes to be filled on defense, making a risky grab at #10 for someone who will more than likely not live up to expectations isn’t a good idea. Just keep working on the defense, build depth on both sides of the ball, and see how far Fitz can take us.

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by RedStickBillsFan on Jan 6, 2012 9:48 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

I was just thinking about something

somewhat off-topic, but I wonder why the Raiders went so all-in for Carson Palmer instead of tanking and getting a young, less expensive option in the draft. They gave up so much for him and they could have finished bad enough to get a stud QB.

Silly.

But yes. Always go QB when you don’t have one who can win games on his own.

"Go check on the ribs!"

by TheAfghanTwilight on Jan 6, 2012 10:17 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

Always go QB when you don’t have one who can win games on his own.

If every team followed this philosophy, there might be 25 quarterbacks going in the first round this year

by nickjangles on Jan 6, 2012 12:07 PM EST up reply actions   3 recs

Rec'd.

That is sig-worthy

.

When the job is finished no one remembers how long it took, just how well it was performed.

by Buffalo for Eternity on Jan 6, 2012 12:31 PM EST up reply actions  

Well, Buffalo needs to do this. I don’t know how many more games I can watch Fitzpatrick struggle. He’s been solved and i’m not sure Chan Gailey has a good idea how to best utilize him outside of that cute little offense he used the first part of the year.

It’s going to take a HUGE amount of improvement out of Fitzpatrick for me to believe he can ever be the right QB for this team.

"Go check on the ribs!"

by TheAfghanTwilight on Jan 6, 2012 3:43 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

Here's my thought on drafting a QB

It’s a Five year plan, right? If that is indeed the case, then Chix doesn’t Have to draft a QB until year four. We would have to assume they would want the new guy to have one year to learn the system. At this time in the NFL two years on the bench for your QB of the future is just not acceptable to anyone. SO, unless one falls in their lap that they love (Cam Newton last year might have gone, maybe RG3 this year?) they will continue to build the rest of the team. this scenario gives them one more year before they have to “reach”. It also explains Fitz’s contract. Thoughts?

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by BigEasyBillsKrewe on Jan 6, 2012 12:06 PM EST reply actions  

Our first rounder needs to step on the field next season and make an immediate impact and a QB will NOT do that, sorry. there are no worthy 1st round Qbs other then luck and griffen. and if they do draft one in the 1st it would probably be tanninhill and that would set this franchise back another 3-4 years, which we dont need. the bills found a average to above average QB that they believe can win games and move forward toward a playoff push. if we do draft a qb this year it wont be till the 4th round or later, mark my words

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 12:13 PM EST reply actions  

Only if you're in it for the short term

Long-term viability and having a franchise QB go hand-in-hand.

Re-starting the official Buffalo "Draft a quarterback in the First Round in 2012" campaign.

by Der Jaeger on Jan 6, 2012 12:35 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

do you want to wait another 4 years till playoffs?
if we build a dominate defence we could plug in any qb and still win.
look at the texans, they have the best d in the nfl right now, when shaub got hurt they kept winning!

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 1:34 PM EST up reply actions  

building a dominant defense...

Is a lot easier said than done- you need to hit on a lot of consecutive draft picks and make some big acquisitions. Houston has a good defense- not the best. They are also probably rated higher than they should because there offense can run the ball and keep them off the field as often… Regardless, the quality teams in the playoffs who have franchise QB’s will still put up 30 on them- then lets see how TJ Yates does.

Good defenses get you to the playoffs, franchise QB’s win you Superbowls.

by astrazz2 on Jan 6, 2012 1:55 PM EST up reply actions  

defence wins championships!

they dont just say it to say it, its true!

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 1:57 PM EST up reply actions  

No, it’s not.

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Jan 6, 2012 2:06 PM EST up reply actions  

Ravens every year are playoff bound because of their defence not flacco, the 49ers because of thier defence, the texans because of their defence, the bengals because of thier defence. the steelers because of thier defence, the giants because of their defence(passrush) when the jets went to the afc championship because of thier defence, denver because of what…their defence
it is simple!

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 2:13 PM EST up reply actions  

You want a good stat, 9 of the top 10 teams in QB rating made the playoffs this year. Dallas was the one team that didn’t. A team with an elite QB (GB, NO, NE, PIT) will most likely win the Super Bowl this year, just like a team with an elite QB almost always wins it all.

Of course you need a good defense to win a championship, but you also need a top offense and you don’t have a top offense without a top QB.

Enough with being satisfied with trying to make the playoffs. Bills fans need to realize that this team needs to keep looking for an elite QB and while they’re doing that, they also need to be building the defense. The goal has to Super Bowl.

"You mean @TWHITNER. It’s how he prefers to be referenced." - Jon Harrington

by kaisertown on Jan 6, 2012 2:21 PM EST up reply actions   3 recs

Before injures

we had a top 5 offence and i agree we will add a good WR this offeseason that will help the offseason and yes i understand that the teams you stated have a franchise qb, however i do think one of them ( rothisberger) puts up good qb stats and really benifits from having a great defence year in and year out, so i would take him off that list. that leaves 3 teams or Elite QBS and 3 out of 12 playoff teams isnt a good stat. being said i acknowledge the ultimate goal is a SB, but OUR goal and more realistic goal as buffalo bills is making the playoffs for the first time since 99. just like the lions this year, they had a very successful season even if they dont win the SB and their coach has said that. we need to make the playoffs and win games ASAP and get into the playoffs ASAP before thinking SB

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 2:30 PM EST up reply actions  

IMO, the offense was already in a tailspin anyways. The unit fell apart against the Jets. Looked even worse against Dallas, where Wood was injured. And was terrible again against Miami, where Jackson was hurt. Also, considering how good Spiller has been, was the loss of Jackson that much of a reason why the O started to fall apart? Who else has the team lost of offense? Bell who is hurt all the time anyways, some mediocre WRs, a guard like Urbik? Injuries are part of the game and I think they’re only one small reason why the offense bottomed out.

The Steelers are the perfect example of how important a franchise QB is. They won four SBs with Bradshaw and then went 20+ years without one. They had some great defenses with those Tomczak/Stewart and Neil O’Donnell teams, but the QB was never good enough. Then they hit on Roethlisberger in the first round, have won a pair of SBs with him and probably win at least one more before he retires. If they fail to replace him with another top 5-10 QB, they’ll probably fail to win another Super Bowl for 20 years or whenever they find another great player at the position.

"You mean @TWHITNER. It’s how he prefers to be referenced." - Jon Harrington

by kaisertown on Jan 6, 2012 3:45 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

What the point

of just making the playoffs? Yeah, if the Bills make the playoffs and lose their first or second game, I would be more than happy with the season. But the organization and the players shouldnt be. The organization shouldnt be looking to build a team that can make one run into the playoffs and be happy about it. And your Lions example? They made the playoffs this year solely because of how well Stafford played. Take Stafford out of the equation and thats a team thats right on par with the Bills.

by kfisk214 on Jan 6, 2012 8:27 PM EST up reply actions  

QB rating is correlation, not causation

I believe QB rating is not the element that caused these teams entrance into the playoffs, but more a biproduct of being a good team. My reason for saying this is because Alex Smith and the 49ers were 8th in QB rating. Are we to believe that Alex Smith is really the 8th best QB in the league.

If you have a team with a dominant defense, a dominant running game, and a QB who doesn’t make mistakes you will win games. And, subsequently, your QB rating will be very high.

Fitz had 800 more passing yards, 6 more touchdowns, and a better completion percentage than Smith. However, Fitz failed in interceptions. Which sent his QB rating spiraling downward.

Why did he have all those interceptions? Part of it is because of his own deficiencies. However, another BIG reason is because he was playing from behind, compensating for a horrible defense, and throwing to receivers who wouldn’t make the most playoff teams’ practice squads.

Get a better defense and better receivers, and Fitz’ QB rating will be just as good as Smith.

by tarvismonroe on Jan 6, 2012 9:42 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

However, another BIG reason is because he was playing from behind, compensating for a horrible defense

The top-tier QBs in the league can compensate for the defense. Why shouldn’t we strive to find one? And why shouldn’t we start the process now, so that when the defense is built up and producing, we have our franchise QB ready to take the reins?

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Jan 6, 2012 10:47 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Fitz had 800 more passing yards, 6 more touchdowns, and a better completion percentage than Smith. However, Fitz failed in interceptions. Which sent his QB rating spiraling downward.

But at the end of the day, Fitz averaged 6.7 yards per pass and Smith had a 7.1 yards per pass number. Alex Smith and the 49ers are the outlier of the group with only 5 INTs this year. The other teams all had excellent QB ratings because they had excellent QB play. Let’s not even count the 49ers in that group and say that 8 of the best 10 pass offenses made the playoffs instead, it’d be more accurate, with San Diego coming in with the 11th best QB rating in the NFL.

The goal shouldn’t be to have an Alex Smith 49ers team. The goal should be to have an actual Super Bowl contending team. That requires a defense like the 49ers and a much better QB than Fitz.

"You mean @TWHITNER. It’s how he prefers to be referenced." - Jon Harrington

by kaisertown on Jan 6, 2012 11:15 PM EST up reply actions  

and...

How many Suberbowls do the Ravens have to show for all those playoff appearances? You taking the 49er’s to win it all this year? Bengals? Texans?

Yea, you can make the playoffs if your defense is good. But when your in the playoffs and playing against the best offenses in the league you need to be able to score points. That’s why the Ravens never make it and the Jets lost the last two years. Eventually having a below average QB will hold you back.

by astrazz2 on Jan 6, 2012 2:26 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

i agree but fitz is not below average.

and in this WEIRD YEAR." the year of the QB" i do agree and see a team with a horrible d (saints GB NE) winning it. but having said that last year GB Had a good top 10 d, NO when they won had great D, when the pats were winning those super bowls they had a great D, and now they cant win a playoff game! and its shown in 2 out of the “best” 3 teams, a Great QB does not need to come from the 1st round and the only 1 in rogers out of those 3 almost wasnt drafted in the first at 24th overall!

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 2:34 PM EST up reply actions  

The Texans started to suck after Shaub went down, the Bengals have a very good young QB, the Steelers and Giants have established systems with franchise QBs. Defenses may help you get to the playoffs, but they do not win championships, which is what you said. I’d be willing to bet anyone that the 49ers, Texans, or Ravens (unless Flacco really steps up) do not win it this year because they don’t have a franchise guy calling the snaps.

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Jan 6, 2012 4:12 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Our first rounder needs to step on the field next season and make an immediate impact

Why? This is a rebuild…if our first rounder sits for two years and then becomes a perennial pro-bowler, who will care that he sat for two years?

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Jan 6, 2012 2:05 PM EST up reply actions  

this is the 3rd year in this system and of chix! last year of “rebuild” even though we have been rebuilding since 2000, you rebuild your first 2 seasons and the 3rd is doing time, time to make the playoffs, not take a step back and wait 3 to 4 more years and then BOOM CHAN AND NIX ARE FIRED FOR NOT MAKING THE PLAYOFFS AND MORE “REBUILDING!” THEY WILL NOT DRAFT A QB IN THE FIRST ROUND GET IT THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULLS

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 2:15 PM EST up reply actions  

Why even bother rebuilding if the goal is only to go 9-7 and lose in the playoffs to a team with a better QB?

"You mean @TWHITNER. It’s how he prefers to be referenced." - Jon Harrington

by kaisertown on Jan 6, 2012 2:22 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

rec'd

I feel like the concept of being a playoff team long term, not just for a season, is being ignored. We have been trying to build up our team and skate by on below average QB’s for years with the same result. Build your team to win a championship and playoff appearances will follow, not vice versa.

by astrazz2 on Jan 6, 2012 2:29 PM EST up reply actions   3 recs

and building a great dominate defence is a major key in that! we have a good QB! not elite but good! the ravens and steelers alwasy in playoffs because of thier D!

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 2:36 PM EST up reply actions  

And have you looked at their defensive line-ups?

Harrison, Polamalu, Timmons, Farrior, Hampton…
Suggs, Reed, Lewis, Johnston, Ngata….

See a trend? They each have at least 5 ELITE players on their defense. Buffalo has 1 (KW), potentially 2 if Dareus plays to expectations. Not to say we don’t have other quality starters, but we are a major overhaul away from having that kind of a defense.

You don’t get player like that in FA without spending a ton of money, so you use the draft. So your banking the success of our team on drafting 2-3 all pro defenders? and that is somehow a short term plan, so you think were getting them all in this draft and next?

I’ll take my 25-50% chance on a QB any day of the week and use the rest of my picks to build a supporting cast that doesn’t need to carry a team by itself, but can win a championship with the right guy behind center.

by astrazz2 on Jan 6, 2012 2:44 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Spot on

The odds of hitting on a QB are better than the odds of hitting 3 ELITE defenders to make that kind of D.

Then there is the fact the Bills are also more likely to actually resign said QB after his rookie deal than to sign 3 top dollar ELITE defenders. We’ve had a habit of not resigning any elite defensive talent in the last 10 – 15 years. (Winfield, Clements, Pat Williams).

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by Will G on Jan 6, 2012 4:53 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

QB in the First Round is the WRONG Move

Taking a QB in the first round totally ignores the fact that the D struggles to stop teams from piling up yard and points. The lack of a pass rush leaves little to prevent teams from having time to pass. The inability to stop the run does little to stop the clock. And the inconsistent secondary needs some fixing. Yes some of these issues will be fixed by the return of K. Williams, but the D still has some room to improve. Teams having a harder time to move the ball score fewer points, which in turn will help fitz out by putting less pressure on him to keep pace in a scoring race.

A first round pick on QB will only increase the pressure on Fitz. The moment he has a bad game, the cries for our shiny new plaything (the rookie QB) will start. That sure sounds like stability to me. I’ll take another year of Fitz over another QB controversy here in Buffalo. Sure Fitz can be streaky, but this was his first full season as “The Guy,” Let’s stick it out.

Address more holes on the team (like a pass rusher). Build some more depth. Look at a QB next season. Barkley, and Jones will be coming out. There are opportunities for other guys in the college to have solid years and improve the QB class next season.

by NDbuffalo on Jan 6, 2012 12:53 PM EST reply actions   2 recs

last year...

It was wait for Luck/Barkley/Jones…. When does it end? If we improve the team in the offense and fill some needs were going to be drafting even higher next year… Exactly when are we supposed to get this QB next year? Are we trading up for him? or just saying damn the best two aren’t here lets pass this year, again….

by astrazz2 on Jan 6, 2012 1:50 PM EST up reply actions  

Total Offense Rank: 14
Total Defense Rank: 26

I think it is clear where our needs are. Fitz is a more than serviceable QB. Sure we may draft later, but Aaron Rodgers was landed what? 24th? Just because you are drafting later in the first round doesn’t mean that you aren’t going to land a franchise QB, and just because you are early doesn’t mean you are going to. Ryan Leaf. Matt Leinhart. Jamarcus Russell. etc. etc.

Get the D better. More depth across the board. Make opposing teams work harder for points. Take some pressure off of Fitz. QB isn’t a position of need at the moment.

by NDbuffalo on Jan 6, 2012 5:06 PM EST up reply actions  

QB isn’t a position of need at the moment.

You can’t draft for the moment though. Obviously taking a defensive player makes our team better next than a QB does next season. But, the goal needs to be to win a SB down the road, not to draft for the moment.

"You mean @TWHITNER. It’s how he prefers to be referenced." - Jon Harrington

by kaisertown on Jan 6, 2012 7:54 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Ryan Fitzpatrick is the best QB weve had in Buffalo in a decade!

he has played better then any other QB in the last decade in buffalo!
OUR OFFENCE IS RATED 15TH AND IN THE TOP HALF OF THE LEAGUE, OUR DEFENCE IS 24TH? AND NOW YOU PEOPLE WANT TO IMPROVE THE QB? IF OUR DEFENCE WAS 15TH WE WOULD BE TALKING ABOUT THE PLAYOFF MATCH UP THIS WEEK! YOU PEOPLE DONT GET IT

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 2:00 PM EST reply actions  

What does this matter when every QB we’ve had in the decade has been abysmal?

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Jan 6, 2012 2:07 PM EST up reply actions  

EXACALLY THEY HAVE BEEN HORRIFIC

now we have a decent QB and showed he can win against very good teams when healthy and people want him out! It makes no sense!

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 2:17 PM EST up reply actions  

When did I say I wanted Fitz out?

I said I like him. I’m fine with him starting another two years. But show me one team who consistently makes the playoffs with a “decent” QB. And that excludes the Ravens, because we don’t have Suggs, Lewis, Reed, Johnson, Ngata, Landry, etc… Were more than a few good draft picks away from having a defense like that…

It’s not about making the playoffs next year, its about building a team than can make them consistently and contend for a Superbowl.

by astrazz2 on Jan 6, 2012 2:37 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I DO BELIEVE WE ARE GETTING THERE!

Dareus is our NGata and dareus has shown this year he could be a potenital HOF, next to him is williams who everyone here in buffalo knows he is a true gamer and brings it and a great talent, Bryd is on his way to be a pro bowler year in and year out, our yound CBs Williams and Rogers have all the potential in the world ( i would like to see a claborn or kirkpatrick tho to add deph) and we have a great talent in sheppard and a good leader in barnett. we are a dominate pass rusher away like suggs! because kelsey is a average to good DE not OLB.

The ravens are still drafting defencive players in their 1st rounds( last year jimmy smith) with the exception of Oher who is a great LT but our O line is good and adress the offensive part after (torry smith, flacco) boldin was a FA and there good TES were not 1st rounders
BUILD A DEFENCE OUR OFFENCE IS GOOD

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 2:46 PM EST up reply actions  

The ravens are still drafting defencive players in their 1st rounds( last year jimmy smith) with the exception of Oher who is a great LT but our O line is good and adress the offensive part after (torry smith, flacco) boldin was a FA and there good TES were not 1st rounders

You’re going to want to look at the Ravens draft history. They’ve been a very balanced team from a draft perspective. They do not draft defense heavy. They’ve taken four first round defensive players in the last decade. They’ve used half as many first round picks as that on QBs alone. If you look at the first and second round, Baltimore has taken four offensive lineman and six defensive players since 2005 (2 of each in the first round). Also, they traded for Boldin using draft picks, they didn’t sign him in FA.

"You mean @TWHITNER. It’s how he prefers to be referenced." - Jon Harrington

by kaisertown on Jan 6, 2012 3:40 PM EST up reply actions  

ok well stated (forgot boldin was a trade not a FA)

Other then OL 1st rounders. how many of thier offensive first rounders have been great like they are supose to be and are impactful today?

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 3:46 PM EST up reply actions  

How is it relevant that they made some bust picks on offense? Should Buffalo not chose defense because they’ve got a good offense thanks to fewer busts while trying to take defensive players?

Ozzie Newsome is a great GM who understands that balance wins championships. That you need a great QB, some players around him and a great defense to win it all. He drafts accordingly.

We should be looking at the intentions of top NFL executives. They draft QBs near the top constantly because it’s the smart strategy. It’s the most likely way to win a championship.

"You mean @TWHITNER. It’s how he prefers to be referenced." - Jon Harrington

by kaisertown on Jan 6, 2012 11:31 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

too much faith my friend...

Two years ago this conversation would be about Maybin, McKelvin, and Whitner… Not saying I don’t think these players are going to be good, but counting on 3 rookies to become elite players is wishful thinking… I would like to believe so- but I hope the front office is using a bit more logic than that

by astrazz2 on Jan 6, 2012 5:06 PM EST up reply actions  

He’s really not that good. If you think back to those wins, it’s when Fred Jackson was on FIRE, and the defense was forcing turnovers and creating points.

Fitzpatrick’s shortcomings were well hidden as a result and he was afforded better chances at fooling defenses.

Teams have long figured out how to stop that short stuff Gailey loves to run. Now Fitz has to throw deep and that’s like asking a nun to marry you.

"Go check on the ribs!"

by TheAfghanTwilight on Jan 6, 2012 3:45 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

My point is that we, as a fan base, have skewed expectations. He’s not good. He’s not bad, per se, but he’s not good, and if there’s an upgrade available at #10, I want him.

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Jan 6, 2012 4:15 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

LISTEN

THE 10TH PICK OVERALL IS VERY TOUGH! IF WE MISS THIS DRAFT PICK (ESPICALLY WITH A QB) WILL SET THIS FRANCHISE BACK 5 MORE YEARS AND MIGHT NOT BE THE BUFFALO BILLS ANYMORE! THIS PICK IS EVEN MORE IMPORTANT THEN LAST YEARS 3RD OVERALL. WE ARE SITTING IN A SPOT THAT ARE BASICALLY BOOM OR BUST. WE DRAFTED MCKELVIN 10TH OVERALL, UNLESS HE PICKS IT UP HES A BUST, WE DRAFTED A CERTIN OLB WITH THE 11TH PICK OVERALL HUGE BUST! THIS PICK NEEDS TO BE ALMOST A GARENTEED GOOD PLAYER AND I DONT SEE A QB THAT WILL BE THERE AT 10 WITH THAT POTENTIAL

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 2:40 PM EST reply actions  

Missing on the 1st round pick won’t set us back 5 years, especially if we hit on rounds 2, 3, and 4. Is it important to hit? Yes, but not the end of the team as we know it if we miss.

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Jan 6, 2012 4:15 PM EST up reply actions  

Why? Is Fitz going to miraculously get better? We need a QB to replace him regardless…the sooner we go after one, the sooner we can move on.

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Jan 6, 2012 5:00 PM EST up reply actions  

If I’m mistaken he finished ranked 18th in QBR… That isn’t top half of the league

by astrazz2 on Jan 6, 2012 6:07 PM EST up reply actions  

in addition we are ranking fitz without a true #1 reciever

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 6:27 PM EST up reply actions  

You say that Fitz is good and yet you don’t want to call Stevie a #1 WR? Odd.

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Jan 6, 2012 6:32 PM EST up reply actions  

Very odd indeed

In my opinion Stevie is more a top 16 WR than Fitz is a top 16 QB

It's close to Midnight, somethings lurking in the backfield. Under the Bright Lights he cuts so fast it almost stops your heart. You start to scream, but he's in the End Zone before you make it. You're Paralysed.

Cause it's CJ Spiller - all Frickin Night, and no-ones gonna save you from the Beast that just struck ya. You know it's CJ Spiller ! You're fighting for your life against the Spiller Thriller tonight !

by Will G on Jan 6, 2012 7:24 PM EST up reply actions   3 recs

In this offence he is great but as of a top wr i dont think he is dominate. i dont think he can go to another team and put up the numbers he puts up hear. therefore he is not a top wide out

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 9:54 PM EST up reply actions  

Errr

and you think Fitz could go to another team and dominate in their system ???

Funny, because I see a number of teams that Stevie could go to and duplicate or even better his current numbers. Great route runners who get seperation and open on a regular basis tend to succeed in most systems. Not as certain re streaky up and down QBs who miss targets fairly often.

I like Fitz, but cannot consider him a better QB than Stevie is a WR.

It's close to Midnight, somethings lurking in the backfield. Under the Bright Lights he cuts so fast it almost stops your heart. You start to scream, but he's in the End Zone before you make it. You're Paralysed.

Cause it's CJ Spiller - all Frickin Night, and no-ones gonna save you from the Beast that just struck ya. You know it's CJ Spiller ! You're fighting for your life against the Spiller Thriller tonight !

by Will G on Jan 7, 2012 12:16 AM EST up reply actions  

However i think what they both admit is true. Fitzy makes stevie the WR he is and stevie makes Fitzy the QB he is.

what came first the chicken or the egg

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 7, 2012 1:29 PM EST up reply actions  

so basically you wrote off our starting QB to be a bad QB?

I didn’t say he was bad. I said he needed to be upgraded.

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Jan 6, 2012 6:33 PM EST up reply actions  

True

However missing on the first repeatedly in recent times has set us back. At least our last 2 first rounders finally seem to not be misses ! A step in the right direction when compared to ones under previous regimes: Maybin , McKelvin, McCargo, Lynch (Lynch was o.k. but is obviously no longer here), Whitner, Losman and Lee Evans. Getting 2 goodish players who are no longer here (Lynch and Evans), 1 OK player (Whitner) and 4 1st round duds (McKelvin, Maybin, McCargo and Whitner) HAS set this franchise back a number of years – we’ve already seen it.

Sure, your point about talent still being there in rounds 2 – 5 is valid, however the elite talent is more often found in round 1 and we cannot afford another run of bad first round picks if we ever wish to succeed.

It's close to Midnight, somethings lurking in the backfield. Under the Bright Lights he cuts so fast it almost stops your heart. You start to scream, but he's in the End Zone before you make it. You're Paralysed.

Cause it's CJ Spiller - all Frickin Night, and no-ones gonna save you from the Beast that just struck ya. You know it's CJ Spiller ! You're fighting for your life against the Spiller Thriller tonight !

by Will G on Jan 6, 2012 5:05 PM EST up reply actions  

i do remember one top 5 pick that set us back! I was actually at this draft and he has been the biggest bills bust of the last 20 years. Mike Williams!

in addition our 1st rounder the year before and the 2 1st rounders after were not busts (talent wise)

So that one player did set us back

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 5:36 PM EST up reply actions  

Yes, he set us back…a little bit. The fact that we continued to draft like garbage for the next 7 years is what set us back.

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Jan 6, 2012 6:33 PM EST up reply actions  

I do not think Mike Williams set us back 5 years

Sure, he was a crap pick for where he was taken, but there were a stack of early busts in 2002, it was a crap year. Secondly we had Peters playing LT 3 years later and going to the probowl, so how exactly did Mike set us back 5 years whilst sitting onthe bench behind a probowl LT ?

I get he sucked, I get he was a crap pic, but we actually managed to cover that particular gaff fairly quickly (and perhaps luckily) I though.

It's close to Midnight, somethings lurking in the backfield. Under the Bright Lights he cuts so fast it almost stops your heart. You start to scream, but he's in the End Zone before you make it. You're Paralysed.

Cause it's CJ Spiller - all Frickin Night, and no-ones gonna save you from the Beast that just struck ya. You know it's CJ Spiller ! You're fighting for your life against the Spiller Thriller tonight !

by Will G on Jan 7, 2012 12:19 AM EST up reply actions  

come on, peters ( a converted TE) was a fluke and one out of a thousand in how he panned out.

he was a TE when he came to the bills! he even has more TD catches then a WRs on our roster!

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 7, 2012 1:27 PM EST up reply actions  

yeah, no doubt

of course Peters was a fluke and lucky, and I alluded to that in my post. My point was that because we got lucky with the Peters project we were not set back 5 years. You somehow disagree with that ???

It's close to Midnight, somethings lurking in the backfield. Under the Bright Lights he cuts so fast it almost stops your heart. You start to scream, but he's in the End Zone before you make it. You're Paralysed.

Cause it's CJ Spiller - all Frickin Night, and no-ones gonna save you from the Beast that just struck ya. You know it's CJ Spiller ! You're fighting for your life against the Spiller Thriller tonight !

by Will G on Jan 8, 2012 12:07 AM EST up reply actions  

Set us back from what ?

More years of missing the playoffs ??

We’ve already been set back by missed first rounders – Maybin, McKelvin, Whitner, McCargo do these names ring any bells ?

I guess my point here is that it’s not just QB’s that can miss at #10. Some people say – build the D. Sure, there is merit to that, but a QB hit at #10 can get this team to the playoffs where it’s unlikely that the addition of 1 top defender at #10 will get us there (Most people tend to agree we are 3 pieces away from an elite D)

Obviously you take who you feel is likely to help you long term – but if a QB is in that conversation and remotely on par with any D players you have to take a shot on the QB – especially with the new friendlier rookie salaries.

It's close to Midnight, somethings lurking in the backfield. Under the Bright Lights he cuts so fast it almost stops your heart. You start to scream, but he's in the End Zone before you make it. You're Paralysed.

Cause it's CJ Spiller - all Frickin Night, and no-ones gonna save you from the Beast that just struck ya. You know it's CJ Spiller ! You're fighting for your life against the Spiller Thriller tonight !

by Will G on Jan 6, 2012 5:01 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

run of luck

If Luck is that good they got to make an offer, (Jackson and the number 10 pick 2013 2nd rounder).

by Eric L Ellinger on Jan 6, 2012 4:23 PM EST reply actions  

wouldn’t even be close to enough… would probably take a 1st, 2nd, 2013 1st and 2nd, 2014 1st…

by astrazz2 on Jan 6, 2012 5:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Thats likely a tad high.

I could however live with this years #1, next years #1 (which you’d hope to be a lower pick anyway), next years #2 and a good players (say a Kyle Williams or similar). You’d think 2 × 1′s a #2 and a good player would =be getting into the right price range.

It would be unheard of for a team to give up 3 x consecutive #1’s and I seriously doubt anyone would ever give that up. I could however see them giving up 2 × 1′s, a #2 and I guess maybe even a 2014 #2 if necessary.

It's close to Midnight, somethings lurking in the backfield. Under the Bright Lights he cuts so fast it almost stops your heart. You start to scream, but he's in the End Zone before you make it. You're Paralysed.

Cause it's CJ Spiller - all Frickin Night, and no-ones gonna save you from the Beast that just struck ya. You know it's CJ Spiller ! You're fighting for your life against the Spiller Thriller tonight !

by Will G on Jan 6, 2012 5:08 PM EST up reply actions  

just for reference

The Old draft value chart puts the #1 overall pick at about 3000 pts.

Bills- #10- 1300 #42- 480 pts

Picks 10-15: 1300- 1050 16-20: 1000-850 21-32: 800-590

So assuming the team continues to get better it’ll likely take at least two 1st rounders (possibly a 3rd) and 3 2nds and possibly a 3rd. likely more, this is supposed to be “the sure thing.”

I don’t know how this will apply with the new rookie wage scale. values probably changed some because it is less of a risk financially to take a QB or anyone at #1 than it did before.

by NDbuffalo on Jan 6, 2012 5:24 PM EST up reply actions  

This isn’t a normal #1 pick- throw the charts away on this one. Schefter and King both reported the trade would take either a) 3 1st rounder and 2 2nd rounders or b) 4 1st rounders… not a definite number but its based off what they’ve heard from GM’s they both came to similar estimates

by astrazz2 on Jan 6, 2012 6:11 PM EST up reply actions  

huh? the colts would laugh hand hang up the phone.
that aint even close to making them think about it

Its fun to think quarterback, but i think the odds of nix taking one in the first are close to 0%.

by boomsauce on Jan 6, 2012 5:48 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

i think the colts already gave the commish the their draft card

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 5:55 PM EST reply actions  

Because fitz is their guy and they will not draft a QB in the first round. plus they just gave him a contract and it would make the Bills look like complete idiots in the eyes of other nfl teams and fans

They are smart enough to know that there is way bigger holes to address expecially rhe pass rush and the defence and that is more likely draft pick (or a top wr)

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 10:51 PM EST reply actions  

Wow

First comment you made I agree on. Moot point regarding QB RW made up his mind and IMO he paid already for his franchise qb. And sealed that thought with comment regarding upgrading wr and TE’s that could catch comment. I want qb so bad but sadly not my franchise:(

GF Got Log Cabin And Dog. God I miss The Dog. Like I Miss Jim Kelly.

by buffalobacker on Jan 6, 2012 11:07 PM EST up reply actions  

also its kind of like the colts, the Bills are not going to get a QB in the first round and give him that money and then have 2 QBS making alot of money espically when only 1 is on the field at a time!

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 6, 2012 11:11 PM EST up reply actions  

Well

Not so costly signing picks now with new CBA. I just think RW has made a executive decision regarding qb and Fitz is it@!

GF Got Log Cabin And Dog. God I miss The Dog. Like I Miss Jim Kelly.

by buffalobacker on Jan 6, 2012 11:16 PM EST up reply actions  

They were going to the pull the trigger last year if Newton fell to them. Why won’t they this year if they like a guy?

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Jan 7, 2012 12:11 AM EST up reply actions  

You had me until the “Look like idiots in the eyes of other nfl teams” We already do after so many losing seasons, lack of playoffs and bad drafts. Why do you think we are the last stop for any FA’s ??

It's close to Midnight, somethings lurking in the backfield. Under the Bright Lights he cuts so fast it almost stops your heart. You start to scream, but he's in the End Zone before you make it. You're Paralysed.

Cause it's CJ Spiller - all Frickin Night, and no-ones gonna save you from the Beast that just struck ya. You know it's CJ Spiller ! You're fighting for your life against the Spiller Thriller tonight !

by Will G on Jan 7, 2012 12:22 AM EST up reply actions  

If we have a shot at RG3 - take him.

But after Luck and RG3, who both will be gone before the Bills draft most likely, is their a QB worth taking in the first round. Next year we will have Barkely coming out from USC, but the rest of the crop of QB’s can be taken in the later rounds.

There is no guarantee that a great QB will come out of the first round.
Tom Brady was taken in the 6th round. And if I am not mistaken, I don’t believe that Drew Brees was a first rounder either. I think the Bills should take a shot in the later rounds at QB, with either Tannenbaum or Keenum from Houston. Why not?

by BuffaloWhiner on Jan 7, 2012 9:31 AM EST reply actions  

thats what im saying about the later rounds

it would be alot better if we take a shot at russel wilson or keenum in the later rounds but dont waste our top 3 picks on one

Ay Ay Ay Ayyyyy

by BuffaloBillsBigestFan on Jan 7, 2012 1:25 PM EST up reply actions  

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