The Bills Not-Need Needs

by J2 on Feb 14, 2012 1:01 PM EST

There are 3 positions that the Bills probably won't look to upgrade this off season but really should, one way or the other. They are positions that are typically referred to as o.k. or "set" by management and the fan base alike but I still feel adequate upgrades should be looked at.

There are more pressing needs on the roster than these positions but if an upgrade were available I think the Bills should make a move on these positions with equal footing as other positions.

QB - The first Not-Need need is Ryan Fitzpatrick and Tyler Thigpen. Both of them could be upgraded and should be looked at to be upgraded. Problem is I don't think OBD is going to do that. There are plenty here that are o.k. with that and i'm fine with that sentiment as far as Fitzpatrick goes (I suppose, I understand it at least) but Thigpen might be the worst backup in the NFL. I'd love a change there and would love even more a move to grab an early QB - one way or the other.

SS - George Wilson has him some followers doesn't he? People love the guy. Hey, I like him too and his background. I specifically like his penchant for "knack" plays. What I don't like about him is watching other teams skill players out run his angles because he's slower than molasses.

He's a good player but we could get a faster/younger upgrade here. OBD should look at it's options but i'm not sure it will. Searcy would also be an option there.

CB - When you look at CB you see we just signed Florence to a contract extension, have a former 1st rounder in McKelvin, a 2nd rounder last year in Williams and a young budding playing in Rodgers and think that this position might not be a need. Hopefully OBD continues to thinks it is a need (like bringing in Routt) because this position is a mess.

Florence is slower than slow, McKelvin is dumber than a box of rocks on a football field - that kid's got zero instincts and then 2 CBs that are about to hit their sophomore season. So really on paper it looks like this is a decent position but in reality it's one of the worst positions on the roster - and that's saying something.

I think these 3 positions get looked at as not a major need because of other major needs. Pass rush, WR, TE, LB are getting a lot more attention but OBD should keep their options open on all of these positions. Just because we have glaring holes on other parts of our roster doesn't mean we should neglect other positions. I think that's how you get into trouble as a football team.

Buddy seems to me to be a guy that's just going to take the better football player in his drafts. I think his drafts have more often than not shown that so I continue to hope that he will draft that way because that's how you get better players. What the Bills don't need right now is to get tunnel vision on certain positions because there are other positions on this roster that, while have players that aren't awful, aren't what I would consider a strong position that teams have to account for.

Just another great fan opinion shared on the pages of BuffaloRumblings.com.

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Good thoughts

When you look at the assembly of talent on this team, nearly every position could benefit from an upgrade. There are very few positions where we can say that we definitely have a legitimate top 16 in the league starter – I’d say we have that only at WR1, RB, LG, C, DT1, DT2, SLB, FS, K and P, and there would be reasonable debate against many of these.

The question is, to what degree would upgrading each position help the team? A successful team is more than just a collection of high performing individuals – take the line for instance. The actions of the QB, RB and even TE’s in picking up blitzers, etc, take a line from looking awful to getting the job done.

Clearly QB has the greatest impact on the game, but I believe that a QB with different strengths (i.e. a more accurate deep ball) could end up hurting the team – for example if they don’t also have Fitz’ knack for getting the ball out quickly. Upgrading at this position right now looks to be a high risk, low reward proposition right now.

by NoiseIsTheBestRevenge on Feb 14, 2012 1:22 PM EST reply actions

I would also add Left Tackle to that list and possibly the other OLine spots too

If one or even two of them are a top16 player added to all of the above thy you mentioned that that makes half of are starters in the better half of the league. Which would mean that we are basically right around average in the league. We just need 3 or more new starters and depth and the bills will be a playoff, maybe even Super Bowl contender( hey once you get to the playoffs anything can happen)

by TheHesterEffect on Feb 14, 2012 3:58 PM EST via mobile up reply actions

thoughts

I’m comfortable letting Searcy be the challenger for Wilson’s starting position. I like Wilson, but like you said, a younger, faster option might prove more efficient in base packages. Searcy was drafted high enough and received enough spot duty as a rookie that it’s rerasonable to believe he should challenge for a starting job in his second season. Don’t let the awful 2010 draft class be the barometer of draft pick development.

I also agree that CB is a need that many overlook. I think the McKelvin experiment is over as a defensive back. He’s absolutely atrocious. I fear McGee and Florence are washed up and would prefer at least one of them out of the rotation (let them fight for a spot in training camp?)

As far as QB goes, I’m worried that this team will bottom out next year based on their 1-8 toilet circle in 2011. If that happens Gailey has to be toast and due to his age, you’d have to wonder about Nix too. I just don’t want to see a young QB taken and then have him handed down to a new regime that didn’t pick him. It’s an awkward situation that messes with the symmetry of a rebuild and is a major part of why I believe the last three head coaches the Bills’ hired failed (counting Gailey for now). I think the Bills committed to Fitzpatrick at this point under Chix. If he sucks next year, throw them all out and let the new guy hand pick the QB he wants to mold into his franchise signal caller.

"There's only one C.J. Spiller." -Buddy Nix

by Port Royal on Feb 14, 2012 1:23 PM EST reply actions 1 recs

I agree about Searcy. I think he needs to challenge for the starting position.

"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.

by stetzwebs on Feb 14, 2012 3:39 PM EST up reply actions

CB is not a "Not-Need Need"

CB is simply a NEED.

"The Amish Rifle is your god now." - Muzza34

by BuffaloOwdaTwnr on Feb 14, 2012 1:37 PM EST reply actions 1 recs

CB has been talked about alot as one of the major needs for OBD.

Regarding Thigpen, would he work as a stop-gap 2nd stringer who mentors are 3rd string project. I agree that Bills’ fans do not want to see Thigpen on the field, but does he possess football smarts and can he teach our developmental QB?

Is Searcy being groomed to take over for George Wilson? With Bryd, Wilson, and Searcy, is not our safety position in good shape for a year or two?

by PineWoodsBillsFan on Feb 14, 2012 2:03 PM EST reply actions 1 recs

I agree that all three of these positions have needs

At QB I hope when Nix and Chan find the young guy they want to develope that they take him no matter what round of however they have to get him. In the mean time I am not excited over Thigpen, but I can live with it.

At SS I agree that Wilson is not the best, but he is smart and sneaky, and capable of holding down the fort for a few years. I do think we need to draft some depth in to both safety positions.

I believe CB will be addresed both in FA and the draft. There are a lot of FA CB’s this year and many of them would be better than McKelven or Florence. So I see us getting a starting #2 CB in FA, then letting McGee go. Let Florence and McKelvin battle it out this spring for the #3 CB spot, and cut the loser. Rogers and a fourth of fifth round pick would round out the depth chart.

Please base your arguments in provable facts instead of pulling stuff out of your rear. -CanadianBillsFan- This is why talk is cheap because the supply always exceeds the demand.

by jbbillfan on Feb 14, 2012 2:53 PM EST reply actions

QB – The first Not-Need need is Ryan Fitzpatrick and Tyler Thigpen. Both of them could be upgraded and should be looked at to be upgraded. Problem is I don’t think OBD is going to do that. There are plenty here that are o.k. with that and i’m fine with that sentiment as far as Fitzpatrick goes (I suppose, I understand it at least) but Thigpen might be the worst backup in the NFL. I’d love a change there and would love even more a move to grab an early QB – one way or the other.

agree 10000000000000000% (that’s more than the standard one hundred, because I agree more than average)

SS – George Wilson has him some followers doesn’t he? People love the guy. Hey, I like him too and his background. I specifically like his penchant for “knack” plays. What I don’t like about him is watching other teams skill players out run his angles because he’s slower than molasses.

Idk if he is slower than molasses, in January. But maybe in June. He is certainly upgradeable. I would like to see a large safety (6’3"+) to assist with TE coverage.

Florence is slower than slow, McKelvin is dumber than a box of rocks on a football field – that kid’s got zero instincts and then 2 CBs that are about to hit their sophomore season. So really on paper it looks like this is a decent position but in reality it’s one of the worst positions on the roster – and that’s saying something.

I have been clear about my wish for man to man corners, for half a decade.

Buddy seems to me to be a guy that’s just going to take the better football player in his drafts. I think his drafts have more often than not shown that so I continue to hope that he will draft that way because that’s how you get better players. What the Bills don’t need right now is to get tunnel vision on certain positions because there are other positions on this roster that, while have players that aren’t awful, aren’t what I would consider a strong position that teams have to account for.

again i agree, more than the average percentage.

"mmmm... Glen honey, I have a question for you... What do you do for a living?"

"I have a question for you, too. Why are you still here?" ~ Glen Quagmire (Giggity Giggity Giggity Goo!)

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 14, 2012 4:15 PM EST reply actions

ive got a handful of problems with this post..

There are 3 positions that the Bills probably won’t look to upgrade this off season

one thing that buddy nix has done since he got here is be truthful. he telegraphed a lot of his priorities so far, and has always been forthcoming on what he thinks of players and needs and such.
having said that, nix said point blank that he wants 2 corners on this team (be it thru FA or draft). he also said that he would take a QB if he liked one that was available at a given slot. i think thats a clear indication that he wants to upgrade those two positions.

Thigpen might be the worst backup in the NFL

umm… what? pat devlin, greg mccelroy, zac robinson, nick hill, thaddeus lewis, jerrod johnson, curtis painter, dan lefevour, rusty smith, adam weber, drew stanton, nathan enderle, and john parker wilson all say otherwise. please tell me which of those guys is a better quarterback, right now today, than thigpen. (sidenote: that list could be twice as long, i just got sick of naming these scrubs)

where in gods name did this strong anti-thigpen sentiment come from? what did he do last year to convince everyone that hes so terrible. throwing 8 passes is enough of a sample size to erase his production in kansas city? the only time he ever got a chance to be a starter, he was a very efficient QB. what makes the guy so awful?

Pass rush, WR, TE, LB are getting a lot more attention

the one ill point out there is tight end. when has buddy nix or chan gailey made TE a big priority? they havent spent a draft pick on one yet, and every one on the roster was a street FA or waiver wire pickup.

take the better football player in his drafts. I think his drafts have more often than not shown that

buddy nix is not a straight BPA guy. hes somewhere between “best player that fits a need” and “reach for need”. his 2010 draft, in particular, is full of ‘reaching’ for ideal 3-4 fits (troup, carrington, moats, batten). ed wang was a reach for a developmental LT. searcy was far from the best player on the board, but they needed more depth at safety. i dont believe for one second that marcell dareus had a higher talent grade from the bills than AJ green and patrick peterson. but, they took dareus primarily because of his run stuff prowess.
the mentality that buddy is a straight BPA guy is a complete myth. he very clearly takes positional needs into account.

He’s a good player but we could get a faster/younger upgrade here

i kind of agree with that, but id tweak it a bit. i think they need a rangy do-it-all safety prospect to develop and play if jairus byrd gets injured. upgrading george wilson should be low on their list, especially since (as you said) searcy might do that in time anyway

Its fun to think quarterback, but i think the odds of nix taking one in the first are close to 0%.

by boomsauce on Feb 14, 2012 5:44 PM EST reply actions

one thing that buddy nix has done since he got here is be truthful. he telegraphed a lot of his priorities so far, and has always been forthcoming on what he thinks of players and needs and such.

maybe. maybe not.

nix said point blank that he wants 2 corners on this team (be it thru FA or draft). he also said that he would take a QB if he liked one that was available at a given slot. i think thats a clear indication that he wants to upgrade those two positions.

He said that about QB the last 2 years as well. Yet, we haven’t selected one, except for Levi Brown, who we not only selected really late… but then cut, for the likes of Tyler Thigpen.

pat devlin, greg mccelroy, zac robinson, nick hill, thaddeus lewis, jerrod johnson, curtis painter, dan lefevour, rusty smith, adam weber, drew stanton, nathan enderle, and john parker wilson all say otherwise. please tell me which of those guys is a better quarterback, right now today, than thigpen.

Personally, I would take any that I highlighted in bold, as considerations. I would also include Brady Quinn in this list, of guys that I would consider an upgrade.

As far as TE- we do have 5 prospects, and a chance (or even likelihood) to add more.

I agree 100% on his selections being need based, and best player that fits a need. That makes more sense to me than outright BPA… if it is a choice between filling a need, and taking pure talent, they need to be WAY more talented to not choose to fill a need AND take a great player, with the same pick.

I also agree that I would like a “rangy do-it-all” safety, preferably a tall fast one that could keep up with speedy tall receivers to help our small corners, as well as be able to match up on TEs which is clearly a need we have.

"mmmm... Glen honey, I have a question for you... What do you do for a living?"

"I have a question for you, too. Why are you still here?" ~ Glen Quagmire (Giggity Giggity Giggity Goo!)

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 14, 2012 6:12 PM EST up reply actions

oops.

i forgot I was going to add Skelton, Kaepernick, assuming that they are still considered “backups”; Skelton could maybe be a starter, thus making Kolb the backup (he is better than Tyler too).

"mmmm... Glen honey, I have a question for you... What do you do for a living?"

"I have a question for you, too. Why are you still here?" ~ Glen Quagmire (Giggity Giggity Giggity Goo!)

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 14, 2012 6:13 PM EST up reply actions

I think Searcy can be that player

Very athletic, just needs to get the mental part of the game.

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 14, 2012 8:17 PM EST up reply actions

too small. otherwise i agree.

he isn’t covering Gronkowski or Graham, or even Hernandez, imo.

"He is a man of courage who does not run away, but remains at his post and fights against the enemy."

~Socrates

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 14, 2012 8:40 PM EST up reply actions

right thought he was taller

only 5’11" but big almost 220lbs. But teams do double cover Gronk. Get a good SLB and I think we will be okay.

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 14, 2012 9:31 PM EST up reply actions

go check out his bench reps at the combine.

he is JACKED!! I think he is a great safety prospectively, given just being a 4th rounder. but he isn’t the 6’3"+ type guy I would love to see us grab. I kinda had wanted us to claim Taylor Mays (6’3" 230lbs) of waiver… because he has the size that you would like to try and cover the large TEs that are popping up all over now.

"He is a man of courage who does not run away, but remains at his post and fights against the enemy."

~Socrates

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 14, 2012 9:38 PM EST up reply actions

You know Searcy in his limited playing time last season

reminded me of a more muscular Blaine Bishop. And I’d be ok with that at SS.

flayed ones stealth mode

"Fleshling! Do not shoot! For I am one of you fleshy things. It is I. Your Uncle Stan. Can't you tell by the long strips of fleshy substances covered in bodily fluids? Trust me! I have fleeeeeeeeesh."

by mob16151 on Feb 15, 2012 6:46 PM EST up reply actions

don't get me wrong

i really like the kid. I think he is totally solid (figurative, AND literal) but he is not the ‘rangy’ type player. He has good instincts, is a sure tackler, sticks his nose in there, and considering he was asked to play all over the defense in college, I think he has a ton of versatility and talent. He was a steal in the 4th (probably because of all the hoopla involved in UNC.) just like our other 4th, IMO. That said: He isn’t gonna be able to consistently cover Gronkowski, or tall TEs/WR like him. Most of these guys will need help with that, I recognize. But a 6’3" or 6’4" guy, sure seems like he could help out, on the back end with this chore. That is all I meant.

"He is a man of courage who does not run away, but remains at his post and fights against the enemy."

~Socrates

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 15, 2012 7:17 PM EST up reply actions

I get you

But how many safeties in the league right now are 6 foot 1 or up?

Chung,Mays, and thats about all I can think of.

flayed ones stealth mode

by mob16151 on Feb 15, 2012 7:44 PM EST up reply actions

right, there aren't many.

But, Mays is kinda the style I was thinking.

Adding Kirkpatrick (at 6’3") could help out, given his ability to provide range, and probably being used in the slot for nickel coverage.

Ray Ray Armstrong out of Florida could be a consideration, at 6’4" 215… they are out there. few and far between, i realize, but the only solution is either OLB/S/CB to try and cover a guy who is 6’7" they are going to be at least 6’1", and that broadens the search some.

"He is a man of courage who does not run away, but remains at his post and fights against the enemy."

~Socrates

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 15, 2012 7:59 PM EST up reply actions