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Morning Joe! Should the Bills play in Downtown Buffalo?

Good morning Bills Fans and Happy Friday!


For today's Morning Joe, I will like to discuss the hypothetical idea of the Bills playing their home games in downtown Buffalo. Now I'm not going to get in to the actual financial and logistics reasons why this hasn't or can't happen, because it's Friday and that involves too much thinking. However, I will like to get some feedback from some of the locals on this subject. Is this what you will like to see (in a perfect world)? If not, what reasons do you have? I will also like to get some feedback from those fans who travel to come see the game. Would you like for the games to be played downtown.

After the jump, I'll discuss my experiences.

Star-divide

Now I'm merely a virgin when it comes to going to Bills games. I live in Baltimore, MD and I started going to Bills home games 3 years back. The first game I ever went to at the Ralph was the 6-3 lost to the Cleveland Browns (ehh). The night before the game I actually proposed to my wife at Bacchus; a restaurant in downtown Buffalo. We vowed to celebrate our anniversary every year at the same restaurant and attend a Bills game. So I witnessed the first Jets beat down we took last year and the Eagles win this year. Now the game day experience has always been fun to me. I love the tailgating experience at the Ralph and the people are so nice. I love the city of Buffalo and want to retire here. But for some reason, the days before the game area little odd to me. Here's how so:

Each time I come to visit, its hard as heck to find a decent hotel. I guess it's partially my fault, because I'm extremely cheap and I'm just not use to the sales tax in NY. Plus I have this huge obsession with reading reviews, and every review I find about hotels, there is the bed bug issue. Now being from out of town, you usually will like to stay downtown because you figure that's where all the action is and where the better hotels are. But the stadium is about 14 miles south of downtown. So I find myself staying closer to the stadium, because I like to beat the game day traffic. Therefore, I kind of miss out on all the downtown activities and better hotels.

After the game, its hard as heck getting out of there. The airport is 16 miles North from the stadium and It seems like its only one way to get to the airport after the game. That is to take 219N to 90E to 33E. If the stadium was downtown, you can either take 33E to the airport or 190S and 90E. Downtown is only 10 miles from the airport and there is two different ways to get from downtown to the airport.

Now I know it seems like I'm complaining and crying, but truthfully it's really not the case. I enjoy my time when I come to visit. I've always had great experiences and memories. But to compare it to Baltimore, this experience is a lot different. The Stadium is dead smack in the downtown area of the city. It's right across the street from where the Orioles play. The business and hotels in the area really benefit from having the games downtown. Tourism in Baltimore is tremendous and the Stadiums play a major role in that.

Like I said earlier, I'm still a virgin to the city of Buffalo. So I was just wondering if the locals prefer to have the stadium downtown. Have there been any discussions or thoughts having it downtown, rather than in the suburbs? And for the out of towners, do you come across the same issues that I have? Does it make any difference to you where the stadium is in conjunction to the airport and downtown?

Just another great fan opinion shared on the pages of BuffaloRumblings.com.

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Not such a crazy idea

Not too long ago, they were considering putting a new stadium on the waterfront. If that happened, then that would fit right into your plans. The only problem is that it won’t be cheap. Not at all.
As for cheap hotels in Buffalo, yeah, you are right, the cheaper you go, the more likely you are to pick up “extra friends” and bring them home with you. However, that is a problem country wide right now, so, it’s not just our problem. I know we stayed in Vegas in a 4 star hotel and got word that a 5 star hotel had to be moved b/c of bed bug infestation. It does happen.
Depending on how cheap you are, you could try the hotels that cost 50 per night.

I'd rather go out in a blaze of glory, then slowly fade away in the antiquities of time.

by suteck on Feb 3, 2012 10:27 AM EST reply actions  

YES!

All I had to do was read the title and I knew the answer had to be yes! I understand how great the tailgating at RW Stadium is, but frankly, it’s embarrassing to have our stadium in the middle of nowhere. It has always been my opinion that a city’s sports teams should play in the actual city. I know the Buffalo Bills aren’t the only team that plays outside its namesake city, but I still want to see them in Buffalo. I believe it would do wonders for the economy of the city. I think the Buffalo Bills should build a huge, waterfront stadium with shopping and restaurants. It could be the entertainment center for the entire WNY region. And Buffalo is such a ghost town that there has to be a way to fit just as much parking room as there is at RW Stadium. I truly believe tailgating would not suffer.

In my lifetime, I hope to see the Bills play in Buffalo full time.

"The Amish Rifle is your god now." - Muzza34

by BuffaloOwdaTwnr on Feb 3, 2012 10:30 AM EST reply actions  

Definately

The only downside is the loss of tailgating. Thats one of the bigger draw’s for the games. And often times over this past decade, the best part about the games for a lot of people.

But I see both sides benifiting from a stadium in the city. Draw people to the city, new stadium, and easier access, especially for those coming from Canada.

Shun the non Billievers!

by Superduff on Feb 3, 2012 10:35 AM EST reply actions  

Completely agree

Any sensible city planner would have insisted the stadium be downtown not miles south in a suburb. A new OUTDOOR stadium right on the Lake would be awesome, but tailgating must be maintained, and there is enough vacant space downtown that it shouldn’t be that difficult to provide fans a large area to tailgate.

Of course this is all wishful thinking – a multimillion dollar investment in western New York that would lift the restaurant, hotel, shopping, and tourism businesses in a downtown that looks like a ghost town after 5PM – that will never happen

by billsin2012 on Feb 3, 2012 10:46 AM EST up reply actions  

Geez, I didn't expect this kind of response

I thought I was going to get killed on this…

So why Orchard Park? I read something that the Bills moved to Orchard Park in 1989 from War Memorial stadium. Not sure why they didn’t build this stadium downtown initially.

by doctork44 on Feb 3, 2012 11:12 AM EST reply actions  

I read something that the Bills moved to Orchard Park in 1989 from War Memorial stadium.

I have no idea where you read that, but NEVER use that medium ever again.

The stadium opened on August 17, 1973. Ralph sold the naming rights to Rich Foods Inc, and the stadium name from 1973 until 1998 was Rich Stadium.

.

When the job is finished no one remembers how long it took, just how well it was performed.

by Buffalo for Eternity on Feb 3, 2012 11:50 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

You're right, sorry I missed type

Not sure what I was thinking

Here is the article I was reading,

by doctork44 on Feb 3, 2012 12:13 PM EST up reply actions  

Originally Erie County entered into a contract to build an indoor stadium for the Bills to play in (not sure exactly where but presumably within the city limits) but due to financial and legal complications between Erie county, the party hired to build the stadium, and the party selling the real estate the proposed stadium was to be built on, the contract was breached and that stadium was never built. Shortly thereafter Rich Stadium opened and the rest is history.

by billsin2012 on Feb 3, 2012 12:02 PM EST up reply actions  

I think the Bills should absolutely have a stadium downtown or at least closer to downtown. From one of the through-ways that goes through the city, you can look down into the Bisons stadium and even though I drive by it all the time, I always think it’s the coolest thing. I love driving by in late winter or early spring and getting all excited for summer and baseball and sitting in that park on a sunny day drinking over priced beer and hot dogs.

The problem is coming up with the money to build a new stadium and to build it downtown. I can’t imagine it ever happening, but it’d be an awesome move if some rich money bags new owner bought the team.

"You mean @TWHITNER. It’s how he prefers to be referenced." - Jon Harrington

by kaisertown on Feb 3, 2012 12:07 PM EST reply actions  

Have Doctork, I really enojoy reading your daily posts and the insightful comments that follow.

I’ve never been to Buffalo, but I am making plans on attending a game via Rochester (staying with family). I’m from LA, so I’m used to driving 30-60 minutes to get places. 20 miles is a normal thing for me. I’m guessing that this is more about the tourism dollars that Buffalo would recieve if the stadium was in Downtown. It makes sense from a business standpoint. But wouldn’t a stadium so close to the lake have some brutal swirling winds?
They’d probably need a retractable roof. And wouldn’t that take away one of the elements that makes Buffalo Bills football? The Kelly-lead Bills were unstoppable in the cold at home in the playoffs. But then again, a closed roof would bring a Superbowl to Buffalo within 5 years after completion.

"First souls collected" - Abayarde, 9/11/11

by MJuice23 on Feb 3, 2012 1:49 PM EST reply actions  

Thanks Mango

I remember that name from my other post…Pretty cool.

Do you think a retractable roof would take away one of our home field advantages; cold weather and snow? I thought about that idea and I wasn’t sure if I was willing to part ways with such a geographic advantage.

by doctork44 on Feb 3, 2012 2:25 PM EST up reply actions  

By the way

You’ll have a great time…Man its nothing like going to a city, where the whole town are Bills fans….Man the environment at the Ralph is EPIC…I get chocked up thinking about it…When I drove down that main road for the 1st time and see all those fans….I almost lost it …Great experience..Oh, make you sure you go in to the field house too…Pretty cool man…Best moments in my life, besides my wedding day of course..hahaha

by doctork44 on Feb 3, 2012 2:34 PM EST up reply actions  

Don't you mean
besides my wedding day of course

besides my wedding NIGHT?

I'd rather go out in a blaze of glory, then slowly fade away in the antiquities of time.

by suteck on Feb 3, 2012 2:48 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't know

I got married in the day time..I always say wedding day.

What do you say? Wedding Night?

by doctork44 on Feb 3, 2012 2:53 PM EST up reply actions  

pretty sure he means getting laid at night after the wedding.

I love this plan! I'm excited to be a part of it! LET'S DO IT! - Venkman

by J2 on Feb 3, 2012 2:59 PM EST up reply actions   3 recs

Lol

Oh, I guess that’s why the emphasis on “night”…gotcha ;-)

by doctork44 on Feb 3, 2012 3:59 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

A roof would hurt the field advantages, although I don’t recall a time recently were it helped.
That’s why I had to reference the early 90s Bills.
A roof would help with ticket sales in December, one would imagine.

"First souls collected" - Abayarde, 9/11/11

by MJuice23 on Feb 3, 2012 3:10 PM EST up reply actions  

But then again, a closed roof would bring a Superbowl to Buffalo within 5 years after completion.

Not even close. Buffalo can’t host a Super Bowl as they don’t have the resources for it. They don’t even have the resources to host a NHL All-Star game. Downtown Buffalo has less than 2,000 hotel rooms. The All-Star game required over 7,000. How many do you think a Super Bowl requires?

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by twoeightnine on Feb 3, 2012 3:02 PM EST up reply actions  

I don’t know enough about the local economy so I’m just making assumptions.
But with a new stadium, one would imagine an entertainment complex. That would also include hotel rooms.
It’s the Superbowl afterall. Wouldn’t they just send out the reporters as far out as Niagra Falls. I figure a 30 mile radius should suffice.

"First souls collected" - Abayarde, 9/11/11

by MJuice23 on Feb 3, 2012 3:19 PM EST up reply actions  

Downtown stadiums

Being one of the smaller pro sports cities I doubt buffalo has enough hotel rooms or event venues to support a superbowl week even with an indoor stadium.

I’m not from the area so I can only speak in generalities but its hard to make a case that a downtown football stadium will revitalize the economy with only 8 home games a year. Its easier for that to fly with baseball. The reason football stadiums tend to be in the suburbs is because the land is cheaper and people are willing to travel on weekends. The NFL stadiums that are in downtown areas are mostly part of larger complexes that also include baseball stadiums – Baltimore and Houston for example.

Downtown stadium seems like a cool idea but it would be a hard sell.

by Let's Talk About Tex Baby on Feb 3, 2012 4:30 PM EST up reply actions  

There's less than 10,000 hotel rooms in the greater Buffalo area.

And you get maybe another 400-500 at the most hotel rooms out of an failing entertainment complex because football stadiums aren’t used enough for them to be successful. Where are you getting the other 10,000 rooms needed?

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by twoeightnine on Feb 3, 2012 6:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Roger Goodell said you’d have to go into Canada and Rochester to get enough hotel rooms.

by MattRichWarren on Feb 4, 2012 10:54 AM EST up reply actions  

Yes

it is a dream for many Bills fans. IMO opinion it should be built near HSBC arena, down by fulton street. It would cost around half a billion dollars. Right now might be the best time to plan it because Gov. Cuomo just promised buffalo $1 billion to help create jobs, and keep helping downtown development. This would great for the city of Buffalo. While I like tailgating having the stadium in the middle of nowhere is awful.

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 3, 2012 5:01 PM EST reply actions  

It would cost considerably more than half a billion dollars.

by MattRichWarren on Feb 4, 2012 10:55 AM EST up reply actions  

not really

I’ve done some research on it. Here are some of the realistic newer stadiums.

Lincoln Financial Field (Eagles)-$611 million in 2012 dollars-open
University of Pheonix Stadium (Cardinals)-$496 million in 2012 dollars-dome
Lucas Oil Stadium-$735 million in 2012 dollar- retractable roof

So depending on what type of stadium they want to build it would cost around $600 million. And since the state makes $20 million a year off of the Bills if they signed a 30 year lease and the state contributes $400 million, the Bills/NFL $100 million and sell the naming rights over 30 years for $100 million+, it is more than plausible, it actually makes business sense-the state would gross $200 million from this deal (but they do have some expenses too). The land just needs to be bought and more parking built in the HSBC area. It could be done.

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 4, 2012 1:09 PM EST up reply actions  

my source is Wikipedia

but i think it is good for estimation.

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 4, 2012 1:11 PM EST up reply actions  

Jim Kelly's idea

I remember reading that Kelly suggested a new stadium in Niagara Falls. I think it’s perfect, as you already have one of natures great vistas right there. Make the stadium walking distance and you’ll have great new profitable business’s opening up, which means new jobs for the Buffalo economy. Everybody wins. As an example, it’s great to have the Super Dome in walking distance of the french quarter here in New Orleans. It’s the City’s main attraction and brings in lot’s of money for everyone, while making things really simple for the visitors.

"This is what happens Larry!, This is what happens! "-Walter Sobchak" "Did we give up when the germans bombed pearl harbor!!??"-John Belushi

by BigEasyBillsKrewe on Feb 3, 2012 5:11 PM EST reply actions  

I would hate it in Niagra Falls

Same reason as where it is. No public transit.

Girls use hair spray, Men don't.

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by The Buffalo Kid on Feb 3, 2012 5:32 PM EST up reply actions  

No

Sorry but Niagara Falls would be awful. There is nothing there besides a Nature Preserve. Buffalo has much more going on development wise than Niagara Falls.

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 3, 2012 5:48 PM EST up reply actions  

I like the Niagara Falls idea

Though, I completely understand the the $80 million renovation of RWS is the best and easiest way to keep the Bills in WNY. That said…

If I have a blank check, the stadium would go downtown. I’d put it somewhere near the First Niagara Center, to share parking space. I also saw plans for the potential future use of the train lines in Buffalo, from a historical group. All of the train lines exist to run local commuter trains from just about anywhere in Buffalo to near the stadium area. Then continue to renovate the downtown area. It would be great for business, and easy for fans to get to the stadium.

It would be easier for the Canadian and Rochester fans too. Build park-and-rides at the ends of the train lines.

Living in Germany for five years, I can tell you that trains do a lot for business. Every stop is like a little business oasis.

Re-starting the official Buffalo "Draft a quarterback in the First Round in 2012" campaign.

by Der Jaeger on Feb 3, 2012 7:37 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

seconded

it really is a far better plan. Unfortunately, it probably just isn’t going to happen.

ABAYARDE IS NOSTRADAMUS JUST WATCH WE WILL NOT YIEALD TO NOBODY YOUR SOUL WE WILL TAKE

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 3, 2012 10:05 PM EST up reply actions  

pretty much exactly what I think.

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 4, 2012 9:58 AM EST up reply actions  

YES YES YES YES YES YES and YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Downtown DOME!

If I could take the train to Bills games like I do the Sabres, I would go to a lot more games. They make it a dome :)…….I’d become a season ticket holder.

Girls use hair spray, Men don't.

DO YOURSELF A FAVOR AND GROW UP BY NOT USING HAIRSPRAY MALES!

Don't be a Paully!

by The Buffalo Kid on Feb 3, 2012 5:31 PM EST reply actions  

Very interesting idea.

But I have to vote “No.”

Because, unless the new owner wants to shell out 1.5 Billion (which he won’t) there is no way this happens. I mean, 1 Bill for the stadium and 500 mill to grease all of the lawyers, politicians, labor unions, contractors (you know, the people who really run New York State) and the environmentalist jerks who will require the Bills to do an impact study on what the effects will be on the endangered Lake Erie purple-headed mosquito.

Why not invest 200 million into the Ralph and make it state of the art?
Expand the different levels outward. More walkways, entrances, bathrooms, vendors, attach a hotel, restaurants, shops.

If you really want to get crazy, invest 400 million, do the improvements I said above and add a retractable roof so Erie county can host all kinds of events there year round. Am I nuts?

Plus, for selfish reasons, when I travel back home to NY, I drive up from the Southtowns up good old Route 62………. and it gets me in and out of the stadium in a flash.

"My new cat just farted on my lap. Smells like Bills football." BG.

by SERGEANT MAJOR THOR on Feb 3, 2012 6:40 PM EST reply actions  

Plus.........

She’s a beautiful old girl. I would hate to see her go.

As one of the older stadiums in the NFL, it is still AWESOME to go to a game there. Perfect tailgating, tons of parking, small town feel, bands in the lot.
“Sniff….. sniff.” Getting choked up right now thinking about it, cause I don’t get to home often to see a game.

And there are teams in the NFL (St Louis for example) that are already trying to extort a new stadium out of the local populace……. AND THEIR STADIUMS ARE FAR NEWER than ours.
Pathetic.

"My new cat just farted on my lap. Smells like Bills football." BG.

by SERGEANT MAJOR THOR on Feb 3, 2012 6:47 PM EST up reply actions  

Stadiums don't cost 1 billion.

Unless you are Jerry Jones. The Bills could build a nice stadium like the Eagles Stadium for under $600 million. Which isn’t that much more (in the long run) than the $200 million. Really its the same $200 million for 10 years, $600 million for 30 years.

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 4, 2012 9:59 AM EST up reply actions  

Inflation is a b%tch

Lucas Oil Stadium – 720 million
Jerryworld – 1 Bill
Jets/Giants stadium – 1.3 – 1.6 Bill
New LA stadium – 1.2 – 1.3 Bill
New 49er stadium – 1.02 Bill

"My new cat just farted on my lap. Smells like Bills football." BG.

by SERGEANT MAJOR THOR on Feb 4, 2012 11:06 AM EST up reply actions  

yea

I looked it up I posted it above. You can build a nice stadium for $600 million open air , or a dome, retractable is really expensive.

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 4, 2012 1:10 PM EST up reply actions  

Take a look at those markets though

All of them are much larger markets and cities than Buffalo is. Of course they want top of the line, state of the art stadiums to brag about. I agree with tomcs and his list of stadiums he supplied above, those are much closer to the Buffalo market than the ones you mentioned.

"I promise you, ... When I come back, I'm going to be like a mad dog in a meat house." -Takeo Spikes

by panekattack on Feb 4, 2012 6:33 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Heinz Field

They built that on the cheap.

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DO YOURSELF A FAVOR AND GROW UP BY NOT USING HAIRSPRAY MALES!

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by The Buffalo Kid on Feb 4, 2012 11:18 PM EST up reply actions  

Because the public transit there is crap.
Why not invest 200 million into the Ralph and make it state of the art?

I live in Buffalo, and go to about 20 Sabres games to each Bills game, even though I love football and the Bills more.

The Reason?

Public Transit!

If I want to go to a Sabres game, I simply walk a few blocks to LaSalle station, jump on the Metro for a $1.75 and get dropped off in front of FNC formerly HSBC arena. If I want to go to a Bills game, we have to find a designated driver, pay for their ticket. I want decent public transit for the Bills like the Sabres have. Either move it downtown, or extend the Metro to Orchard Park.

Girls use hair spray, Men don't.

DO YOURSELF A FAVOR AND GROW UP BY NOT USING HAIRSPRAY MALES!

Don't be a Paully!

by The Buffalo Kid on Feb 4, 2012 11:01 PM EST up reply actions  

Question?

Can anyone tell me how the city of Orchard Park is benefiting from having the Bills play there?

When I drove around the town, I didn’t notice many businesses capitalizing on the fact that an NFL franchise plays in their backyard. I was little surprise that I didn’t see more bars, restaurants, etc

by doctork44 on Feb 3, 2012 7:56 PM EST reply actions  

People essentially come to tailgate and leave after the game. The Big Tree Inn is about the only place.

by MattRichWarren on Feb 4, 2012 10:56 AM EST up reply actions  

NO

We are privelaged to have a franchice period. We don’t have the money to move down town. I think the tailgating is the great thing about Orchard Park. If we get new ownership that would do something without public money maybe.

by cowlesville on Feb 3, 2012 8:05 PM EST reply actions  

just cuz you are like, 30 mins from the stadium now.

; ) I know the feeling, being in Attica. But…. Why do you assume that there wouldn’t still be tailgating? It really just gives opportunity for more bars/business/expansion downtown.

ABAYARDE IS NOSTRADAMUS JUST WATCH WE WILL NOT YIEALD TO NOBODY YOUR SOUL WE WILL TAKE

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 3, 2012 10:07 PM EST up reply actions  

More businesses that would go out of business downtown not long after opening.

Besides the fact that no one wants to “tailgate” in a bar, football stadiums don’t bring the economic boost to surrounding areas like arenas and baseball stadiums. A downtown football stadium would only bring people to the area less than 10 days a year. And no one is shopping before or after a game.

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by twoeightnine on Feb 4, 2012 1:54 PM EST up reply actions  

people will tailgate and in a bar

and you can still have a few surface lots for tailgaters the vast majority of fans don’t tailgate so they can still fit in some tailgating with bars and shops. And I think people would stay in downtown after a game. They could hang out and eat dinner instead of driving home for dinner. Especially with the waterfront development going on a new stadium near fulton street by FNC would be awesome.

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 4, 2012 2:47 PM EST up reply actions  

tell that to the packed bars in the vicinity of the stadium.

I wasn’t talking about shopping. Not to mention, MOST stadiums feature other events also. That is probably the more significant factor. A new dome, would render the F’N center obsolete.

ABAYARDE IS NOSTRADAMUS JUST WATCH WE WILL NOT YIEALD TO NOBODY YOUR SOUL WE WILL TAKE

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 4, 2012 3:37 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah I would like an open stadium

But Idk if the FNC would be obsolete totally because it depends on the size of the event

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 4, 2012 4:53 PM EST up reply actions  

assuming we were building a dome in the same vicinity, i was meaning.

that would practically render it obsolete, as i would hope the capacity would be greater, though those things aren’t guarantees either.

ABAYARDE IS NOSTRADAMUS JUST WATCH WE WILL NOT YIEALD TO NOBODY YOUR SOUL WE WILL TAKE

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 4, 2012 7:28 PM EST up reply actions  

i was agreeing with you

I was saying though based on the size of the event they would choose between a huge football stadium which would be about 2.5 times bigger then the FNC. and would probably take away some events from the FNC, but might bring more bigger concerts to downtown buffalo because of the bigger venue.

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 4, 2012 8:09 PM EST up reply actions  

There is not many bands.
but might bring more bigger concerts to downtown buffalo because of the bigger venue.

That can fill a football stadium nowadays.

The last concert I went to at the Ralph was The Rolling Stones, on the Bridges to Babylon tour and they didn’t sell it out. We got great seats for about 30% off face value.

Girls use hair spray, Men don't.

DO YOURSELF A FAVOR AND GROW UP BY NOT USING HAIRSPRAY MALES!

Don't be a Paully!

by The Buffalo Kid on Feb 4, 2012 11:09 PM EST up reply actions  

True just possibilities.

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 4, 2012 11:54 PM EST up reply actions  

i agree with you also

but at the same time, it seems like they would need additional events to justify the costs of a whole new dome, versus just refurbishing/modernizing the Ralph.

ABAYARDE IS NOSTRADAMUS JUST WATCH WE WILL NOT YIEALD TO NOBODY YOUR SOUL WE WILL TAKE

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 5, 2012 1:31 AM EST up reply actions  

i hear you

but the way I see it, that kind of investment? IDK. I really don’t. Buffalo Kid makes a great point, that few things need bigger than the Arena, but then, how can you justify spending for the “new dome” that you use 7 times a year (assuming we STILL never get to the playoffs)

ABAYARDE IS NOSTRADAMUS JUST WATCH WE WILL NOT YIEALD TO NOBODY YOUR SOUL WE WILL TAKE

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 5, 2012 1:33 AM EST up reply actions  

that was at tomcs' post above.

gets hard to tell sometimes. just being clear.

ABAYARDE IS NOSTRADAMUS JUST WATCH WE WILL NOT YIEALD TO NOBODY YOUR SOUL WE WILL TAKE

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 5, 2012 1:34 AM EST up reply actions  

I posted above the investment.

$600 million stadium, 30 year lease. The state puts in $400 million. They receive around $20 million a year in taxes from the Bills. Bills/NFL put in $100 million, and they sell the naming rights for $100 million over 30 years. The state will make $200 million over 30 years. But they will have some expenses, but if the stadium is downtown they will make more money in sales tax because of more business and events in the stadium. It will lead to increased development in that area. The state could use $400 million of the $1 billion they are giving the city of Buffalo for development. It makes perfect sense to me, but others I have posed this idea to don’t agree as much. What do you think?

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 5, 2012 1:42 PM EST up reply actions  

fiscally, it isn't terrible, i agree. however, is it more viable, than modernizing the existing stadium?

I don’t know. i do know, that if it is only being used 7 times a year, it isn’t fiscally responsible. i think that this would be a great time to consider it, but that ultimately, that money could be spent differently, and the further north you move the stadium, the less traffic you might draw from Penn/ohio, though idk what kind of percentage impact that would have, comparative to say, gained Canadian fans. Really, I guess, I don’t know what i think.. : )

ABAYARDE IS NOSTRADAMUS JUST WATCH WE WILL NOT YIEALD TO NOBODY YOUR SOUL WE WILL TAKE

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 5, 2012 4:54 PM EST up reply actions  

I think a lot of people may be missing the point.

I’m speaking of a hypothetical scenario. In a perfect world, would you want a stadium downtown? Obviously, money is always an issue. Let’s look at the glass half full for once.

by doctork44 on Feb 3, 2012 9:34 PM EST reply actions  

I don’t know that I want a dome though.. unless it could be opened if we wanted. W/ Climate control for the fans still? that could be neat.

ABAYARDE IS NOSTRADAMUS JUST WATCH WE WILL NOT YIEALD TO NOBODY YOUR SOUL WE WILL TAKE

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 3, 2012 10:07 PM EST up reply actions  

I want a Dome!

I froze too much at Rich Stadium when I was younger. I’ll take a dome if they want me to buy more tickets and come to more games. I won’t even consider going to a game anymore unless the weather is looking good.

Girls use hair spray, Men don't.

DO YOURSELF A FAVOR AND GROW UP BY NOT USING HAIRSPRAY MALES!

Don't be a Paully!

by The Buffalo Kid on Feb 4, 2012 11:12 PM EST up reply actions  

i hear you on that. i haven’t ever been to a game in the cold. I don’t think i would enjoy it enough, as I don’t drink, and that makes it all the colder hahaha.

ABAYARDE IS NOSTRADAMUS JUST WATCH WE WILL NOT YIEALD TO NOBODY YOUR SOUL WE WILL TAKE

by ThaRealTruth on Feb 5, 2012 1:34 AM EST up reply actions  

No dome for me

Blue collar city, blue collar team, blue collar fans…I think we should have a blue collar stadium…Something like Lambeau or Arrowhead

by doctork44 on Feb 3, 2012 10:10 PM EST reply actions  

Dome all the way?

How many times have you sat in the upper deck of Rich Stadium where the blowing snow was so bad you couldn’t see the field?

For me, way too many growing up. I remember times before I was a teenager, spending more time in those nasty trough bathrooms than watching the game, just because there was heat in there and I was freezing cold. I’ll take a DOME!

Not exactly the way to build the fan experience where they want to go to more games.

Girls use hair spray, Men don't.

DO YOURSELF A FAVOR AND GROW UP BY NOT USING HAIRSPRAY MALES!

Don't be a Paully!

by The Buffalo Kid on Feb 4, 2012 11:16 PM EST up reply actions  

For me...

My first choice would be a stadium by the Falls. I like what TO said about the Bills being North America’s team and a location near the border would further perpetuate this idea without giving up a home game a season. Also, I love tailgating at the Bills games. It is an experience unlike any other. I feel that a stadium in downtown would really kill that vibe. Ive been to stadiums in cities and to stadiums where tailgating is not existent. It really takes away from the game and honestly its like being cheated out of something. The Falls provides ample space to duplicate tailgating on the border. I would also say that a dome is a must. The blue collar player is a thing of the past. The team needs to become an attractive destination to players. I dont know many people who would choose to work in the snow when they can work inside. I dont believe that the Bills have any advantage playing in Buffalo weather. I definitely havent seen it in the last decade or so. Just some things ive been mulling over lately

by billsstein on Feb 4, 2012 12:52 AM EST reply actions  

I gotcha

You’re right, we haven’t used our location to our advantage. But if we were good, teams will hate come to here for more than one reason.

by doctork44 on Feb 4, 2012 5:53 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Agree, My point exactly

If this just a fantasy scenario, as the poster says, An overhaul of the area and trains could added.

"This is what happens Larry!, This is what happens! "-Walter Sobchak" "Did we give up when the germans bombed pearl harbor!!??"-John Belushi

by BigEasyBillsKrewe on Feb 5, 2012 2:32 PM EST up reply actions  

I am very happy with the current situation

We have a problem getting the state or surrounding comminuties to spring for stadium renovations in exchange for extending the lease, i seriously doubt that they’d ever pay for a new stadium – the money just isn’t there. As a season ticket holder I am fine with the current spot. They could maybe improve things with the access points to alleviate traffic after games.

For those who suggested a dome -NOOOOOOO ! I sit outside in the cold bad weatehr so I would have a lot to gain to be inside a nice cosy dome. To me it’S simple, our bad weather is a huge advantage to our team and I certainly would not want to give that up. Teams do not look forward to having to play us late in the season, the fans are crazy, it’s all good. It"s part of our identity, part of who we are – I never want to see that change.

As for a new Stadium either in Buffalo or NF, well I don’t think it’s necessary, we already have the 11th largest capacity stadium. All we need maybe is to spruce it up, add some well need amenities like decent TVs in the food concession stand areas, better sound, better food, larger bathrooms. They could also improve the seating in the upper bowl. The real money is normally in the luxury boxes in the middle but they are always empty because the pricing is too high. If they could reduce pricing on those seats it would go a long way to filling the seats. For what they giove you more, it’s simply not worth the difference in pricing. That all being said, I’m not against a new stadium in either of those two areas, as long as they have enough room to continue our great tailgating tradition. Because over the past 10years my best memories have been the tailgating and not the games because the product on the field has sucked for so long, at least we have the tailgating to fall back onto. The argument about leaving downtown and having options to get to the airport makes no sense because the Airport is basically on the 33 so I think that’s grasping for straws!

Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience

by keysh67 on Feb 5, 2012 9:13 AM EST reply actions  

Visit other cities and then answer

As a guy who grew up, got two degrees at SUNY Buffalo before leaving, I’d ask that anyone and everyone who wants to voice an opinion, please visit other cities and see what they’ve done with their downtown. I love Buffalo and cheer every bit of good news, but the “city fathers” those nitwits who made decisions back in the 60s, 70s and 80s have done almost irreversible harm to the city’s prospects. Exhibit 1A, look at the Amherst campus, it is a veritable city now, much larger than when I was there, built out in a swamp. Imagine if all that new housing was downtown, all those new buildings taking up vacant space on Main St., etc. Imagine all the extra hotels rooms needed for visiting parents, university guests, etc. Exhibit 1B, look at Rich, the Ralph, whatever, out in the middle of nowhere. Even Chicago, where I live now, has their stadium along the lake front. Imagine the infrastructure investment that would be made, new roads, new hotels, etc., all downtown, to support a football stadium that could also be used for concerts, etc. In short, for what it is worth, this ex-Buffalonian, who has visited a lot of the “rust belt” cities, and seen the various plans for development, asks that the people making the decisions now, get out and see how other cities do it and then follow the model of the successful ones. If they do, downtown will soon be humming with the sound of bulldozers and cement trucks.

by CGoetz on Feb 5, 2012 9:49 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

Totally

You hit the nail right on the head..it’s all a domino effect.

by doctork44 on Feb 5, 2012 9:52 AM EST up reply actions  

there has been a lot of that

going on recently. Furhman (spelling?) boulevard is an example. its a shame of how poorly the 60s-90s planning was done.

With the 10th Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft the Buffalo Bills select Dont'a Hightower LB Alabama.

by tomcs on Feb 5, 2012 1:49 PM EST up reply actions  

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