Buffalo Bills Are Not In On Robert Griffin III, Per Buddy Nix
by Brian Galliford on Mar 1, 2012 9:13 AM EST
in 2012 NFL Draft
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PrintPeter King of Sports Illustrated made waves earlier this week when, while discussing the St. Louis Rams and their desire to trade their No. 2 overall pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, noted that the Rams had already received a trade offer from a team "you would never expect."
Naturally, fans of every team with quarterback issues outside of Cleveland, Washington and Miami began wondering if their team was this "mystery team." Buffalo Bills GM Buddy Nix, in speaking with The Howard Simon Show on WGR 550 Thursday morning, made it very clear that the Bills are not that team. Here was his exchange with Simon:
Simon: "Hey Buddy, have you called St. Louis? Will you call, if you haven't, and inquire about moving up to No. 2 since the pick is apparently available?"
Nix: "No."
Simon: "Have not called?"
Nix: "No."
Simon: "Will not call?"
Nix: "No."
"I've visited with (the Rams)," Nix continued, "but not about that. We talk to everybody, and we kick the tires on everybody, but if we were going to probably move either way, it'd be down, not up."
Nix also re-iterated to Simon what Bills fans have known about him since the beginning: he treats draft picks like gold, and hates surrendering them to move up.
"I never have liked to, and I never have traded picks," Nix said. "I hate giving them up. I like to get them. We've got nine, and I'd like to wind up with ten, and we'll see how that goes."
Is it possible that Nix is blowing smoke to cover up the team's true intentions? Sure. But Nix is not notorious for that kind of behavior, and the blunt nature of his responses to Simon lead us to believe that the Bills genuinely are not interested in shelling out the bounty required to move up eight spots in April.
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whew
So far Nix has shown us he’s a pretty straight shooter. The amount of picks it would take to trade up that far made me queasy.
You know what makes me sick?
Hearing that these picks are far too valuable to give up for a player who’s likely going to be at or near the top of his class when the dust settles.
That they don’t need an upgrade at QB because “Fitz can do it with a better line” (Note how well the line did last year, and how well Jackson played – and still they were a losing team.)
That they’re just a few pieces away from being a playoff team. (I can’t even begin to discuss how differently I feel on the matter.)
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:24 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Well.....
You are going to be sorely disappointed. The Bills are making the playoffs in 2012.
PodunkO - The great post ender!
by podunkowego on Mar 1, 2012 11:57 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If I had money to spare, i’d put a bet down. I don’t, so I won’t.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:06 PM EST up reply actions
Then we shall bet our immortal souls.
"Everyone who has conducted an expedition will know how ready the world is to do the great injustice of heaping the whole praise or blame for its success or failure on the shoulders of the leader alone."
-Polar Explorer Fridtjof Nansen
by NordicBillsfan on Mar 1, 2012 3:07 PM EST up reply actions
To the death, good warrior!
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:08 PM EST up reply actions
Come on, you pansy!
"Everyone who has conducted an expedition will know how ready the world is to do the great injustice of heaping the whole praise or blame for its success or failure on the shoulders of the leader alone."
-Polar Explorer Fridtjof Nansen
by NordicBillsfan on Mar 1, 2012 3:11 PM EST up reply actions
Wait a minute. How did I get into betting something completely unproven to you when you didn’t even initiate the barb from me?
I think I need to be afraid.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:22 PM EST up reply actions
You should be afraid. The Black Knight is always victorious!
"Everyone who has conducted an expedition will know how ready the world is to do the great injustice of heaping the whole praise or blame for its success or failure on the shoulders of the leader alone."
-Polar Explorer Fridtjof Nansen
by NordicBillsfan on Mar 1, 2012 3:26 PM EST up reply actions
I’ll play the role of the long distance runner.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:34 PM EST up reply actions
So?
Statistically speaking they should have LUCKED into a playoff spot by now.
But they haven’t. Running to a 9-7 record to win a three-way tiebreaker to back into a playoff spot shouldn’t be the goal.
Winning the Superbowl should be. Contending annually for a Super Bowl should be.
Does anyone seriously think Fitzpatrick is the QB who can accomplish that goal?
by EvilJohn on Mar 1, 2012 3:16 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Does anyone seriously think Fitzpatrick is the QB who can accomplish that goal?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAnpvysqFdE
"Ability may get you to the top, but it takes character to keep you there." - John Wooden
"Do not repeat the tactics which have gained you one victory, but let your methods be regulated by the infinite variety of circumstances." - Sun Tzu
by Joe P. on Mar 1, 2012 4:57 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
marginal benefit
which is greater?
A) the improvement from fitz to griffin (Griffin minus Fitz, in mathematical terms), or
B) the improvement from 2 first round picks (hopefully starters at need positions) and 2 second round picks (also possibly starters at DE/WR/OT/SLB —> Floyd minus D. Jones + A. Branch/N. Perry minus Kelsay/S. Johnson + 2012QBX minus Fitz + 2012OTX minus Bell/Hairston)
buddy believes that B > A, and i tend to agree with him.
by dav630 on Mar 1, 2012 12:04 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
A is simpler. I choose A.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:09 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zu9ZxzsWchg
"Ability may get you to the top, but it takes character to keep you there." - John Wooden
"Do not repeat the tactics which have gained you one victory, but let your methods be regulated by the infinite variety of circumstances." - Sun Tzu
I’m starting to see a pattern…
"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7R2vQLhmmW4&feature=related
"Ability may get you to the top, but it takes character to keep you there." - John Wooden
"Do not repeat the tactics which have gained you one victory, but let your methods be regulated by the infinite variety of circumstances." - Sun Tzu
"Fitz can do it with a better line" (Note how well the line did last year, and how well Jackson played – and still they were a losing team.)
How about “Fitz can do it with a defense that’s not giving up 17 points in the first quarter.”.. The oline was fine.
by BuffaloBlueBlood on Mar 1, 2012 12:16 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 3 recs
you're assuming that getting RGIII = winning a super bowl
all this talk about needing a franchise QB and how Fitz is not going to win us a super bowl.
come on, man! even assuming RGIII pans out, that he becomes a quality, pro bowl-level starter, doesn’t mean his team is going to win the super bowl. for all the talk about this franchise QB pick and that franchise QB pick, how many of the top 5 QB picks in the past 10 years have won the super bowl?
by paythemannow on Mar 1, 2012 12:16 PM EST up reply actions
Yep yep. I’ll tell ya, reading this blog has started to make me hate the words “elite”, “blue chip” and “franchise”. They’re in like 80% of comments, and they really have no clear definition as it pertains to football. We got what we’ve got and we’ll get what we get, dudes. No amount of vague adjectives attempting to describe some sort of mythical beast is going to change that.
by BuffaloBlueBlood on Mar 1, 2012 12:26 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
How about an All-Pro starter?
I think that’s something in RGIII’s range. Basically the top third of the QBs in the NFL are “pro-bowl quality”.
by EvilJohn on Mar 1, 2012 3:17 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
All-Pro quality, even. There’s less garbage when picking near the top.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:20 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I think you'll enjoy this article.
http://www.washingtonian.com/blogarticles/people/capitalcomment/23065.html
I’m jealous of the Redskins. WTF.
Celebrate St. Patrick's Day! Save $10 on a purchase of $50 or more with code: STPATRICK2012.
We don’t have enough draft pick power to compete for him IMO anyway… especially when we’ll be competing for Luck after Irsay takes Griffin :)
I'm waitin'..... @killascript on twitter
I just see it
And, I’m really not sure who will have the better career after all is said and done
I'm waitin'..... @killascript on twitter
That would be nice.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:24 AM EST up reply actions
Boldly Sarcastic
See :) at end of sentence. Its funny.
Record Setting Play-Off Drought. On The Bright Side, It's Another Record For This Franchise. :)
by buffalobacker on Mar 2, 2012 10:50 PM EST up reply actions
We’ve got nine, and I’d like to wind up with ten
interesting…. very interesting
anyone else getting the impression that nix really really likes some of the non-first round talent in this draft?
Its fun to think quarterback, but i think the odds of nix taking one in the first are close to 0%.
read somewhere they were prob getting 10 picks- a comp pick I believe made it 10?
"Will&Work2Win"coach Karma420
by Blood, sweat & Win on Mar 1, 2012 9:23 AM EST up reply actions
10 picks- a comp pick I believe made it 10?
There still waiting to see if and what that get for the Jags signing Poz…
.
It's easy to have faith in yourself and have discipline when you're a winner, when you're number one. What you got to have is faith and discipline when you're not a winner.
Vince Lombardi
yep, thats it & it was C Brown who thought they would get the 10th
"Will&Work2Win"coach Karma420
by Blood, sweat & Win on Mar 1, 2012 10:52 AM EST up reply actions
Can hardly wait for even more RBs.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
Crystal ball says it will be a Safety—:)
It's easy to have faith in yourself and have discipline when you're a winner, when you're number one. What you got to have is faith and discipline when you're not a winner.
Vince Lombardi
Don’t even…
I think i’m going to arena league if the Bills move up to 2 and draft either a safety or RB.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:05 PM EST up reply actions
or move back and draft a SS
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 1, 2012 3:36 PM EST up reply actions
TheAfghanTwilight
What you you do if they drafted a punter with the #10 pick?
Yea my thinking was to use some of our late round picks to try to get back up into the middle rounds with another pick.
I simply dont find as much value in 5-7 round picks, but Buddy obviously does. I find it odd that he commented that if they were going to move from 10 that it would be down. This is in contradiction from previous years when he has said that was not an option. My thinking is that they dont like the top ten talent and would value another pick in the 2-3 rounds.
"It’s not news, until Rumblings say its news". -Doctork44
Which is fine with me.
I think it would be excellent to add another 2nd round pick. I trust Buddy.
"The Amish Rifle is your god now." - Muzza34
by BuffaloOwdaTwnr on Mar 1, 2012 9:34 AM EST up reply actions
Actually...
Based on our current team makeup, I’d argue there’s more value in the 5-7 round picks as well as the UDFA market. But I suppose that’s mainly because of monumental blunders by the previous front office during the higher rounds.
by BillsfaninBoise on Mar 1, 2012 11:00 AM EST up reply actions
yes that is my take as well and it is a major shift in his previous draft stratagy.
"It’s not news, until Rumblings say its news". -Doctork44
Cost just too high
Buddy is not one to overpay, whether it is trading picks or paying players. Just ask Stevie’s agent. To get RG3 would require them to give up 3-4 high picks, and Buddy has other holes to fill.
Also, trading for RGIII would likely mean no playoffs for 1-2 years, and for him and Chan to survive they need to make it soon.
I would give any of our two first round picks up in the past decade to potentially have a franchise quarterback (nobody is a guarantee). I am also going to throw out Marcell Dareus because he was the third overall pick, and if we were only trading up 1 spot with St. Louis it wouldn’t take two first rounders.
CJ Spiller
Eric Wood
Aaron Maybin
Leodis Mckelvin
Marshawn Lynch
Donte Whitner
JP Losman
Lee Evans
Willis McGahee
Given the choice of taking any two of those guys or rolling the dice on RG3, I would roll the dice on RG3. There are some players I loved in that group, some real difference makers, but at the end of the day we aren’t going anywhere without a franchise QB. The only other option is having an absolutely lights out defense, and we are nowhere near that. I understand what Buddy is saying, but their clock will run out here eventually if they don’t land that guy.
Also, coaches typically get another couple of years when they draft a franchise QB anyway. If they drafted Griffin then Gailey would have two years at a minimum to make the playoffs, and as long as they showed improvement I would bet on 3.
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
by hoosier3 on Mar 1, 2012 10:45 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Yes. Good stuff!
"They’re a very special group of men. Cherish them, you will not see their like again."
by chaucer on Mar 1, 2012 11:32 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Yah a first round p
"This is a chance to shine some light on the city, They say it’s too cold. I’m going to bring some warmth to it." Marcell Dareus
by matthew62 on Mar 1, 2012 11:36 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
A first round pick is not guarenteed. It can fail in all this betting the farm talk have we ever.considered history and the qb tandems that have gone 1 & 2. You want to throw previous picks at me I throw all those guys at you and if history repeats itself the guy picked at 2 looks like a bust.
"This is a chance to shine some light on the city, They say it’s too cold. I’m going to bring some warmth to it." Marcell Dareus
by matthew62 on Mar 1, 2012 11:40 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
I’d be fine with no Dareus if it meant a franchise QB was in town.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:45 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Plenty of Archie Manning fans out there would agree.
by Ian MacPersonoid on Mar 1, 2012 2:17 PM EST up reply actions
Simple
Gotta have someone “hike” him the ball? I’m sure it was rhetorical but you know me:)
Record Setting Play-Off Drought. On The Bright Side, It's Another Record For This Franchise. :)
by buffalobacker on Mar 2, 2012 10:54 PM EST up reply actions
I wouldn’t trade Eric Wood for the world. That boy gooooooooood…
by Ian MacPersonoid on Mar 1, 2012 2:16 PM EST up reply actions
Also, trading for RGIII would likely mean no playoffs for 1-2 years, and for him and Chan to survive they need to make it soon.
What’s another 1-2 years on top of 12 in exchange for finally having a franchise QB? Besides, Buffalo Bills football always means likely no playoffs for 1-2 years.
Celebrate St. Patrick's Day! Save $10 on a purchase of $50 or more with code: STPATRICK2012.
by twoeightnine on Mar 1, 2012 11:39 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
And people are fooling themselves if they think not trading for the opportunity to draft a phenomenal talent at QB and instead drafting players elsewhere will get them to the playoffs sooner.
The Patriots have very little outside of a passing attack yet there they were, in the Super Bowl again. A franchise QB makes everything better.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:44 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Patriots
When was the last time you saw the Patriots go UP in the draft? Their philosophy is to always acquire more picks, know that some of them won’t pan out.
And as for that passing attack… Tom Brady was picked in the sixth round, not second overall.
Brady
Yeah 6th rd. qb’s are more than likely not gonna come close to Brady, that was a extreme exception to the trend.
I'm my most interesting man in the world. That Dos Equis dude is my valet. And the Bill's will win SB in my lifetime:) I Believe!
by buffalobacker on Mar 1, 2012 12:17 PM EST up reply actions
Didn’t they move up to draft LB Mayo in “08”?
It's easy to have faith in yourself and have discipline when you're a winner, when you're number one. What you got to have is faith and discipline when you're not a winner.
Vince Lombardi
Nope
That pick was traded from SF. NE gave SF their 1st rounder in 2007 (was a pick in the early to mid 20’s) in that deal SF sent NE their 2008 1st rounder.
From memory SF took OT Staley with that 07 pick ?
The Buffalo Bills - Drafting big and nasty men since 2011.
Yes, Tom Brady was picked in the 6th round.
As were hundreds of other QBs who never even made an NFL team. Obviously that’s the best place for the Bills to find their franchise QB.
It’s quite easy to move down in the draft when you already have one of the greatest QBs to ever play playing for one of the greatest coaches ever utilizing a system that teams still haven’t figured out. Three things the Bills don’t have.
Celebrate St. Patrick's Day! Save $10 on a purchase of $50 or more with code: STPATRICK2012.
by twoeightnine on Mar 1, 2012 12:19 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
The Patriots draft philosophy and success is more hype than reality. They have missed on a boat-load of high picks the last few years.
As for their “acquiring” picks each year, all they do is push their picks off, they don’t use them.
"I got no problem with 7-9 coming off of 4-12 as long as I don't buy a couch there, you got to keep moving" - Mike Schoop
Patriots, pt. 2
Yes, there are an enormous number of late round QBs who never did anything. Yes, the Patriots have whiffed on a good number of picks (early and late)… Debating where you draft great QBs could easily be its own website, let alone its own post.
Those arguments actually give more credit to their draft philosophy: PLAY THE ODDS!
Move back, acquire more picks. Thats why they can miss on some guys, hit on some guys and put together a winner year in and year out. Thats why they have guys who step in when someone else is injured and they don’t miss a beat.
The problem is…
The Bills are not the Patriots. They never will be the Patriots. The Patriot way of doing things would fail in Buffalo. Why? They don’t have a coach or a QB anywhere near the level of Belichick or Brady.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:04 PM EST up reply actions
there is no debate
the first round is around 45% of getting a good qb…. past that it’s much, much worse odds
Interesting stat
I agree it’s around 45-50%. I just took a look at 12 years, 1997-2008. Interestingly, the odds are the same whether you are drafting in the top 10 or the rest of the first round.
So I guess I’m leaning toward not giving up a lot of picks to move up to #2, and if our “franchise guy” isn’t there at #10 this year, and look for another one with our #1 pick next year.
Put together a list of late-round QBs with success similar to Tom Brady. It’s a very small list. Even the Patriots weren’t sure about him, illustrated by waiting until the 6th round to take him.
And most people will agree that the Patriots have done well at everything but drafting throughout their dynasty.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:01 PM EST up reply actions
Did you just compare Ryan Fitzpatrick’s “success” to Tom Brady’s?
Did that just happen?
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:33 PM EST up reply actions
Tongue in cheek, hence the smiley face
Clearly no comparison to Brady. The only thing they have in common is where they were drafted, and that they both start in the NFL.
whew
Thank you, that was a “what”? moment for me as well.
I'm my most interesting man in the world. That Dos Equis dude is my valet. And the Bill's will win SB in my lifetime:) I Believe!
by buffalobacker on Mar 1, 2012 10:24 PM EST up reply actions
jack kemp was a 17th rounder... as was bart starr... this was actually sorta fun to look up
ACTIVE:
brady (6th)
schaub(3rd)
bulger (6th)
hasselbeck (6th)
HOF:
warner (UDFA) – okay he’s not HOF yet…
moon (UDFA)
young (supplemental draft)
montana (3rd)
blanda (12th)
fouts (3rd)
jurgenson (4th)
tarkenton (3rd)
unitas (9th)
The NFL has changed.
Besides the fact that Unitas in the 9th round would be a 4th rounder now, the game isn’t the same. Ryan Fitzpatrick threw for more yards this season than Unitas ever threw in a single season. He had more completions than Unitas attempted passes in most seasons.
Montana only bested Fitzpatrick’s yards twice in his career.
Celebrate St. Patrick's Day! Save $10 on a purchase of $50 or more with code: STPATRICK2012.
You don’t need to move up in the Draft when you already have your Tom Brady.
When you don’t have Tom Brady, you need to keep drafting QBs until you get one.
by EvilJohn on Mar 1, 2012 3:21 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
And even when you have one, you draft a Ryan Mallet. A Matt Cassel. A somebody else.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Or
Tank season like colts and get lucky.
I'm my most interesting man in the world. That Dos Equis dude is my valet. And the Bill's will win SB in my lifetime:) I Believe!
by buffalobacker on Mar 1, 2012 10:26 PM EST up reply actions
Sorry
Should’a put a :) afterwards. Still think that Colts tanked season, last I knew Herm Edwards doesn’t work for Colts org. I agree with Herm Edwards for what its worth.
Record Setting Play-Off Drought. On The Bright Side, It's Another Record For This Franchise. :)
by buffalobacker on Mar 2, 2012 10:57 PM EST up reply actions
I find Nix’s predispositions regarding draft picks to be infuriating. Every situation is unique and should be treated differently, but I honestly believe Nix enters all situations with his mind mostly prejudiced before opportunities even present themselves and I think he is easily manipulated by tired cliches as well and slow to adapt.
He “will not call…about that” and “never (has) traded picks”, yet he “kicks the tires on everybody”? Please.
"There's only one C.J. Spiller." -Buddy Nix
by Port Royal on Mar 1, 2012 9:34 AM EST reply actions 3 recs
Well...
Buddy said he would not trade up, which I believe is the right stance in this 2012 draft. But he did not shut the door on trading down and acquiring another pick. I like the sound of that.
"The Amish Rifle is your god now." - Muzza34
by BuffaloOwdaTwnr on Mar 1, 2012 9:36 AM EST up reply actions
that "air’ about him is what has always irked me. The “I know what’s right, don’t give a @#$% what others think/do” attitude is nice if it translates to results. So far, it’s nothing but bombast and hot air.
Put your money where your mouth is Buddy, and show us you know better. I’m tired of hearing you know better.
"a play in which nothing happens, that yet keeps audiences glued to their seats". -Vivian Mercier - a description of Samuel Beckett's "Waiting for Godot"
According to Beckett, Godot was a metaphor for the Buffalo Bills :-)
by fansince60 on Mar 1, 2012 9:44 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Lol so true
"They’re a very special group of men. Cherish them, you will not see their like again."
by chaucer on Mar 1, 2012 11:33 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
So by the end of next year you will dicide that the "air" about him is OK, if they win 9-10 games?
"It’s not news, until Rumblings say its news". -Doctork44
9 wins puts us “back to the future” where we were pre-Nix, so no it won’t be “OK”. It goes deeper than that.
There are 32 teams in the league. There seems to be a certain conventional way of operating…then there’s the Nix way:
Chan is the best choice for HC (yet the offensive genius was fired from last job as an OC).
Spiller was the man his first draft(although RB was the only position of strength).
“OL is the #1 priority” and he drafts Wang and Calloway.
He was (rumored) to be after Von Miller, Cam Newton, blah, blah. Other teams made moves to get their men. He “talks” about it after the fact under the guise of it was “uneconomical” or “ill advised”. “Missed it by that much”… BS.
We’re going to be a 3-4 team (until we’re not).
Fitz is our franchise QB (although 31 other teams didn’t/don’t thinks so)
Merriman has got what it takes to help the defense (as soon as he’s out of the cast- again)
Those 31 other teams are making mistakes putting starters on their practice squads. They don’t see the talent.
And it goes on and on…when he actually does something, this team will get better and wins will take care of themselves. Building through the draft connotes using sturdy building material, not a pile of BS. He’s done squat- except to talk a good game…
"a play in which nothing happens, that yet keeps audiences glued to their seats". -Vivian Mercier - a description of Samuel Beckett's "Waiting for Godot"
According to Beckett, Godot was a metaphor for the Buffalo Bills :-)
by fansince60 on Mar 1, 2012 1:13 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
"OL is the #1 priority" and he drafts Wang and Calloway.
You did see the PFF ranked our OL #4 in the league right? So you are upset that we drastically improved the OL, but didn’t burn a #1 in the process?
He was (rumored) to be after Von Miller, Cam Newton, blah, blah. Other teams made moves to get their men. He "talks" about it after the fact under the guise of it was "uneconomical" or "ill advised". "Missed it by that much"… BS.
How far did the 2 teams who picked those players move to get them? A total of 0 spots, so maybe draft-day manuvering is a tad over-rated.
Fitz is our franchise QB (although 31 other teams didn’t/don’t thinks so)
For all of Fitz’s flaws, which are plenty, there are at least a dozen teams that would be happy to have him as their starter. It’s not like the team is married to him by his contract either.
But, by all means, let’s continue to let our dislike of his “air” continue to cloud facts and reality.
"I got no problem with 7-9 coming off of 4-12 as long as I don't buy a couch there, you got to keep moving" - Mike Schoop
by lonestar_ak on Mar 1, 2012 1:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
lonestar
I know you relish in disagreeing with me and make a point to do so every chance you get, but,
But, by all means, let’s continue to let our dislike of his "air" continue to cloud facts and reality.
Insults such as this aren’t necessary. I’m as grounded in reality as you are. The fact that you have different opinions doesn’t give yours any more veracity. A simple “I disagree” and your reasons would suffice. No need to make references to anyone’s grasp of reality. Thanks
"a play in which nothing happens, that yet keeps audiences glued to their seats". -Vivian Mercier - a description of Samuel Beckett's "Waiting for Godot"
According to Beckett, Godot was a metaphor for the Buffalo Bills :-)
Insults such as this aren’t necessary
Exactly. It’s one thing to attack the idea, it’s another to attack the person. We are all a bunch of guys, sitting around a campfire talking about our favorite team. We all want them to bring the superbowl trophy back to Buffalo. And wouldnt’ mind the Sabres bring back the Stanley Cup back to Buffalo either.
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 1, 2012 2:14 PM EST up reply actions
Insults such as this aren’t necessary.
no they’re not – but you can insult me if you like. I think it’s part of the fun!
Here’s my issues with your original comment:
yet the offensive genius was fired from last job as an OC
now i’m not sure if Chan was the best candidate – I certainly am glad we didn’t get Shanahan but not hiring a coach because they got fired shouldn’t be an indication of the individual. OC’s and DC’s especially get fired routinely in the NFL and some are very good. The Dick Lebeau’s of the world are very few and far between.
"OL is the #1 priority" and he drafts Wang and Calloway.
OL was and may still be a priority but the draft isn’t the only way to build a line. Look at our right side with Urbik and Pears for proof of that. The right side of our line is our best side at this point and we didn’t draft either of those guys.
Other teams made moves to get their men
I think other teams do that to get their team over the top (Stallone approves) but rarely early in a rebuild or in a rebuild unless it’s a QB like Luck. You could make that case for newton though – hard to say if Carolina was listening to offers – Buddy may have called but I doubt it.
I love this plan! I'm excited to be a part of it! LET'S DO IT! - Venkman
by J2 on Mar 1, 2012 2:23 PM EST up reply actions
It wasn't intended as an insult, I was just referencing what you had posted earlier.
Was merely pointing out that I believe your dislike of his style and attitude tend to lead to hyperbole and factually incorrect statements.
I simply argued your points you made in the above post as examples of my belief. I never claimed my opinions have any more veracity.
And I definitely don’t “relish” disagreeing or “do so every chance I get”. I think the number of threads where we have disagreed could be counted on one hand.
"I got no problem with 7-9 coming off of 4-12 as long as I don't buy a couch there, you got to keep moving" - Mike Schoop
I think it’s comical that a guy saying Nix is bombastic and full of hot air, aka insulting another man, is the very one complining of someone insulting him.
Doesn’t feel good does it? Perhaps if you live in a glass house, you shouldn’t throw stones.
Comical
Yeah, real funny DJ O Haha. Fansince60’s is right and I doubt he lives in a glass house but you never know:)
I'm my most interesting man in the world. That Dos Equis dude is my valet. And the Bill's will win SB in my lifetime:) I Believe!
by buffalobacker on Mar 1, 2012 10:44 PM EST up reply actions
If the Bills win 9 games this year you are still not OK with it.
If the Bills win 9 games this year I will be happy, but I am expecting more. Either way, This regieme deserves the opportunity to make what it can out of the slop that was left after 2009. Three years should give us a good indication. This team has all the signs of being a team on the rise to me.
"It’s not news, until Rumblings say its news". -Doctork44
I fully agree with that
He just seems too rigid in his approach to the draft. We’ve certainly seen that thus far in his two offseasons.
For a team that has needed to build depth and could use as many options as possible, it’s irritating that he has yet to move down to acquire more picks. Maybe this draft will be different….
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Mar 1, 2012 9:59 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I agree 100%
While Nix certainly benefits from all the wisdom he’s gleaned from his many years in the NFL, I think this is one of those aspects of the job where his age hurts him. While I don’t mean to suggest that all older people are ideologically rigid and conservative-minded—because that, obviously, is not always the case—I think, in general, we see less creativity, adaptability, and open-mindedness in old managers than in new ones (in the NFL and elsewhere). I’ll take Nix for his intuition on draft picks, but I’m looking forward to the fresh approach that Whaley is sure to bring.
by kai11 on Mar 1, 2012 10:13 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I personally love the fact that he values draft picks so much. It sure sounded like he wants to move down this year. Who knows if he tried to move out of #9 in 2010? I suspect that he tried but didn’t like the value and decided to go with Spiller.
Moving up for us would be crazy! The cost is so high that it could set us back 5-7 years! Nix is the best GM/Draft evaluator we’ve had for a very long time. If you look at the picks over the past two years they’ve been solid all around except for a few misses but the top 4 rounds in each draft have been very solid.
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
I prefer to look at it differently
The cost is so high that it could set us back 5-7 years!
OR….That move could set this franchise up for the next decade and make them a perennial contender by having their franchise QB. I have no clue if Griffin III will be that stud QB, but at some point this team has to take that risk and make a move to acquire that type of player.
He may value draft picks so much, but he doesn’t seem to get the most value out of each one, IMO. By that, I mean trading down for more picks, more depth, etc. I’d love to see him trade down this year because I think the talent is down for that spot in this draft, while certain team (Bears to get Floyd for example, Bengals for Richardson, etc) could view it differently.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Mar 1, 2012 10:30 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I agree. If there is any draft that Nix was to trade down in it’s this one. It’s really deep at positions we could upgrade. More draft picks please.
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 1, 2012 10:44 AM EST up reply actions
Bingo
I’ve been supporting Nix this whole time, but if we go another year without a long term QB in place I am really going to have to start questioning if he is the answer. Every single successful team in the playoffs has a franchise qb. You could argue Alex Smith isn’t a franchise QB as well as Tim Tebow (relax Skip Bayless), but the Packers, Saints, Giants, Falcons, Lions, Patriots, Ravens, Texans, Steelers, and Bengals all have “that guy”.
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
by hoosier3 on Mar 1, 2012 10:49 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I disagree, I think most of this "rigidness" is imposed on to him from fans and media who just have not liked his approach to the team rebuild.
First he was labled a “BPA only” guy when he picked Spiller when the experts said we did not need a RB and we should have picked Bulaga, Davis, or Clausen. That is starting to look like a great pick. Nix has described himself as a “BPA at a position that will have an impact” guy.
Then he was labled as a “BPA that will not move up or down in the draft” guy, bc he flatly said that they would pick at #3 in 2011. If this is true then why did he try to move back up into the first for someone in 2010. Now he has said that if the Bills move from #10 it would be down. It looks to me like he does not approach every draft the same. When he looks at a draft and makes his evaluation of it then he will not be swayed from that approach. This seems to me to be a good thing.
"It’s not news, until Rumblings say its news". -Doctork44
by jbbillfan on Mar 1, 2012 12:44 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I agree with you
I think Nix is smart enough to not get distracted by the noise and not to give in to popular demand. He knows where he’s going. He assembled a solid scouting team and has full trust in the process.
I loved the comment that the Combine results are merely indicators to go re-look at the tape. In the end, you must trust your board, your scouting staff and the overall process.
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
Too rigid?
Or too patient for some fans that demand instant success? I believe Nix is simply sticking to a plan of building thru the draft, low tiered FA’s and the discarded. Then after a few years you can spring for a higher priced FA to fill a hole in your roster. Which is exactly what he has said he will do along.
My prediction is that when he does land the free agent, draft the QB, resign his own and build a contender, most on this site will claim ‘of course, because that’s what I said he should do all along!!’.
You realize that there's a great chance he never gets to implement that long drawn out plan right?
Celebrate St. Patrick's Day! Save $10 on a purchase of $50 or more with code: STPATRICK2012.
by twoeightnine on Mar 1, 2012 11:00 PM EST up reply actions
Cranky?
He said chance, not fact.
Record Setting Play-Off Drought. On The Bright Side, It's Another Record For This Franchise. :)
by buffalobacker on Mar 2, 2012 10:59 PM EST up reply actions
No player is worth
What the Rams will get. He’d better be an all pro or else he just set his team back at least 5 years. I am sure that it will either be the fish or skins that do this trade b/c they feel they are only a QB away from being a playoff team.
I am glad that Buddy knows his team needs way more help then a QB. Next year, if these last 2 drafts are solid, perhaps, but, for a team with at least 5 open spots, no way.
I'd rather go out in a blaze of glory, then slowly fade away in the antiquities of time.
exactly
I’m actively rooting for Miami to land RGIII. as I said in an earlier comment, even a “franchise QB” can’t do it all by himself. how many recent top 5 picks have won the super bowl? only Eli Manning and frankly the Giants won those super bowls with their defense. Eli is decent, but he’s barely pro bowl level (with Brees and Rodgers in his conference).
I’d love for Miami to mortgage its future for a player that hasn’t played a single down in the NFL yet
by paythemannow on Mar 1, 2012 12:25 PM EST up reply actions
Eli Manning is a great QB. A franchise QB. The Giants aren’t Super Bowl champs this year is Eli doesn’t play the way he did.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:56 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I wouldn’t. Miami has a solid foundation for O-Line with Pouncy and Long, and their defense is pretty good.
"Everyone who has conducted an expedition will know how ready the world is to do the great injustice of heaping the whole praise or blame for its success or failure on the shoulders of the leader alone."
-Polar Explorer Fridtjof Nansen
by NordicBillsfan on Mar 1, 2012 3:03 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah.....
I’d prefer RGIII go to the Skins so we don’t have to watch him shred our defense twice a year.
"My new cat just farted on my lap. Smells like Bills football." BG.
by SERGEANT MAJOR THOR on Mar 1, 2012 5:36 PM EST up reply actions
I think the interesting part
is where Buddy says he would move down instead of up if at all (obviously paraphrasing).
I think even this is contradictory to previous quotes where Nix says he doesn’t like to trade at all (up or down). That statement has been backed up the past couple years with the urgency that the front office gets picks to the podium on draft day, often with multiple minutes still on the clock.
Maybe this is a sign that OBD is looking to drop down a few spots and add picks. I’m all for this. We still have a lot of holes to fill and need an influx of talent.
I like that Nix is a straight shooter. If you’ve ever listened to Andy Reid it’s a nice contrast. Reid will never let on what he’s really thinking and does not see a problem with lying to the press.
You don’t think Nix lies to the press? What about all the talk about Poz? What about all the talk of OT being their priority and then coming out of the draft with 5th-round pick Ed Wang?
Buddy Nix is about as trustworthy and straightshooting as a boomerang.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
and you are intitled to that oppinion.
but I did not see a lie in either of those two instances.
He said he wanted to keep Poz, and he got out bid. End of story. He said he wanted to upgrade at OT, but the ones on the board when he picked he did not like. There are 31 other teams involved that sometimes prevents you from doing what you want.
"It’s not news, until Rumblings say its news". -Doctork44
by jbbillfan on Mar 1, 2012 12:51 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Agreed. The other teams may not prevent you from doing what you want, but they certainly may not make it worth while (i.e. you end up having to give up way more than you want to achieve the results you’re looking for).
Give a monkey a typewriter and infinite time, and he’ll eventually release Maybin. -- stetzwebs
No one circles the waiver wire like the Buffalo Bills!
My issue is with Nix and his staff’s ability to diagnose talent. They didn’t like a single OT enough until the 5th round? How important was the position to them then? I get that they can’t control anything but the pick they have at any given moment.
It’s why I despise trading down. There’s no guarantee any of the players they want to trade down to obtain at a lower rate are available. Trading up increases the chances the team lands the player(s) they want.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:55 PM EST up reply actions
I dont think it is fair to say that they cant evaluate talent
just bc they did not pick a player at a position that they claimed was a priority in the 2010 draft. It does not in any way say that they did not like any player until the 5th round. What it says is that they wanted to address the position early, the guy they thought would be an upgrade over Bell was not available in the first. So they moved on to other positions. There is a lot more going on than LT is a priority position so we will get a LT in the first no matter what. That is the sort of pick that would tell me that they cant evaluate talent. The fact is they got a guy with that pick that is likely to become a game changer on a regular basis. That means they can evaluate talent.
"It’s not news, until Rumblings say its news". -Doctork44
Jbb.........
Agree.
Don’t forget that Buddy made a run at Clabo from Atlanta and he took less money to stay there.
"My new cat just farted on my lap. Smells like Bills football." BG.
by SERGEANT MAJOR THOR on Mar 1, 2012 6:37 PM EST up reply actions
Good
My faith is restored! The cost would have simply been too much.
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
Because swimming in suck for another 5+ seasons is less costly?
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:28 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I think we are on the right track, so lets agree to disagree.
Giving up our next two 1sts and next two 2nds would be WAY too expensive IMO.
I posted this on another comment earlier today. I looked at mobile QBs since 1995 and honestly there is nobody from that list that remotely comes close to being worth that price.
If you take an honest look at past drafts and look at the success rate of mobile QBs over pure pocket passers, you’ll see that very few have succeeded. Why? I don’t know but it’s the truth.
1995 Steve McNair (3rd) & Kordell Stuart (60th)
1997 Jake Plummer (42)
1999 McNabb (2) Akili Smith (3)
2001 Mike Vick (1)
2004 Big Ben (11) JP Losman (22)
2006 Vince Young (3) Jay Cutler (11) Tarvaris Jackson (64)
2009 Josh Freeman (17) Pat White (44)
2010 Tim Tebow (25)
2011 Cam Newton (1) Jake Locker (8) Kaepernick (36)
These were the mobile QBs that were drafted in the first two rounds since 1995, from this list how many have won the Superbowl? How many are/were "franchise" QBs? How many learned to harness their athleticism and become a "pure pocket passer with escape-ability? The answer is not many. Other than Big Ben, nobody from this list is worth 2 firsts and two seconds. And I’d add that if it wasn’t for his beastly size and toughness, Big Ben wouldn’t be worth it either because he’s never developed the "intelligence" side of it either. HE has had success because he can scramble, has very fast receivers that can eventually get open and Big ben can throw with 4 guys draped on him – that’s not playing the QB position the way that he should, it’s because of his toughness and size that he gets away with it.
Trading up for RGIII at that price is crazy! It would set us back another 5-7 years
Ben at 11, Plummer at 42, Cutler at 11, Freeman at 17 and Tebow at 25
There is no reason to sell the farm trying to convince ourselves that we’ll never get another chance. These guys all got drafted deeper in the draft. The cost to move up to 17 is much cheaper than the crazy price that it will take to get up to 2 this year.
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
by keysh67 on Mar 1, 2012 12:07 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Excellent points
Trading up for RGIII at that price is crazy! It would set us back another 5-7 years
As much as we all want a franchise type QB the risk of giving up so much is just way too high….
.
It's easy to have faith in yourself and have discipline when you're a winner, when you're number one. What you got to have is faith and discipline when you're not a winner.
Vince Lombardi
I can’t agree with your thoughts on mobile QBs. Why does RG3 have to be a mobile QB as defined by the stereotype? His measureables are very close to Andrew Luck’s and you won’t hear anyone using mobile to describe Luck within the first 5 breaths of their comment.
And these guys would be worth a similar investment: McNair, McNabb, Vick, Roethlisberger (hello, Mr Super Bowl), Cam Newton. I’d even throw Josh Freeman’s name in there.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:07 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The games i watched of RGIII last year were great but one thing was crystal clear, he does not possess good pocket presence. He relies on his legs and quickness way too much. He played like a mobile QB as opposed to Luck who really possesses tremendous pocket presence even though he can escape with his legs. Luck has the internal clock in his head almost to perfection whereas RGIII does not seem to have it. Can he develop into a pocket passer? Probably but in my book he is a mobile QB, exactly like Cam was last year coming out. Many had the same argument as you last year about Cam and judging by his 14 rushing TDs, looks like his mobility took over in pressure situations. It’s not a bad thing at all but history proves that mobile guys don’t necessarily succeed as much as pure pocket passers.
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
The only knock I have on him is the level of competition. But he looked like a pro playing at Baylor.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:50 PM EST up reply actions
Yep (sadly)
"WHEN THE WAGON BLASTER TAKES OFF dont try to get in. THE SPACESES ARE LIMITED FOR WINNING ATTITUDE GODZILLA IS COMING GET READY" - abayarde
by StroudFanClub on Mar 1, 2012 4:00 PM EST up reply actions
And I was in a similar place last year with Newton. If one thing’s clear with me, it’s that I want them to draft a QB in the first round, and one clearly defined as a first-rate, first-round QB.
So I guess I need to support them losing nearly every game next season. I think that’s the only way this regime drafts one: by losing more than anyone else.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:52 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
You make it sound like the only QBs that ever succeeded were drafted in the top 3
What about these guys:
Josh Freeman at 17
Joe Flacco at 18
Aaron Rodgers at 24
Jason Campbell at 25
Big Ben at 11
Drew Brees at 32
Tom Brady at 199
Just trying to point to the fact that great QBs can be had outside of the top 3 and the sky won’t fall if we don’t get a QB this year. There will be opportunities next year and the year after that. There is no need to sell the farm to get the cow, otherwise where will your cow sleep?
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
Right. I agree. But all the QBs you listed (besides Brady) were talked about as first-round QBs. If the Bills don’t go all in for a player on the level that RG3 is, they’ll be toying with Christian Ponder and Colt McCoy types.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:11 PM EST up reply actions
?
I just gave you 6 QBs taken between 11 and 32 and arguably one of the best of all time taken at 199 and you’re response is to cite two guys that were projected in rounds 2-3 ? I’m not sure what you want here? Clearly you prefer mortgaging the future for RGIII and you are entitled to your opinion, I just don’t share that opinion. I want a Franchise QB as much as anybody else around here but I’m not willing to mortgage our future on a guess. I also believe that Fitzy can bring us into the playoffs and possibly to the dance. I believe he can be our version of Rich Ganon
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
I don’t think any of the QBs outside of Luck or RG3 can be considered solid 1st-round prospects. The QBs you listed were all considered solid 1st-round prospects.
Tannehill, Osweilier, and whomever else i’m forgetting are not considered true 1st-round talents. They’ll become products of a franchise QB-starved league.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:25 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
My point was not specific to this year
I was making the point that Solid QBs can be had other than top3 and we don’t need to mortgage the future. We can wait until next year or the year after. I still belive that we can build around Fitz in the meantime. If Dielfer or Brad Johnson can win a Superbowl, then Fitz probably could as well. And believe me I am not suggesting to necessarily stay with Fitz long term, I’m saying that he’s shown enough to give him this year to show us the money and in the meanwhile lets continue to build the team. We can address QB next year
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
But at some point, waiting
until next year or the year afteris going to reach a boiling point with fans. I know an NFL team can’t build based primarily around the fanbase’s emotions. But it’s time to stop f’ing around with these journeymen QBs.
Fitzpatrick wasn’t even their guy to begin with. They didn’t discover him. They simply had no choice but to play him over the gunshy Edwards. I don’t see what Fitzpatrick has done as anything better than average. It’s simply that we as Bills fans have lowered our expectations when it comes to QBs.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 2, 2012 10:15 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It’s simply that we as Bills fans have lowered our expectations when it comes to QBs.
I don’t think that true at all. Fitz clearly was completely diffrent after that hit he took from London Fletcher. He really showed some solid hope with his performance up to that point. He reminds me of Rich Gannon in so many ways.
I’m not suggesting to give him a pass forever and if we could get RGIII without having to mortgage our future then I’d have no problems at all drafting the kid. But given the crazy price we’d have to pay, it just makes business sense to wait another year. For the record I don’t like Tannenhill mainly because i read somewhere that his hand size is super small and that’s one of the worse things for a QB, especially in a cold weather city. So I prefer to trade down and wait another year before addressing that position (if in fact we even need to)
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
Fitz
I wanna believe Fitz is answer but I’m remembering great scheming by coach at beginning of yr, than a downward spiral once opposing coaches figured Chan out. Kudos to Chan. We still need infusion of TALENT we sadly are lacking. This could take a while, hopefully I’m still kicking to see Bill’s at very least reach play-offs but I’m less and less optimistic and saddened by fans defending a org. that continually loses to point of setting a record. I think some fans are delusional or just ignorant to history of franchise. We’ve had decent draft position for yrs and what have we gained? I question management/ownership this fandom, deserves far and away better product! I don’t blqame Chan or Nix it starts at top. End rant.
Record Setting Play-Off Drought. On The Bright Side, It's Another Record For This Franchise. :)
by buffalobacker on Mar 2, 2012 11:08 PM EST up reply actions
You are right to be upset with the franchise
I am too! I love Ralph but he should not be running the show, he should have sold a while ago. I digress…
I really hope that the smoke signals we’ve been seeing are real this time. What I mean is Buddy’s comments the other day imply he will be active at midnight for a difference maker. They also said that they can roll over some of the unspent capo space from last year. IMO there is really only one difference maker hitting the market.
I am crossing my fingers!
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
Brees was drafted in the first round? thought he was drafted early 2nd?
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 1, 2012 3:49 PM EST up reply actions
He was pick 32 or, said another way, the first pick of round 2. I can’t recall which team lost their first-round pick that year.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 2, 2012 10:18 AM EST up reply actions
there are 32 picks in the first round…….. 32 teams. 33rd pick would be the first pick in the second round.
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 2, 2012 9:01 PM EST up reply actions
Yep (sadly)
"WHEN THE WAGON BLASTER TAKES OFF dont try to get in. THE SPACESES ARE LIMITED FOR WINNING ATTITUDE GODZILLA IS COMING GET READY" - abayarde
by StroudFanClub on Mar 1, 2012 4:00 PM EST up reply actions
Can you prove that will happen to the Bills without RG3??
"It’s not news, until Rumblings say its news". -Doctork44
Why would you ask that? Of course he can’t. Everything everyone says on this site is speculation, even all the people saying that the Bills will be better off with those picks than with RG3.
"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.
bc one seems way more likely to be proven then the other.
If I make a comment that I think the Bills will be 10-6 next year, it would be speculative but I could lay out some tangable signs that lead me to believe that. Can their even be any tangable signs to prove that we will be swimming in suck for the next 5 years if we dont bet the farm on one guy?
I was just curious what would make a person say something like that and so was asking for some sort of proof.
"It’s not news, until Rumblings say its news". -Doctork44
Who where you addressing your ? to?
It's easy to have faith in yourself and have discipline when you're a winner, when you're number one. What you got to have is faith and discipline when you're not a winner.
Vince Lombardi
Afghan,
not you Goose 22, sometimes I have to hold my finger on the screen and scroll up and down to see who a reply is to. Then my eyes start to bugg out.
"It’s not news, until Rumblings say its news". -Doctork44
Or you could hit the “up” button.
When the job is finished no one remembers how long it took, just how well it was performed.
by Buffalo for Eternity on Mar 1, 2012 5:04 PM EST up reply actions
Given the history of this franchise, not going for it (a franchise-defining QB in this case) could very well prove to be a tangible sign things will continue to suck for years.
They’ve drafted player after player in the first round over the last 12 years, and of those players many either flamed and let go, or were traded for far less than the initial cost.
So i’d love for them to give it a go with a guy like Griffin (or Luck if the Colts surprise everyone).
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:04 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I agree that our draft results for a long time have been horrible but Nix has managed to draft well in his first two years, which is what gives me hope for the future. He’s got a plan and he’s sticking to it. So far so good!
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
I don’t think his first draft was good at all. I won’t add in Dareus because anyone with a thumb could have picked Dareus. Dareus took no thought, in my opinion. He’s a good pick because he’s an undisputed top-of-the-draft talent.
But Spiller was a mistake.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:49 PM EST up reply actions
But Spiller was a mistake.
I can’t agree with that
He will be a playmaker for us for many years to come. Marshawn was one strike away from not playing for a whole year and there really wasn’t any other sure bet on the board when we picked Spiller. We’ll never know how hard they tried to trade down, so assuming they did and nobody offered anything of value, then Spiller made absolute sense.
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
by keysh67 on Mar 1, 2012 3:09 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If he becomes a feature back in Buffalo, and a consistent playmaker, they’ll lose him in FA.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:12 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Pour yourself a stiff one tonight because you are definitely frustrated and need to relax.
If you are trying to make a parallel to Stevie – I’ll remind you that he’s not lost yet and I doubt he’s going anywhere. But in any case complaining about it before it even happens is senseless.
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
No parallels to Stevie. They also didn’t draft him and he wasn’t picked in the first.
I just have a feeling they’ll believe they can find affordable talent at RB without paying Spiller.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:19 PM EST up reply actions
you might be right but is there anything wrong with that?
If we can constantly have a very good RB tandem without having to overspend, isn’t that what the GM is supposed to do? If Spiller becomes the next Falk, then for sure he will get rewarded otherwise maybe not.
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
The only thing wrong with it was using a first to get him. I want them to find irreplaceable players in the first round. Players worth heavy investments.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:26 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Oh and a drink wouldn’t help me. Running would be nice though.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:19 PM EST up reply actions
LOL. You have to understand how frustrated I am as a fan to never see the team I love do the things I feel should be priority. It’s getting old that most of our favorite memories and players were from the last Super Bowl team. It’s like the book ended and they tried to write a sequel on wet paper.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:32 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
TAT
I’m gonna venture a quess keysh67 is a younger fan than you and I:) If not he’s the most optimistic fan in Bill’s history.
I'm my most interesting man in the world. That Dos Equis dude is my valet. And the Bill's will win SB in my lifetime:) I Believe!
by buffalobacker on Mar 1, 2012 10:48 PM EST up reply actions
His signature states his patient, optimistic nature. Nothing wrong with it. I wish I was there with him. I also wish the Bills were a much better organization.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 2, 2012 10:20 AM EST up reply actions
lol
Didn’t even read his sig, funny.
Record Setting Play-Off Drought. On The Bright Side, It's Another Record For This Franchise. :)
by buffalobacker on Mar 2, 2012 11:10 PM EST up reply actions
If David Nelson wasn't lying
If David Nelson wasn’t lying (safe bet), then Ryan Fitzpatrick broke his ribs right before his season went downhill.
If that’s true, it’s also a safe bet that Nix/Gailey knew that Fitzpatrick broke his ribs.
Therefore, I don’t think it’s a stretch to say that they’re optimists regarding Fitzpatrick’s future when his ribs aren’t broken.
They gave him a $59M contract, of course they're optimistic about his future....
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
well...
they did that before the season crumbled. I think paull is saying that they are currently optimistic despite his second half struggles because of the injury.
by Slick Shifty on Mar 1, 2012 10:29 AM EST up reply actions
Another way to look at it is that Fitzpatrick may be too stubborn to sit and heal and he obviously cannot perform well injured.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:29 AM EST up reply actions
I wish someone was optimistic about my future.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:28 AM EST up reply actions
I’m optimistic about your future Afghan
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 1, 2012 11:33 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
LOL. This feels like a Jack Handy moment.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
ummm, what is a Jack Handy moment……… is it similar to the commercial on tv about having a Journey moment?
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 1, 2012 11:56 AM EST up reply actions
here you go:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSrXpFb7jFo
"a play in which nothing happens, that yet keeps audiences glued to their seats". -Vivian Mercier - a description of Samuel Beckett's "Waiting for Godot"
According to Beckett, Godot was a metaphor for the Buffalo Bills :-)
ooops sorry
here’s a real one:
http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/fuzzy-memories-by-jack-handy/1176995/
"a play in which nothing happens, that yet keeps audiences glued to their seats". -Vivian Mercier - a description of Samuel Beckett's "Waiting for Godot"
According to Beckett, Godot was a metaphor for the Buffalo Bills :-)
I have not watched Saturday night live in……… 28 years. But anyway, i’m a pretty postitive person, unless the facts bear out differently. Always try to give a person a pat on the back, lift there spirit with encouragement, instead of the opposite.
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 1, 2012 12:40 PM EST up reply actions
Very nice way to be. I was being cynical and it’s my own fault with the work situation. But your comments are a “fresh of breath air.” — Robert Royal
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:09 PM EST up reply actions
I like it
Trading down is the right thing to do in this draft, as long as its not too far down. then we get to fill at least like 4 outstanding holes and the rest can be quality depth.
Great interview!!
I really like our GM, straight shooter, great experience.
I really think we are in good hands for these rebuilding years.
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
Good man
The fact that Buddy Nix isn’t trying to sell the farm (or so he says) to draft a player is encouraging news. It’s a sign of a man who deals with the reality of the situation. The Bills are still in a rebuilding phase, one player won’t fix the problem and that one player isn’t the problem with the current team.
Do the Bills really need all those draft picks? History has shown it’s best to draft stud players, not sit back and draft whomever is next on a list when time’s a tickin’.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:30 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I don’t think it is so much sitting back and drafting who’s next. I think it is a matter of being intelligent with the pick. If that means trading up, or accepting a trade back then so be it. I’ve never been a guy to want the popular pick just because it’s flashy. I just want a solid draft that shows competence.
Nix’s answers are pretty equivocal. “No,” “No,” and “No,” what could he mean?
"You can't spell, 'The Buffalo Bills Win the Superbowl,' without 'Buffalo Bills.'" - Me
He doesn’t want pickles on his burger.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:30 AM EST up reply actions
I felt he wouldn't call
Price was too much at 10 to move up to 2. If we were just a QB away from being a playoff, and or Superbowl contender, then things would be different. As much as i would like to see RG3 be our QB of the future, it doesn’t make sense to when we have so many positions to improve upon talent wise. I guess if your going to see RG3 play, your going to have to go to some Browns games to see play.
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 1, 2012 10:10 AM EST reply actions
But the key is draft and mold him now while the team is struggling. Then in a few years, the QB is likely ready and hopefully the team figures out how to stop someone.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:31 AM EST up reply actions
Going off the draft value chart
2nd pick in the draft is worth 2600 pts. Clevelands picks #4 1800, #22- 780 pts., so just those two picks together are worth 2580 pts. Throw in a 5th rounder in this years draft, 40 pts, now your at 2620 pts. I think that would be the starting point and other teams will have to beat that. The Browns can upgrade there pick to a 4th round this year (100 pts.), and tack on a future pick in next years draft if they needed too. If Cleveland really wants RG3, i just don’t see anyother team beating them in a bidding war.
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 1, 2012 10:28 AM EST reply actions
Two firsts and two seconds seems like something the Bills should consider giving up for players of Luck or RG3’s ability. One of the two will be there. If they don’t do it, Miami may.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:33 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
ok, let’s look at the value. what we do know is that our pick #10 is worth 1300 pts. and our 2nd round pick is worth 490 pts. so just for this year, your at 1790 pts. So now let’s try to project where we will be in next seasons draft……. 8-8 seems reasonable to expect, so we may have the 18th pick in the draft, which has a value of 900 pts. and our 2nd round pick would have a value of 400 pts., so now your offer is 3090 pts. Nice offer, but if the Bills snuck into the playoffsas a wild card, the offer would drop to 2930. I think Cleveland could top that pretty easily no only in this years draft by upgrading there bid from a 5th, to a 3rd and offering a 2nd rounder next year, thus they would be giving 2 1st rounders this year, a 3rd this year, and a 2nd rounder next year, blowing our offer away, not just by total number value, but the Rams would only slide 2 positions in the process.
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 1, 2012 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
I think the biggest factor in your analysis is the slide amount, or lack thereof with the Browns.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:11 PM EST up reply actions
Yes, and the fact that the Browns can offer another first rounder in this draft, instead of next years draft would be enticing as well. Next years draft will be weakened because of so many red-shirt juniors, juniors, and a few red-shirt sophmores declared for this draft. so the more draft picks they get now, will also sway there decision. I think that is why Nix said what he said, trading back is an option because of the shear depth of this draft. I’m sure the Rams are on this same page as well. Even though i think this move is all on the Browns, i could see the Rams asking too much, trying to fleece them, and the Browns backing out.
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 1, 2012 3:08 PM EST up reply actions
The draft chart was shot down years ago.
And even if it wasn’t, would be completely different now with the way contracts are handed out.
Celebrate St. Patrick's Day! Save $10 on a purchase of $50 or more with code: STPATRICK2012.
by twoeightnine on Mar 1, 2012 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
good point, but until the NFL posts something differently, then this is the only thing we can go off from.
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 1, 2012 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
The NFL never posted anything.
It was something Jimmy Johnson came up with and ESPN posted and then became gospel for couch draftniks everywhere. Would you look at sales reports from 2004 to decide which stocks to buy today?
Celebrate St. Patrick's Day! Save $10 on a purchase of $50 or more with code: STPATRICK2012.
by twoeightnine on Mar 1, 2012 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
only if i could compare the 2004 stock report to today’s stock report then go back into time and make the purchase in 2004. But back to the draft value chart, was not aware Jimmy Johnson produced the report. When you google it, it’s always linked to the NFL/CBS sites. But when you think of it, I wouldn’t think he produced it unless it was similar to what GM’s use to determine if your getting proper value or not. As a manager myself, reports and statistical analysis is important to determine whether your decision to lets say, purchase and upgrade in a piece of equipment in the machine shop and how long the pay off is in the best interest for the company.
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 1, 2012 12:07 PM EST up reply actions
So would you look at a catalog quoting prices from 2004
to purchase equipment today? Of course not.
Celebrate St. Patrick's Day! Save $10 on a purchase of $50 or more with code: STPATRICK2012.
by twoeightnine on Mar 1, 2012 12:14 PM EST up reply actions
Correct……. of course not. Unless a current GM updates what draft nik have available to them, we will never truely know how out of date it is. But i’m willing to go out on a limb and say they use something, and that they don’t “wing it”. Winging it would only cost a GM, or any manager his or her job.
Are we drafting Dino's now?
"6'6" monster receiver with a Terradactyl wingspan "....... Keysh67
by Billsfanstuckinthesouth on Mar 1, 2012 12:32 PM EST up reply actions
Nix has been extremely active in developing the scouting department since he arrived.
He apparently is set in his ways, most of the older generation is especially when they have seen it work numerous times. If it aint broke then don’t fix it. Let’s see what Nix’s background and experience has to offer our Bills. Let’s let this scouting department that he has constructed work it’s magic and see if we can put something together. We have a lot of fans that look at things like “What have you done for me lately”. That is not the Buffalo Bills way. I feel that his draft will help put our team in a need of two to three players to compete annually with recognition Vs the 5-8 players we have been looking to upgrade for what seems to be an enternity. We are all still very anxious, but we all still need just a little bit more patients.
YOU ARE OUT of you kuku fufu mine craker laker Flaber baber FUNKI chunki brain. WE want to winn every year -- abayarde
But then what happens when they need those 2-3 players and one of them is a QB and another is a dominant pass rusher? Neither of those things grow on NFL trees. Both of those things are available this year. Both of those things aren’t short-term investments, either.
Suppose the Bills do, as you say, get to the point where they can “compete” but they’ve just at the 8-8 or 9-7 point. They will have poor draft placement to get a QB. This is the year to get their guy. This is the year to worry about cap space later and just sign Mario Williams.
I’m so tired of this franchise hoping for the best with middle-of-the-road players. I want them to play ball like the big boys do.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:37 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Tom brady, Aron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Big Ben. Guys you can argue stay in the top 5 qbs. None of them where drafted in the top 10.
"This is a chance to shine some light on the city, They say it’s too cold. I’m going to bring some warmth to it." Marcell Dareus
by matthew62 on Mar 1, 2012 11:46 AM EST via Android app up reply actions 1 recs
Look at the organizations employing them. Outside of New Orleans (which I have no idea about), the Patriots, Packers, and Steelers are some of the most well-run organizations in all of sports.
You can’t honestly feel comfortable thinking the Bills are adept enough in finding, drafting, and molding a late(er) round QB into one of the guys mentioned above, can you? If one thing’s true of the Bills it’s that management is highly scrutinized. I feel they need an exceptional talent at QB to hide some of the deficiencies they hold in running an NFL team.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:26 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yet you are arguing for the bills to.trade the farm for rg3. A guy who.needs some development. Have you seen him play. I think he is going to be a good quarterback just not good enough to bet the farm on. Especially since I think he might struggle a little the first few years.
"This is a chance to shine some light on the city, They say it’s too cold. I’m going to bring some warmth to it." Marcell Dareus
by matthew62 on Mar 1, 2012 3:14 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
There are less criticisms of RG3’s game than there were of Cam Newton’s. Newton went to a team nearly void of talent. Newton was awesome.
RG3 is a brilliant young man and it’s his brain that has me hoping for a miracle trade. He’s Fitzpatrick with nearly unparalleled athleticism.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:17 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
"What have you done for me lately". That is not the Buffalo Bills way.
Only because Bills fans live in the past. What have the Bills done lately? Nothing. When you have the longest postseason drought in the NFL (that your fanbase constantly glosses over) you have done nothing recently. Fact of the matter is the NFL is a “what have you done for me lately” league now. That’s why teams have no problem walking away from older franchise players every year. But in Buffalo a 3 year rebuild all of a sudden becomes a 5 year rebuild because we can kind of compare this team to one that existed over 20 years ago.
Celebrate St. Patrick's Day! Save $10 on a purchase of $50 or more with code: STPATRICK2012.
by twoeightnine on Mar 1, 2012 12:12 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
SAID NO TO WILL NOT CALL SO, THAT MEANS HE STILL MIGHT CALL.
Even if it was the bills do u think they would discuss this publicly, but its probably the patriots….
I heard the Patriots may make a play to land Mario Williams. If so, the Bills might as well just close up shop for two additional weeks each year.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:38 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Can you imagine this: The Pats get Williams, the Fins get Manning, the Jets get RGIII (rumored to be mystery team).
We might as well close up shop for 6 weeks each year, oh wait…we have been.
"a play in which nothing happens, that yet keeps audiences glued to their seats". -Vivian Mercier - a description of Samuel Beckett's "Waiting for Godot"
According to Beckett, Godot was a metaphor for the Buffalo Bills :-)
by fansince60 on Mar 1, 2012 12:00 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
RG3 won’t break the bank with his contract. At least not by NFL standards.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:27 PM EST up reply actions
Unrelated
When will the NFL schedule be released this year? I know that they announced a Wednesday game so they won’t interfere with Obama’s speech, but when will we find out if the Bills will have a Sunday/Monday night game?
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
Starting to get annoyed with this regime.
Fix the f’ing QB problem. Yes. It’s a problem. So is stockpiling picks for players you don’t know how to use well.
Very perturbed by these comments from Nix. Loyalty in all senses of the word will be his undoing.
Happy March 1st!
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:26 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
"I've visited with (the Rams)," Nix continued, "but not about that.
Do you think that Nix is interested in Brandon Lloyd?
He probably wants Steven Jackson.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:39 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Someone need to relax today.
Give a monkey a typewriter and infinite time, and he’ll eventually release Maybin. -- stetzwebs
No one circles the waiver wire like the Buffalo Bills!
Not really. I simply care little for Buddy Nix.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:29 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Rams have a new FO and HC. Typically they want “their guys” and are willing to trade players they do not want. It is possible Nix was inquiring on certain players that might be available.
When the job is finished no one remembers how long it took, just how well it was performed.
by Buffalo for Eternity on Mar 1, 2012 1:19 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
There was a report the mystery team was the jets.
"This is a chance to shine some light on the city, They say it’s too cold. I’m going to bring some warmth to it." Marcell Dareus
by matthew62 on Mar 1, 2012 11:29 AM EST via Android app reply actions
Offense was not the problem last year
Interceptions were a big problem, yes. But the biggest problem was the lack of QB pressure. Not sure something like Ditka’s trading all his picks for Ricky Williams would be the right approach. Or even Atlanta giving up all those picks for Julio Jones. One player is not going to solve all your problems.
For instance Why is St. Louis picking at the #2 spot when they have Sam Bradford?
by Bill Frank on Mar 1, 2012 11:38 AM EST reply actions 3 recs
Injuries played a big part in their continued failure.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
Excellent point against selling the farm for one player...
Why is St. Louis picking at the #2 spot when they have Sam Bradford?
For the win.
.
"What you gotta understand something about these guys. To them, money is more or less, uh, a hobby. Violence on the other hand is their real vocation." --James Lennox
Cause they stink in other area’s—-:)
It's easy to have faith in yourself and have discipline when you're a winner, when you're number one. What you got to have is faith and discipline when you're not a winner.
Vince Lombardi
by Goose22 on Mar 1, 2012 1:34 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
exactly
Their line was decimated last year, no RB behind Steven Jackson and he was injured most of the year and he has no real weapons to throw to.
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
When Amendola (sp?) is a huge loss at WR, you know there’s going to be trouble.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:30 PM EST up reply actions
How many teams made the playoffs this season without a franchise quarterback?
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
by hoosier3 on Mar 1, 2012 1:42 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Depends on who's definition of "franchise QB" you use.
I say 5 of the 12 teams don’t have great QB.
by BuffaloBlueBlood on Mar 1, 2012 2:23 PM EST up reply actions
The only two you could argue aren’t are Tim Tebow and Alex Smith, at least in my opinion. Brees, Rodgers, Eli Manning, Stafford, and Matt Ryan are locks in the NFC. Brady, Flacco, Roethlisberger, and Dalton are franchise QB’s in the AFC. Schaub is, too, but he was hurt.
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
Dalton might be, someday. He certainly wasn’t super impressive this year, he did just enough.. But you can call him “franchise” or any other stupid title you want. Schaub is pretty good, but not great. I mean, you guys all seem to think this “franchise QB” will be the hero and “lead us to the playoffs” So, if Schaub is so great, hoe come this year was the first time he lead the Texans to the playoffs, when he’s been playing for them since like 2007?
by BuffaloBlueBlood on Mar 1, 2012 3:10 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I’ve never liked Schaub. I think he’s considered great because of fantasy football.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 3:14 PM EST up reply actions
So I'll stick by my statement.
Almost half of the teams that made the playoffs don’t have quarterbacks that I would consider “great”. A couple of them are sort of crummy.
by BuffaloBlueBlood on Mar 1, 2012 6:24 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
The Texans backed into the playoffs after Schaub was hurt. Did you not notice how they were one of the best teams in the AFC when he was playing. 7-3 before he was hurt, 3-3 after.
As a Bills fan, if you don’t recognize the need for a franchise quarterback (stupid title? seems fairly simple to me) then there is absolutely nothing I can say to make you understand their importance to a team. We had one, once, and he led us to the playoffs just about every year (Flutie did get us to the playoffs once). Since he has been gone, we haven’t done too well. We’ve had a really good defense, some really good running backs, but haven’t won a playoff game in what seems like forever. The closest thing we have had to a franchise qb was Drew Bledsoe, and not surprisingly that’s the closest we’ve been since the drought began.
There’s a reason quarterbacks go so early in the draft. There is a reason some team will trade a bunch of picks for a shot at RG3. That reason is not only making the playoffs, but winning it all, which for most of us is the ultimate goal. You can argue those guys that made the playoffs this year all you want, but when was the last time an average qb lifted Lombardi?
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
Denver and San Fran and…maybe Baltimore? Who else?
"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.
Disagree, disagree. Dalton is a good QB and had a good rookie season, and Schaub is fantastic when healthy.
"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.
Well we’ll just have to disagree then. I didn’t think Dalton was all gat impressive this year. I think in a few years we’ll be calling him “serviceable”.
And as for Schaub, I’d like to know how you judge the success of a QB. You long for a "franchise QB that will lead the Bills to he playoffs, right? Matt Schaub has had a major role on ONE playoff team – this year’s Houston Texans. He had a great statistical year in 2009, but nothing about him says “great” to me.
by BuffaloBlueBlood on Mar 1, 2012 8:42 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Well, he’s consistently in the top ten in the league when healthy. That’s enough for me.
"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.
So, if Fitz is in the top ten for the next five years, but the Bills still don’t make the playoffs the first four, he’d be a “franchise” QB?
by BuffaloBlueBlood on Mar 1, 2012 10:57 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Not sure where the word “franchise” came from. You said “great”, and I think that putting up top ten numbers consistently, including several game winning drives, makes you “great”.
"Slowly all the roles we act out become our identity. And in the end we are what we pretend to be." - Jerry Cantrell.
How many teams made the playoffs this season without a franchise quarterback?
That is the question that started his whole string of comments
by BuffaloBlueBlood on Mar 2, 2012 9:13 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
That was from me
And I stand by my comment. To me, a franchise quarterback is one in which you can build your team around for the foreseeable future. It really isn’t that difficult to understand. Teams that have a franchise quarterback are not looking to improve at that position. Teams without a franchise qb are constantly looking for that guy. We have been looking for that guy for a long time, I think most Bills fans should comprehend what one is simply by not having one for so long.
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
I would argue that Luck might be worth it
if you told me that we could get luck for our 1st and 2nd in 2012/2013 then I think i’d be willing to take that chance. I really believe that he is the next Peyton Manning.
Rebuilding a team properly takes time and patience
I think Luck’s worth whatever picks it takes to steal him. I wouldn’t have a problem with the Bills giving up multiple firsts for him.
Afterall, the Bills do their best work late in the draft.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:31 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Okay..
I’ll buy it Buddy.. I agree that the price is too steep to jump up and grab rg3 or Luck depending on who is drafted number one overall..and everybody understands that we have many starters to find in the draft and FA.. Not even going into our insane lack of depth at many positions. So I’m fine drafting what we need to draft this year. We have to have a pass rush.. We need another reciever, tightend and Corner.. Safety depth and guard depth play a background to our need for a bluechip Lt.. However…. Next year… WE HAVE TO move up or do whatever it takes to Get our Francise Qb.. There will be many qb’s next year that could fit the bill.. But if chix doesn’t make it happen then they have to be shown the door.
I dont Know Joe, Even if the Jets were Battling Hitler for control of the free world..i still probably wouldn't root for the Jets
by Stabby Mcshank on Mar 1, 2012 11:41 AM EST via mobile reply actions
If he passes this year and they stink again…passing next year should lead ot an immediate removal from the premises. They can’t keep telling fans to wait. They may have only been here a few years but they need to realize without our interest, there are no good time happy fun days in RWS.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:48 AM EST up reply actions
If they stink this year it's not going to matter what he does next year.
No one is going to watch him play golf on draft day.
Celebrate St. Patrick's Day! Save $10 on a purchase of $50 or more with code: STPATRICK2012.
by twoeightnine on Mar 1, 2012 12:00 PM EST up reply actions
You’re wrong. He’ll be sleeping. More time to nap = sleeping through the draft.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:32 PM EST up reply actions
Technically we do not have as much power as we tend to think. They get most of their money from tv deals not ticket sales and if everyone just stops supporting them they move.
"This is a chance to shine some light on the city, They say it’s too cold. I’m going to bring some warmth to it." Marcell Dareus
by matthew62 on Mar 1, 2012 12:05 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
If things continue the way they have been for ages, the fans will naturally allow it to happen. I stopped supporting them with my wallet when they stopped showing me they were serious about winning.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:29 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Good Point
I want them to do whatever it takes to get that franchise quarterback. They aren’t getting Luck, so if they have 2 or 3 guys rated higher than RG3 in next year’s class then it would make sense.
I love Tyler Wilson, but that’s because I have been calling the Hogs for as long as I can remember! Woo Pig!
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
I don’t see how they can rate anyone realistically available (i.e. not Luck) higher than RG3 right now. Next year, the year after. All signs point to the Bills needing RG3 and not understanding the reward involved.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 11:52 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I agree
I am just trying to rationalize how someone could disagree. I think people that are so worried about losing draft picks are kind of caught up in the sexiness and show of the draft. The draft is fun and is important to building a team, but you MUST have a franchise quarterback if you are serious about contending. We can have all the CJ Spillers, Marcell Dareus’s, Eric Wood’s and Aaron Maybin’s we want. Even if all of those guys were studs we would still need a franchise quarterback.
I know you agree, it is just frustrating. If they don’t get a QB this year and ignore it again next year I might take up golf like someone said above!
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
by hoosier3 on Mar 1, 2012 12:07 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I wish the Spiller thing never happened. It’s been a huge measuring stick for both Nix and Gailey. Nix for drafting a guy who’s not built to handle the burden of the NFL and Gailey for not wanting to play him.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:33 PM EST up reply actions
Great comment, Rec'd
(I’ve pretty much rec’d all Afghan & hoosier3 comments in this thread, by the way…I totally agree on the QB issue)
"WHEN THE WAGON BLASTER TAKES OFF dont try to get in. THE SPACESES ARE LIMITED FOR WINNING ATTITUDE GODZILLA IS COMING GET READY" - abayarde
by StroudFanClub on Mar 1, 2012 4:17 PM EST up reply actions
You and I are birds of a feather on this blog.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 2, 2012 10:23 AM EST up reply actions
my pov
… is that you can’t realistically say that RG3 is better than, say, the combination of Michael Floyd and Landry Jones. Don’t fall in love with one guy bc he’s fast and can throw. There will be other fast guys who can throw.
RG3 is very light too.....
I wonder if he is going to be injury prone….
PodunkO - The great post ender!
He’ll be fine once he enters an NFL training regimen.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 2, 2012 10:24 AM EST up reply actions
Its funny
How the whole crippling the future by trading all of our pics is such a strong argument, but the Saints did that to get Ricky Williams, which wasnt worth it and it did cripple them, but they have made the playoffs, and won a superbowl since then, while the Bills have barely made the playoffs. So, maybe not being able to pick, and relying on FA to build would actually benefit the Bills, since their Drafts prior to Buddy have been sub par.
Yes, but how many years after did it take? That’s the question.. If we give away the next six years to get a player..? Are we helping or hurting ourselves..
I dont Know Joe, Even if the Jets were Battling Hitler for control of the free world..i still probably wouldn't root for the Jets
by Stabby Mcshank on Mar 1, 2012 3:13 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
My response to the title of this post is...
Nix and the Bills damn well should be.
Colin Brown...Pancreas Yellow...
I said something else in my head, which was more of a direct remark in Buddy’s general direction.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:36 PM EST up reply actions
Draft picks.....
People have argued whether the, “you have to keep your draft pick,” guys were right or not for decades.
But now, with the new collective bargaining agreement in place, I think the arguement is over. The, “you have to keep your draft pick,” guys win hands down; no contest.
The NFL spends a little bit more money on players each year and that will still hold true.
However, who gets the money has dramatically shifted from draft picks to successful players (mostly getting their second contract).
With the price of draft dramatically dropping and the price for 26 dramatically rising, it is now imperative you have draft picks to build your team. I think, this point of view, adds even more validity to Nix’s descision not to go for broke in the bidding war for RG3.
Lastly, I think it unfair to look at our past 10 or so draft picks to try and show that number one picks are not worth that much. You can rightfully, only look at Nix’s number one picks.
And I say Dareus and CJ are pretty valuable players…. And I think with Nix’s staff in place for the first time (especially minus “mr. fans are too stupid to correctly guess my genius draft picks modrak” gone). In other words, get ready for our best draft yet…..
Go Bills!
PodunkO - The great post ender!
I think the new draft prices work against your point. The Bills might invest a couple of first round picks, but it won’t cripple them financially like it used to. If they used the second pick on RG3 it would cost them less than 30 million for 4 years (possibly 5, I don’t remember).
You can’t exactly use Dareus in this argument, either. He was the third overall pick and the Bills wouldn’t have to give up another first rounder for the Rams to just move one spot back. If you wouldn’t trade CJ Spiller and Upshaw/Floyd (or someone similar). Two first round picks outside the top 5 aren’t as great as everyone thinks it is.
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
I think....
It will be much more than two first tound picks…. I think the team who ends up with RG3 is going to have two seperate drafts depleted and even picks lost in 2014….. It is going to take a lot of picks I think. Depleting your drafts….. And, as I said, picks, being less expensive now, are far greater in valu.
I do see your points though, although I think cleveland,if they win, will be giving quite a lot to move up two spaces. But, at least, in consulation, signing RG3 is very doable.
We’ll see in Apri…..
PodunkO - The great post ender!
It isn't going to happen
I just wish it was on the table. If they explore it and find that it costs too much, then ok. But to deny trading up without considering all of the options is foolish, in my opinion.
I have the same philosophy with Stevie. He has a worth to this team. If they can get him to sign for that then ok. If he wants too much money then they shouldn’t overspend just for the sake of keeping him. Hopefully Buddy can get it done, but if it will hurt the team in the long run then they shouldn’t do it.
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
by hoosier3 on Mar 1, 2012 1:45 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Spiller is like a set of hand warmers for your boots during cold games. Dareus may very well be great, but even the greatest DT/NT don’t pick the franchise up and bring unimaginable success with them.
I think Eric Wood is their best draft pick in recent years.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:43 PM EST up reply actions
levitre’s played more games at more positions and at least as well as Wood
byrd’s been to more pro bowls than both of them combined (not hard, i know)
if hairston starts a full season at either tackle spot he’s in the conversation too (based on draft value)
I have to admit I didn’t realize Byrd made the Pro Bowl.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 2, 2012 10:25 AM EST up reply actions
Arrrgghhh....
Crap, forgot to edit above…sorry.
It is hard to edit on a Ipad IMHO…..
PodunkO - The great post ender!
Yes
Trading up would cost a lot and losing those picks would hurt a little bit. But on the other hand we’d finally have a franchise qb!! Now some people may not be sold on griffin and that’s ok, then I understand why you wouldn’t want to make this move. But to me I’d be willing to give up our first 3 picks this year and hell our first 3 next year if that’s what it took to get him. I’m sold on the kid and think he will be a special talent in te nfl. We could always plug holes and upgrade positions in free agency for the next couple years. The biggest piece of the puzzle will finally be on our roster. Now nobody knows for sure how good he will be but I’m convinced from what I’ve seen of him that he will be either the top or among the top 3 qbs in the nfl over the next 10-15 years. It’s a shame it won’t be as a bill though.
"I promise you, ... When I come back, I'm going to be like a mad dog in a meat house." -Takeo Spikes
by panekattack on Mar 1, 2012 12:35 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I just really hope he doesn't wind up
In our division. That would be a disaster.
"I promise you, ... When I come back, I'm going to be like a mad dog in a meat house." -Takeo Spikes
cost of trading up
i think what a lot of people are missing here is that the bills would have to give up even more than teams like cleveland, miami, and washington to acquire this pick. Cleveland honestly has this is the bag if they want it(which everyone thinks they do) because they are only picking 2 spots behind the rams and they have two first rounders they can give them THIS YEAR. If you were the rams what would you do? trade with the browns and only move back 2 spots and pick up another first round pick in the same draft, or trade with the bills and fall all the way back to 10 and not receive another first rounder till next year. because of this if the bills actually wanted to move up, they would probably have to double the reported amount the rams are seeking.
by nickjangles on Mar 1, 2012 12:54 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
The bid for RG3.....
Has the potential to get nutty, no doubt about it. If all three teams fall in love with the guy, and if there is yet another, it’ll be wacky compensation to the Rams….
PodunkO - The great post ender!
What about free agents?
Plus we have not had much luck getting free agents into Buffalo. Give up draft picks and it’s doubly hard getting players here.
And finally maybe next year enough teams will either have an established quarterback or have recently drafted one that there won’t be such a scramble to move up in the draft.
by Bill Frank on Mar 1, 2012 2:30 PM EST via mobile reply actions
There will always be a ton of teams in need of a franchise QB.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 1, 2012 2:47 PM EST up reply actions
I read that the Pats were the mystery team
Belichick was trying to get the #2 pick so that they could (you guessed it) flip it for even more picks. Which is pretty annoying unless they actually want RG3 for the future, but that’s not what I read.
I would love the Bills to trade down a bit. Dark horse: Trade #10 and probably another pick for the Bengals #17 and #21. The Bengals are looking to trade up for Richardson, which makes sense. Anyways, at #17 and #21, we could probably get the WR we covet (Floyd) and maybe someone like Cordy Glenn or Kirkpatrick if he falls miraculously.
Please, Buddy Nix, recognize Michael Floyd's talent..
I really would be very happy with this situation
I dont Know Joe, Even if the Jets were Battling Hitler for control of the free world..i still probably wouldn't root for the Jets
by Stabby Mcshank on Mar 1, 2012 3:20 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Sorry, got cut off between posting this.. If we traded down got their two first and maybe a third from them.. We would be in great shape two first, an early second, two thirds and two fourths would put us in position to lock down a few starters and maybe some good depth
I dont Know Joe, Even if the Jets were Battling Hitler for control of the free world..i still probably wouldn't root for the Jets
by Stabby Mcshank on Mar 1, 2012 3:24 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Glad to see he wants to trade down.
It would be awesome to trade our 1st down and get an extra 1st.
Mario Williams.
Cornelius Bennett & Andrew Luck
1) Weren’t the Bills coming off a 4-12 season, and gave up 2 #1 picks to get Bennett? I’m not saying the Bills should trade up to get RGIII, but the circumstances appear to be similar.
2) Why so much talk about RGIII and the Rams? Why not Indy and Andrew Luck? Make them an offer they can’t refuse?
Buddy doesn't make offer you can't refuse....
he refuses offers before they are made
"Ability may get you to the top, but it takes character to keep you there." - John Wooden
"Do not repeat the tactics which have gained you one victory, but let your methods be regulated by the infinite variety of circumstances." - Sun Tzu
by Joe P. on Mar 1, 2012 5:58 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Not always. Sometimes he just sleeps through the incoming calls.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 2, 2012 10:26 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I would trade up
I think this guy is going to be very good maybe great! What do the Bills have to lose anyway, we have already been out of the playoffs for over a decade and counting. I would trade up for him. With a QB, you have a chance to be great!
by Buffalo Bills Forever! on Mar 1, 2012 8:42 PM EST reply actions
Exactly. How is risking a few more losing seasons any worse than where they’re at now? I think many of us know that not trying to get one of these highly rated QBs means there’s little reason to think their fortunes change any time soon.
I don’t care about the loss of picks. It’s less money they have to tie up in drafted players and more they can use to sign Mario Williams.
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 2, 2012 10:28 AM EST up reply actions
For Luck...
then maybe I’d be happy with trading picks, but not so much for RGIII considering we are in the 10 spot. I’d much rather look forward to either picking the players at where we stand in the draft or trading down.
Given your preference, what players do you like more, or at least enough to be comfortable with them being a Bill more than Griffin?
"Son. People can see you!"
by TheAfghanTwilight on Mar 2, 2012 10:29 AM EST up reply actions
Heck
I’m down with giving all of RW’s money to whomever it takes to be relevant again, sorry RW:)
Record Setting Play-Off Drought. On The Bright Side, It's Another Record For This Franchise. :)
by buffalobacker on Mar 2, 2012 11:13 PM EST up reply actions
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